Looks like Stats have no relevance in battles anymore

[Tony81]

equipment is now king, worth as much if not more than units. I say more because I can check an opponents unit strength through the game profile page, whereas we now have no FN clue what equipment they are packing. So the game dynamic of attack and defence has become a mystery black box that completely devalues unit strength.

Given all that, why would I pursue even more deflated unit bonuses with gold when there are already plenty of examples on the forums that 2 points of unknown, unpredictable equipment strength outweighs 20Bn points of unit strength? Where is the incentive to keep chasing that goal now? I'll now be reserving gold for those items that allow me to collect equipment more rapidly (energy regen etc).

I would have thought that was a simple concept to follow.

I'm active. What 'player B' has done or will do has no hearing on how I play the game. I don't need to worry about what equipment someone will have because I more than likely have the same or very close to it. And even if I didnt, I welcome back defensive wins with wide open arms and a smile. HELLO STRATEGY!

The same people griping about the equipment also moan about skill points not working. We have NEVER known what someone's skill points were before an attack. So here ya go... a working "skill point" system you can change in the fly. Again... STRATEGY!

I can't convince you to play a way you are uncomfortable or unfamiliar with so I'll just end with what I've been saying all along... If you don't want to play the game, quit. This IS the game now and no matter what the forum-moaners say, this will be good for the game.

/rant over

[Tony81]

Also, comparing a 3 attack to an 8 defense will affect an outcome a lot more than having a 79 attack face a 85 defense. This is about percentages. Screaming "unfair" is quite... unfair to the new system.

[Danger Mouse]

I'm active. What 'player B' has done or will do has no hearing on how I play the game. I don't need to worry about what equipment someone will have because I more than likely have the same or very close to it. And even if I didnt, I welcome back defensive wins with wide open arms and a smile. HELLO STRATEGY!

The same people griping about the equipment also moan about skill points not working. We have NEVER known what someone's skill points were before an attack. So here ya go... a working "skill point" system you can change in the fly. Again... STRATEGY!

I can't convince you to play a way you are uncomfortable or unfamiliar with so I'll just end with what I've been saying all along... If you don't want to play the game, quit. This IS the game now and no matter what the forum-moaners say, this will be good for the game.

/rant over

Dude. Strangely enough we are closer to agreement than anything else. All I'm saying is that my STRATEGY will be, in a world of finite resources available to spend on a game, to pursue equipment strength over yet more devalued bonus units. Now that Gree has cut the value of each unit in half in terms of gameplay outcomes, they need to ramp up the prizes to get me to rethink that strategy.
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See, we agree. Don't know what got your panties in a twist?

[Tony81]

Nothing really. I just like to argue things that don't make sense to me. Haha.

If you are only saying that you will have to decide where gold is being spent, that's understandable. Saying stats are irrelevant is not true though. And saying equipment is the new king is just as untrue. If everyone believes this and quits, who will I get to beat up on?

5.0 already works much better than 4.anything. And I don't see any reason to believe the equipment feature isn't working as intended. People are losing to me that have half the equipment I do. If those numbers were 5,000 to 2,500, everyone would understand. Attacks are now A/D+B+C vs. A/D+B+C not just my "A" vs. your "D".

Just give it time and I bet everyone will have fun with a new aspect of the game.

[Danger Mouse]

Nothing really. I just like to argue things that don't make sense to me. Haha.

If you are only saying that you will have to decide where gold is being spent, that's understandable. Saying stats are irrelevant is not true though. And saying equipment is the new king is just as untrue. If everyone believes this and quits, who will I get to beat up on?

5.0 already works much better than 4.anything. And I don't see any reason to believe the equipment feature isn't working as intended. People are losing to me that have half the equipment I do. If those numbers were 5,000 to 2,500, everyone would understand. Attacks are now A/D+B+C vs. A/D+B+C not just my "A" vs. your "D".

Just give it time and I bet everyone will have fun with a new aspect of the game.

I only say that equipment will be king as it has become a real ace up the sleeve. While unit stats are relatively transparent, and skill points irrelevant, the equipment points will be a complete unknown where even the slightest advantage in hidden equipment points do have the potential to completely ruin someone's day that would otherwise have, and previously did have, a massive and unbeatable advantage in A over D, as you say. B + C with small but telling differences will trump massive A vs D differences regular enough that it makes it a far more worthwhile strategy to keep the equipment gap on your side than it is to try and close massive unit stats gaps. Playing the odds in a game where there are already massive unit stats gaps, but we all start fresh on equipment.
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So, where I will spend my finite resources of gold will go towards that goal, unless Gree offer units and bonuses again to the less-than-high-flyers ibn the middle ranks that help to close that massive unit stats gap and make that strategy worth pursuing. The present units they do offer don't make enough of an incremental change to be worth spending hard currency to pursue, that gap will never be closed enough to matter at that rate when maintaining the equipment inventory will have such a greater impact on outcomes.
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Gree have tried something new, but completely and massively devalued unit stats as a result of the new equation and starting fresh on equipment. They have brought the big stats old timers down to everyone else's level and made them within reach again, or at least less omnipotent, and I bet they aren't happy about that.

[Tony81]

Dude, Go get the equipment... for free. Gree isn't devaluing stats, it's adding another aspect to fighting.

If the old timers decide to sit on their hands griping about equipment instead of going and getting it, they have no one to blame but themselves. I don't care if you have a trunk full of AK47's... If you forget to bring ammo, my 9mm and 7 bullets will win. Go get the ammo and win battles. Your big gun will still win.

You say you understand but then you go right back to complaining. But I'm done. Time to go home from work.

[Z-Infierno]

wonder if we will be losing equipment during attacks? as we do with units

[Danger Mouse]

Dude, Go get the equipment... for free. Gree isn't devaluing stats, it's adding another aspect to fighting.

If the old timers decide to sit on their hands griping about equipment instead of going and getting it, they have no one to blame but themselves. I don't care if you have a trunk full of AK47's... If you forget to bring ammo, my 9mm and 7 bullets will win. Go get the ammo and win battles. Your big gun will still win.

You say you understand but then you go right back to complaining. But I'm done. Time to go home from work.

Dude, it ain't free. There would be extremely few players out there that could finish Masters in the current ILTQ without spending gold to get there. So now they either have to choose - do they go after Masters and the unit boost, or do they go after equipment in Normal and Prestige to equip their army for the same gold spend, or do they spend more gold and go after both. It most certainly ain't free for the overwhelming majority, so choices have to be made. Before, the top players could just do Masters, collect the reward, collect the temp award along the way, and maintain or increase that gap to the herd. Now, while they do masters to get an advantage in A or D, someone else is collecting all the equipment for probably less cost and keeping level with them in B and building an advantage in C with the extra equipment they got from other levels equipping their army - so clawing back the advantage said top player used to enjoy for finishing Masters, unless they spend more to get that equipment as well.

Who doesn't understand how the game works again?

[Tony81]

Dude, it ain't free. There would be extremely few players out there that could finish Masters in the current ILTQ without spending gold to get there. So now they either have to choose - do they go after Masters and the unit boost, or do they go after equipment in Normal and Prestige to equip their army for the same gold spend, or do they spend more gold and go after both. It most certainly ain't free for the overwhelming majority, so choices have to be made. Before, the top players could just do Masters, collect the reward, collect the temp award along the way, and maintain or increase that gap to the herd. Now, while they do masters to get an advantage in A or D, someone else is collecting all the equipment for probably less cost and keeping level with them in B and building an advantage in C with the extra equipment they got from other levels equipping their army - so clawing back the advantage said top player used to enjoy for finishing Masters, unless they spend more to get that equipment as well.

Who doesn't understand how the game works again?

Many people know you from the forums and let's just say it's not fond memories...

I will do normal through 6, masters through 15, and all of prestige for free. But go ahead, please, don't do the same so we can continue to listen to your ranting on the forums about how life is unfair and eventually you'll retire and then sit on the forums posting constantly about how you are the smart one. We're all tired of it. You don't understand the game as much as you think you do and that's why you complain.

Mods, please block me so I don't feel the need to argue with incompetency.

[Danger Mouse]

Many people know you from the forums and let's just say it's not fond memories...

I will do normal through 6, masters through 15, and all of prestige for free. But go ahead, please, don't do the same so we can continue to listen to your ranting on the forums about how life is unfair and eventually you'll retire and then sit on the forums posting constantly about how you are the smart one. We're all tired of it. You don't understand the game as much as you think you do and that's why you complain.

Mods, please block me so I don't feel the need to argue with incompetency.

So why not masters until the bitter end for the unit reward then? Can't afford it? Decided that other things had higher priority maybe?
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Thanks for proving my point.
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By the way, you do realise there's nothing more telling about an argument lost than going the personal attack rather than talk to any of the points raised with a counter argument. "Oh yeah, that may be, but you smell bad!". impressive argument skills.

[Bob Belcher]

You 2 really need to get your own room!
FYI: people aren't having fun with it. Check Kof A forum, nothing is any better!

[Tony81]

so why not masters until the bitter end for the unit reward then? Can't afford it? Decided that other things had higher priority maybe?
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thanks for proving my point.
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by the way, you do realise there's nothing more telling about an argument lost than going the personal attack rather than talk to any of the points raised with a counter argument. "oh yeah, that may be, but you smell bad!". Impressive argument skills.

ha! Ha! Ha!

[King Fox]

Many people know you from the forums and let's just say it's not fond memories...

I will do normal through 6, masters through 15, and all of prestige for free. But go ahead, please, don't do the same so we can continue to listen to your ranting on the forums about how life is unfair and eventually you'll retire and then sit on the forums posting constantly about how you are the smart one. We're all tired of it. You don't understand the game as much as you think you do and that's why you complain.

Mods, please block me so I don't feel the need to argue with incompetency.

Amen! Well said.

[Danger Mouse]

Amen! Well said.

Oh, now I'm hurt. I may even pout.

[Ozymandias]

The only thing that this makes less transparent is initial everyday PvP attacks or raids... Although it's unclear why you would be doing those anyway now, and if you did, surely you'd quickly work out different players invisible strength, just as you work out who has a big iph and weaker stats today.

During war, you'd scout out, and presumably docbot would hold records of, both equipment stats... So you'd quickly have the same level of transparency as today. although the more strategic teams would presumably play around with their equipment during war.