Blood Bowl LXVIII PvP Tournament!

[Blowin Smoke]

Cj is replying so we will have answers soon

He had second thoughts

[CJ54]

Okay guys, we're listening on this one, so I want to make sure that we're hearing the right things. If people can keep this tuned to constructive suggestions, that will help (there's a lot of "this stinks, bring back the old way" with no other details, in the last ten pages. That doesn't help.).

Firstly, design goals. We hear a lot of concerns about the number of events going on, and the involvement required for those events. The design goal for this one was specifically to have a lighter, more fun and relaxed event that had a low barrier to participation, and we figured this fit the general theme of the "big game weekend" going in in the States this weekend. Something clean, glitch-free that you could do while sitting around munching on snacks and watching the game (if that is your thing, if not, still a lighter event). That's the main reason for the lack of syndicate/individual leaderboard aspect, although I hear you guys when you say that is what you want out of an event like this.

There are also technical limitations to the leaderboard aspect. The old pvp events of yore were usually done in a very "hacky" way in the background that involved no visible leaderboard and a logging/ script combo used to determine winners after the fact. That method was fraught with potential technical weirdness, especially with the involvement of syndicates/factions (that was one of the reasons we hadn't had one of these in awhile) and again we wanted something fun and glitch-free this time.

A lot of the other frustration in here seems to be due to the recent rivals list change, if I am reading things correctly, which really deserves its own thread (as it impacts peoples' enjoyment of the event but is not the event itself).

Are there any other points that I am missing in regard to the event structure and what people would like to see? Again, please keep it constructive.

[tgreen]

My biggest issue(s) would indeed be tied to the rival list first and foremost. Everybody is either "too beat up to fight" or 10-15-20 million above my attack level. So there is nobody for me to hit.

Secondly, I have over 100-150 news feed items. I am getting hit every other second.

[Blowin Smoke]

Cj54 the prizes for the involvement needed is terrible. And as you mentioned, the lack of a syndicate goal and a leaderboard makes me want to sit this one out.

[eleosrincon]

Every one in my list has the same stats as me and I don't want to give them a way to my hood to take my money.

[Nighteg]

Okay guys, we're listening on this one, so I want to make sure that we're hearing the right things. If people can keep this tuned to constructive suggestions, that will help (there's a lot of "this stinks, bring back the old way" with no other details, in the last ten pages. That doesn't help.).

Firstly, design goals. We hear a lot of concerns about the number of events going on, and the involvement required for those events. The design goal for this one was specifically to have a lighter, more fun and relaxed event that had a low barrier to participation, and we figured this fit the general theme of the "big game weekend" going in in the States this weekend. Something clean, glitch-free that you could do while sitting around munching on snacks and watching the game (if that is your thing, if not, still a lighter event). That's the main reason for the lack of syndicate/individual leaderboard aspect, although I hear you guys when you say that is what you want out of an event like this.

There are also technical limitations to the leaderboard aspect. The old pvp events of yore were usually done in a very "hacky" way in the background that involved no visible leaderboard and a logging/ script combo used to determine winners after the fact. That method was fraught with potential technical weirdness, especially with the involvement of syndicates/factions (that was one of the reasons we hadn't had one of these in awhile) and again we wanted something fun and glitch-free this time.

A lot of the other frustration in here seems to be due to the recent rivals list change, if I am reading things correctly, which really deserves its own thread (as it impacts peoples' enjoyment of the event but is not the event itself).

Are there any other points that I am missing in regard to the event structure and what people would like to see? Again, please keep it constructive.

1) We hate the new rivals list. BRING BACK THE OLD ONE.
2) We want the regular PvP event. BRING BACK THE OLD ONE.

[cooch]

Okay guys, we're listening on this one, so I want to make sure that we're hearing the right things. If people can keep this tuned to constructive suggestions, that will help (there's a lot of "this stinks, bring back the old way" with no other details, in the last ten pages. That doesn't help.).

Firstly, design goals. We hear a lot of concerns about the number of events going on, and the involvement required for those events. The design goal for this one was specifically to have a lighter, more fun and relaxed event that had a low barrier to participation, and we figured this fit the general theme of the "big game weekend" going in in the States this weekend. Something clean, glitch-free that you could do while sitting around munching on snacks and watching the game (if that is your thing, if not, still a lighter event). That's the main reason for the lack of syndicate/individual leaderboard aspect, although I hear you guys when you say that is what you want out of an event like this.

There are also technical limitations to the leaderboard aspect. The old pvp events of yore were usually done in a very "hacky" way in the background that involved no visible leaderboard and a logging/ script combo used to determine winners after the fact. That method was fraught with potential technical weirdness, especially with the involvement of syndicates/factions (that was one of the reasons we hadn't had one of these in awhile) and again we wanted something fun and glitch-free this time.

A lot of the other frustration in here seems to be due to the recent rivals list change, if I am reading things correctly, which really deserves its own thread (as it impacts peoples' enjoyment of the event but is not the event itself).

Are there any other points that I am missing in regard to the event structure and what people would like to see? Again, please keep it constructive.

1. Seems for most the RL is refreshing the 90% same rivals even after 5 refreshes

2. Rivals List for many, especially above lvl 175, you have set what we see Defenses at our level or 25%+ higher for 90% of list (look not precise estimate but many in chats off line are commenting)

3. What rivals you can beat are "dead" because they have been attacked the max. What is the refresh time for "dead" rivals. Is it an hour like normal times or 1/2 hour?

4. You combine these facts you have most people trying either to find a suitable rival looking at 20 or more hoods or a rival that can be PVP with the same amount of refreshing.

The "dead" rivals has always been a situation as part of any PVP event. But this time because you don't have the breadth of rival strength it is a big problem. The depth of rival list is fine, more than past PVP, but your restrictions set on RL matchups will continue to make PVP events a frustrating issue for many.

Hope that is constructing, not whining, and explains what we are seeing across Top 100s etc

Whether your team likes it or not CJ the new changes to RL negatively affects PVP events not making it more exciting. That was pretty obvious to me when launched.

Even those all for the changes to be able to rob hoods, based on comments from those few, seem to indicate they are having trouble or don't like implications for PVP. Fact not whining.

[steamboatwilly]

I spend 10 minutes looking for a rival cause they are all beat up or the def is way above my attack. It's just not worth the effort to put in to get nothing back. Good try but back to the drawing board.

[montecore]

Okay guys, we're listening on this one, so I want to make sure that we're hearing the right things. If people can keep this tuned to constructive suggestions, that will help (there's a lot of "this stinks, bring back the old way" with no other details, in the last ten pages. That doesn't help.).

Firstly, design goals. We hear a lot of concerns about the number of events going on, and the involvement required for those events. The design goal for this one was specifically to have a lighter, more fun and relaxed event that had a low barrier to participation, and we figured this fit the general theme of the "big game weekend" going in in the States this weekend. Something clean, glitch-free that you could do while sitting around munching on snacks and watching the game (if that is your thing, if not, still a lighter event). That's the main reason for the lack of syndicate/individual leaderboard aspect, although I hear you guys when you say that is what you want out of an event like this.

There are also technical limitations to the leaderboard aspect. The old pvp events of yore were usually done in a very "hacky" way in the background that involved no visible leaderboard and a logging/ script combo used to determine winners after the fact. That method was fraught with potential technical weirdness, especially with the involvement of syndicates/factions (that was one of the reasons we hadn't had one of these in awhile) and again we wanted something fun and glitch-free this time.

A lot of the other frustration in here seems to be due to the recent rivals list change, if I am reading things correctly, which really deserves its own thread (as it impacts peoples' enjoyment of the event but is not the event itself).

Are there any other points that I am missing in regard to the event structure and what people would like to see? Again, please keep it constructive.

Here is another gift to Gree regarding the rivals list algorithm: During PVP events, and preferably all the time, only display rivals that aren't in a cool down. Very simple. Whatever you're using now, if it returns 20 names and 18 can't be hit, run it again until you have 20 that can actually be attacked or robbed.

As it stands now, we hit refresh, attack each person, and find that they can't be attacked. Each refresh tends to yield the same 15 people with 5 new ones who typically can't be hit either.

During regular game play it's an issue, because we all see the same 40 people. Which means they've already all been robbed by my teammates. Which means we can't rob anyone.

Cliff's notes: Serve up a RL where everyone can be attacked/robbed and 90% of the issues go away.

[aron]

Launch it with the syn/indi goals and add this pvp ltq to it you would have 5 pages of thanks rather than 11 pages of this sux

[CJ54]

My biggest issue(s) would indeed be tied to the rival list first and foremost. Everybody is either "too beat up to fight" or 10-15-20 million above my attack level. So there is nobody for me to hit.

Secondly, I have over 100-150 news feed items. I am getting hit every other second.

Those are some valid concerns for an event like this and in general. The "too beat up to fight" one is actually something that we hear every time we have had a pvp event (including the old ones), just because everyone is attacking everyone else. We raised the "beaten up" threshhold, which also caused its own series of complaints. The newsfeed spam similarly came up in past events, but some of the potential cures are worse than the disease.

[CCKallDAY]

A lot of the other frustration in here seems to be due to the recent rivals list change, if I am reading things correctly, which really deserves its own thread (as it impacts peoples' enjoyment of the event but is not the event itself).

Are there any other points that I am missing in regard to the event structure and what people would like to see? Again, please keep it constructive.

Yes, the rivals list is the big deal. I'm happy with everything in this event, just the rivals list is the annoying part, i keep seeing the same people over and over on my rivals list and they are all beat up. I had to refresh several times to find a target that was beatable.

[montecore]

Those are some valid concerns for an event like this and in general. The "too beat up to fight" one is actually something that we hear every time we have had a pvp event (including the old ones), just because everyone is attacking everyone else. We raised the "beaten up" threshhold, which also caused its own series of complaints. The newsfeed spam similarly came up in past events, but some of the potential cures are worse than the disease.

So stop populating the rivals list with "beaten up" players.

[CC Gangsta]

CJ - thanks for your time replying, but if you read back carefully you will get the gist of all the current problems and concerns.
The MOST important one that needs addressing is the current Rival List problem. Currently we have the same 20-25 people on our rival lists (been like this for around a week now) and they are all beat up. So we now have a "lite" event that no one can participate in or attack people to even get close to the ridiculous 3500 wins for a less than appetising prize.

Please fix the RL issues ASAP and consider adding a defence Mod to the grand prize.

[CJ54]

Cj54 the prizes for the involvement needed is terrible. And as you mentioned, the lack of a syndicate goal and a leaderboard makes me want to sit this one out.

I hear you. There are potentially conflicting design goals between the different ways you can do one of these, and I can understand wanting to marshal the syndicate for more freeform pvp than is found in a Bay City event.

Every one in my list has the same stats as me and I don't want to give them a way to my hood to take my money.

Some things involve risk.

So stop populating the rivals list with "beaten up" players.

Especially during a pvp event, that state can (and does) change between the time someone is on your list and when you press the attack button.