You did it to yourselves - why the LTQ is so much harder

You all want to complain about this LTQ being to hard, cost to much, to much xp and not enough raw gains. In the end, all you that talk about "Preststaging" prior to the start of the LTQ made it this hard. What did you think would happen. Exploits are against the rules of the game. Prestaging is an exploit. So thank you to all you that couldn't keep your mouths shut about what you do.

To say its not an exploit picture this:

You have a list of every DL for every faction. You are then able to hit all of them 7 times, so when you see them in war it only takes one hit to drop them.

What if you can start hitting other factions walls before the war starts, so when you see them in the war it just takes one hit from your weakest player to drop the level 10 wall.


On the other hand its Gree's fault. Why can't you put in the game a way to erase the prestaging that others have done to stop prestaging and make the LTQ's like they used to be.

[QUOTE=ProCision;787729]You all want to complain about this LTQ being to hard, cost to much, to much xp and not enough raw gains. In the end, all you that talk about "Preststaging" prior to the start of the LTQ made it this hard. What did you think would happen. Exploits are against the rules of the game. Prestaging is an exploit. So thank you to all you that couldn't keep your mouths shut about what you do.


I agree. Too many blabbermouths led to the toning down of an ltq event that once gave very powerful units and was fun to finish till the end.

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Originally Posted by ProCision

You all want to complain about this LTQ being to hard, cost to much, to much xp and not enough raw gains. In the end, all you that talk about "Preststaging" prior to the start of the LTQ made it this hard. What did you think would happen. Exploits are against the rules of the game. Prestaging is an exploit. So thank you to all you that couldn't keep your mouths shut about what you do.

To say its not an exploit picture this:

You have a list of every DL for every faction. You are then able to hit all of them 7 times, so when you see them in war it only takes one hit to drop them.

What if you can start hitting other factions walls before the war starts, so when you see them in the war it just takes one hit from your weakest player to drop the level 10 wall.


On the other hand its Gree's fault. Why can't you put in the game a way to erase the prestaging that others have done to stop prestaging and make the LTQ's like they used to be.

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Wrong. Its called bait and switch. Get people hooked then reduce the gains so they have to keep doing it.

Prestaging is guessing and carries full costs/xp. It might impact Gree from time to time but their game is setup that way. KA doesnt have prestaging because they add new mobs on the screen. If Gree wants to prevent it get of their lazy b**** and code it.

Yes this trick of prestaging should have been kept away from this forum,

It's extremely unlikely that Gree wouldn't have noticed this possibility on their own - talking about it here wouldn't have made any difference.

It's just speculation. I would tend to agree that Gree have now made it much too hard to complete, though

What I feel is pre-staging isn't against the rules, its real energy you spend, real xp you gain, then why is it against the rules? People who use gold will always go all the way to prestige, non-gold user can not go far in prestige mode even with pre-staging. Remember, you are gaining xp with pre-staging and with LTQ, that will make you level up faster. This event is energy hogger, its like completing whole mission in each step.

It is much harder. pre-staging to me was a form of cheating. I was hoping that instead of making the event harder, Gree would just do a re-set on the LTQ mission to put everything back to zero. Another method was to just come up with specialty maps just for LTQ. Would peak everybodies interest, new places they have never been before.

I've been pre-staging since the first ltq. Never posted a word about it until now. Some things are better left unsaid.

Do I think presaging is 100% the reason this event got nerfed? No. GREE and funzio have always nerfed everything. So this is just more of the same. It's probably better the way it is now because the old ltqs would eventually make the game very unbalanced

Well, now you will have a lot of folks sitting out LTQs.

So, if Gree is trying to make the players *not* play the game, then it's working....but that seems to be missing the point.

Pre staging isn't cheating, its like saying studying for a test is cheating. You still end up with the same XP gain and energy expenditure. Besides, you're either a free player or a spender, dedicated free players isn't going to spend money so they can get that shiny new unit.

Even if you get a few extra units by prestaging, so what? You just leveled up heaps and that is more of a disadvantage then advantage. What's the rule of thumb for attack and defence, 1000x your level? I leveled 5 times in the hunt for the first strike tomcat, and I certainly didn't get close to 5k worth of stats.

Why would you not want to sit out an event? With WD being so close together, it seems I am always on my ipad or iphone. Looking at an LTQ and making a choice not to participate is equally as great as feeling as participating and getting a +20% regen. The latter I feel I *have* to get, and I work my butt off to get it. A lot of people post off the hip, and get other people fired up, which leads to hilarious, yet very stupid threads.

Take a break this week, enjoy it. The past 3 WD events have been crazy enough, no need to bash each other in the process.

The idea about specialty maps is a much better one than resetting the LTQ maps to zero because you may have players who are trying to complete map missions and cause them to lose progress. Some of the tasks take as many as 13 hits (possibly more as this is the highest I've come across). When that many hits are needed, players are going to have to take time to regen their health or use gold to get all the hits in at once. I don't see anyone using gold to regen health just to complete a mission that isn't part of an LTQ. So it wouldn't be fair to those players to make them repeat certain actions. But these LTQ also aren't fair in the sense that there are players may want to participate but cannot simply because their level isn't high enough and are essentially being ignored. I get that some people choose to camp and build up their income first, but there are new players that may begin the game thinking that completing missions and leveling up is the best way to play the game, not knowing any different. Everyone should be given the chance to at least participate and go as far as they can. If maps aren't already unlocked, they could at least unlock them for the LTQ to allow them to participate. I know there are higher level players as well who have no chance of completing normal mode simply because their unit buildings aren't high enough levels yet because it wasn't a priority to them. If they didn't take the time to upgrade them that is their loss.

You talk about exploiting the game. I know in old thread there was discussion as to whether or not camping was a form of cheating or exploiting the game. Most people just thought it was a strategy employed with a long term goal in mind, but I know there was one guy who was adamant that it was a form of cheating and the game was not meant to be played that way. People choose how to play this game and employ the strategy they think is best. Some people camp, some choose to use gold, etc. So there are going to be differing opinions on what constitutes cheating/exploitation of the game. The only thing that people can probably agree constitutes cheating is hacking. If Gree wants to prevent prestaging of these LTQ, the specialty maps is probably the best way to do it because everybody starts at zero, and it won't affect players that are trying to complete map missions. The LTQ could then be open to any player as well regardless of level. Their progress will be based on whether or not they have the units/energy necessary to complete the missions.

Yea, you can't just reset the LTQ missions, what about the people who are legitimately trying to complete the map and not compete in the LTQ.

I think what Gree did is completely fine. If people dislike the event, they should just sit it out.

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Originally Posted by SGT Rud

It is much harder. pre-staging to me was a form of cheating. I was hoping that instead of making the event harder, Gree would just do a re-set on the LTQ mission to put everything back to zero. Another method was to just come up with specialty maps just for LTQ. Would peak everybodies interest, new places they have never been before.

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Problem with removing prestaged missions is you will also nuke missions a legit player may be working on. Granted Gree do reset some missions and change the requirements of others. In the end though it's a crap shoot unless you prestaged every possible combination in every map. But that is still no guarantee that you will get everything.

Special maps/missions is a very good idea.

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Originally Posted by ProCision

You have a list of every DL for every faction. You are then able to hit all of them 7 times, so when you see them in war it only takes one hit to drop them.

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bit off topic but 8 hits on a dl is a waste as you give up 8 losses better to use 2 power attacks then you only lose 2 fights thus saving 6

Pre-stagin isn't cheating.

The reason the LTQs have been toned down is because the unit prizes from the first couple of LTQs were WAY too powerful compared to the total cost to get them. IMO this is where things should have been all along.

I had stopped doing the boss events and the crate events because the cost of those events compared to the gain was completely out of proportion with what I was able to get from the LTQ event. Now that things have changed i've had to rethink my strategy.

GREE is a for-profit company and their goal is to make money. In order to make money they have to provide a product that people want to pay for. It always has been and always will be a balancing act.

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Originally Posted by Agent Orange

Problem with removing prestaged missions is you will also nuke missions a legit player may be working on. Granted Gree do reset some missions and change the requirements of others. In the end though it's a crap shoot unless you prestaged every possible combination in every map. But that is still no guarantee that you will get everything.

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Nicely said ao, u cant reset maps since it will generate a lot of angry players and more tickets.

But there are things that should be left unsaid and in whispering ear of using pms for these kind of tactics. Now prestaging is a requisite to finish the ltqs. Totally bad for campers

Ultimately it's a strategy game. Prestaging is a tactic, it's available to every1. Hackers r cheating where they hav impossible stats n units. That's a crime n that's cheating.

Going from good ltqs to this terrible one was a bad move, should of levelled it out over a few events.

As for customers keeping secrets, gree has ALL THE INFO. There r no secrets n they will cotton on to it, so ppl should feel free to share their ideas n tactics. It will develop the game as a whole.

I'm a non spender, but I will recommend the game to others who may spend if they offer me a good service, so they need to cater to both spenders n non spenders as they both hav their place.

This event blows n is a slap in the face, I think the events should b completeable for free...but u hav to have a solid background. Say set the ltq at a Lvl hundred or so player with 2000 energy, plus 2 to energy regen could complete it in 6 days as the total energy required would b around 40000. Total possible energy in 6 days with plus 2 to regen would b 43200. Now most ppl wouldn't b able to do this n therefore ppl would still spend. Serious non spenders would hook in n rate the game to their mates n at least hav a shot at completing it provided they hav prestaged. Jus sum food for thought.

This thread is incorrect.

This game is meant to be a strategy game despite what gree has turned it in to. Pre staging is a strategy. It's not an exploit and frankly it's stupid that anybody would say it is. It uses the same total energy and doesn't given anybody some unfair advantage that every single other player doesn't have.

The single thread of strategy left in the game just got wiped out because gree is greedy and doesn't listen to their customers. It has nothing to do with any exploit that this guy may be dreaming of

a forum is the place to share tipps and tricks (not cheats). if we do, gree should not use such against us. maybe this isn´t the right place to share things....

pre-staging is just a strategy in my opinion. and i hit a lot for nothing and left energy on units, that have not been targets. (no complaining, just a fact)

I would not consider presaging cheating even in the slightest. Like someone said, if you study for a test,that's not cheating. And as the player, the player didnt fiddle with anything to change the structure of the ltq. If gree didnt want or allow pre staging, they would stop it. Gree allows it without breaking any rules. As shocking as it may seem to some, gree does still in fact set up parts of their game so that even a free player can enjoy it.

As for the perception that it got nerfed because of it being talked in the forum. Realize that EVERYTHING in this game has gotten nerfed wheather it was talked about or not. It's just what gree does. Know ahead of time whenever something comes out, it always starts out strong but know it will get nerfed no matter what.

I'm personally kinda relieved that this LTQ sucks. I did both of them before Columbia and spent a lot of my gold to do it. I'm enjoying the break this time. I'm doing free hits only. I will not get sucked in to spending more gold and getting more xp to win crappier prizes.

Gree has done an amazing job lately of weaning me off gold in MW:
1. Having CC and MW battles in the same weekend.
2. Losing to players with 1/2 to 2/3 my stats
3. Getting 3 hits from a refill
4. Getting more xp in LTQ's
5. Requiring even more gold in LTQ's
6. Nerfing the prizes in the LTQ's
7. Making bosses 50 instead of 35 (it feels like a chore)

SP, I'm [ ] close to joining you in C&T and going free!

Prestaging is a strategy, not an exploit. That is just silly. Some of us always have higher ends maps "prestaged" or "setting up bosses," as I call it. That particular prestaging helped me pay for ACs and AMRs back in the day. While spending is still and more so the name of the game here, there is some strategic maneuvering still available. That is not exploiting it is gaming in the best sense.

As to the Ltq being nerfed this time, yes, and it's not due to prestaging in my view. Did that help push the Devs, maybe. But they just nerf everything. Manbeast has that right. Either way I doubt a massive repeat of this Ltq as gold spending will likely noticeably drop for forum readers.

I don't think presaging is cheating but I don't think you should talk about options that Gree can take away. The same silence people have with their factions war strategy should be used with Gree. Others forum members want to beat you at a game. To Gree you are the game and they want to beat you.

I agree with the others that pre-staging is not an exploit. It is a valid strategy and is using the game dynamics to prepare yourself as best as possible. Pre-staging missions has NOTHING to do with the current increase in the LTQ in my opinion. It has everything to do with the fact that, once again, Gree over-inflated an event and is back-peddling to get it back into line with the rest of the game.

The WD event boosts are a perfect example. At the start of the WD events, you saw 20-30% unit boosts. Now they're down to 5-10% boosts. They made them too great to start.

The LTQ's made all other gold spending obsolete. No reason to buy 3 crates when spending 175 gold in an LTQ might get you a few more missions in and yield much higher stat units. And why spend 1500-1600 gold on a LE set when it only gets you MAYBE 3-4k more attack/defense when you could spend it in an LTQ and end up with 30-40 units and 4-5 times more return on your money?

It was only a matter of time. Now they've taken corrective action (overly corrective in my opinion). It will balance itself out. I would imagine in the future, LTQ events will have a lower total energy requirement than this one, but yield fewer units that the original events.

So if pre-staging an event (which every player has access to do) is cheating, then all those people who sit on map bosses waiting to hit them one last time for that big upgrade would be cheating too right? I mean they aren't playing the game the way it was intended by doing that. They should have to fight off rivals day in and day out like the rest us while being overvault. Or what about those people who bought hundreds or thousands of trees to sell off as a means of storing cash. Are they cheaters too?

So if I follow that same logic then everyone who bought LE units when they first appeared as a two unit combo set, cheated too? Even though, once again every player had same chance to buy them.

You may not like it but pre-staging wasn't cheating/exploiting. People talking about it on the forum didnt produce this current hard LTQ. Gree saw they weren't getting the return they wanted and made it more expensive. Prestaging or not...they would have been looking to maximize their profit. The first LTQs were only "good" because they contained boost units. That was a mistake on Gree's part in being too lazy to create new units and simply recasting old units without noticing that some had boosts attached.

One final note: Gree if you're listening....then you will already know that no one finds these LTQ events particularly worthwhile unless he/she will receive some boost units. So get to work and provide some incentive for actually spending time and/or money to complete this type event.

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Originally Posted by ProCision

You all want to complain about this LTQ being to hard, cost to much, to much xp and not enough raw gains. In the end, all you that talk about "Preststaging" prior to the start of the LTQ made it this hard. What did you think would happen. Exploits are against the rules of the game. Prestaging is an exploit. So thank you to all you that couldn't keep your mouths shut about what you do.

To say its not an exploit picture this:

You have a list of every DL for every faction. You are then able to hit all of them 7 times, so when you see them in war it only takes one hit to drop them.

What if you can start hitting other factions walls before the war starts, so when you see them in the war it just takes one hit from your weakest player to drop the level 10 wall.


On the other hand its Gree's fault. Why can't you put in the game a way to erase the prestaging that others have done to stop prestaging and make the LTQ's like they used to be.

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100% agree! I can't believe people discussed this pre staging opportunity.

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Originally Posted by NaRciS

100% agree! I can't believe people discussed this pre staging opportunity.

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I was pre-staging after the first LTQ before seeing anything about it on the forums, it's an obvious play to make.

Most of us just got a +2 energy regen unit in the last LTQ. I think the simplest explanation for all of this is that GREE is pushing players to level up, more energy used, more rapidly for more XP. I don't know the numbers, but if the whole event completion is only 40% more energy to complete, then it's as easy/difficult to complete for a free player, and only a small change to what a gold player would need to spend to complete it, unless they're unwilling to wait to see a few normal timed regens.

Change is a constant, deal with it. Looks like we've got faction tournaments coming down the pipes soon too if you've read the release notes on the last update.

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Originally Posted by BigD@wg

So if pre-staging an event (which every player has access to do) is cheating, then all those people who sit on map bosses waiting to hit them one last time for that big upgrade would be cheating too right? I mean they aren't playing the game the way it was intended by doing that. They should have to fight off rivals day in and day out like the rest us while being overvault. Or what about those people who bought hundreds or thousands of trees to sell off as a means of storing cash. Are they cheaters too?

So if I follow that same logic then everyone who bought LE units when they first appeared as a two unit combo set, cheated too? Even though, once again every player had same chance to buy them.

You may not like it but pre-staging wasn't cheating/exploiting. People talking about it on the forum didnt produce this current hard LTQ. Gree saw they weren't getting the return they wanted and made it more expensive. Prestaging or not...they would have been looking to maximize their profit. The first LTQs were only "good" because they contained boost units. That was a mistake on Gree's part in being too lazy to create new units and simply recasting old units without noticing that some had boosts attached.

One final note: Gree if you're listening....then you will already know that no one finds these LTQ events particularly worthwhile unless he/she will receive some boost units. So get to work and provide some incentive for actually spending time and/or money to complete this type event.

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your analogy's are horrible. You can not compare any of those to what i compared it to in the first post of this thread.

I'm not sure I said that prestaging was cheating, maybe I did maybe i didnt. Your exploiting the LTQ for what it is. The more you prestage, the more you talk about it, the more you tell people how to do it. All takes money out of Gree's pocket. I am 100% for any exploit you can do to get a leg up. I was on most of all the leader boards on COD WAW, MW2, and BO and that was from boosting. Using exploits that were built in the game. Nobody knew any different until YouTube came out and people started to post how to boost in call of duty. Now you get banned for doing it. Whats the big deal if you trade head shots with a partner? Its hurts nobody, but in the end you didnt earn the guns and the prestige the way the devs wanted you to earn them. Same for this game, you exploited and now the LTQ is harder. Fact!

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Originally Posted by Miner

It has everything to do with the fact that, once again, Gree over-inflated an event and is back-peddling to get it back into line with the rest of the game.

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This is spot on. First few LTQs were awesome to the point of exploitation. If you did them, be happy you did. If you sat them out, you lost.

I believe this corrective measure was a bit harsh, but I hold out hope Gree will go back to a model closer to the last LTQ (which was still pretty good).

you guys don't get it. of course it's not literally cheating, but the point is you have to look at it from the company's perspective.....seriously how thick are some of you? if you're trying to make money, pre-staging is going to raise a red flag. so while it may not literally be cheating, the company will still find you cheating them of their efforts to earn money. therefore, we can resign to call it cheating, insofar as "cheating" is the reason this change is happening

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Originally Posted by steveo127

you guys don't get it. of course it's not literally cheating, but the point is you have to look at it from the company's perspective.....seriously how thick are some of you? if you're trying to make money, pre-staging is going to raise a red flag. so while it may not literally be cheating, the company will still find you cheating them of their efforts to earn money. therefore, we can resign to call it cheating, insofar as "cheating" is the reason this change is happening

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Cheating or not, I just can't believe that everyone here is so dense that a majority didn't think of the ploy of prestaging on their own; blaming the forum for this is silly.

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Originally Posted by ProCision

You exploited and now the LTQ is harder. Fact!

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I completely disagree with your defenition of a fact or how you came to that conclusion. If CJ decides to post that is the reason they made the event more difficult then i will agree that MIGHT be a fact. An Exploit is not Clearly defined in this game, but by this logic i would say gold is an exploit as it gives SOME players a distict advantage.

In the end its a strategy. There is nothing secretive about it as there is no garuntee that prestaging will get you further. You don't have any inside intel on what maps will have the LTQ before the event starts (well perhaps you do). However unless we are told it's a glitch/exploit i don't see anything wrong and i don't think its the reason we have the more difficult LTQ.

The level of difficulty has nothing to do with people operating a pre-staging strategy and maybe reducing the amount of energy required to complete an LTQ.

The early boss events for MW also had a pattern of increasing difficulty while the optimum point was found. It had nothing to do with the 13 hit strategy that was detailed in the forum as some claimed, rather it was the game providers looking at the data from past results and tinkering to try to find the revenue "sweet spot". The same pattern occurred in both KA and MQ.

With respect to the first few PVE based LTQ's they were, to me, overly generous in comparison to the other events and this is now being corrected.

prestaging is definately not cheating. it's a loophole and every game needs them. if you are smart enough to figure it out use it if not oh well. they shouldnt compensate by making it so you have to prestage and use gold to finish. the bottom line is the money. they make it so even intelligent people cant get through without gold. have you ever had an offline game that had a boss or mission that you just could not beat no matter what? sometimes its the games fault and it should never be the games fault you cant beat it without a " cheat code" so to speak or in this case gold. gold should be more of an easy out like "god mode" not the only way out.

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Originally Posted by steveo127

you guys don't get it. of course it's not literally cheating, but the point is you have to look at it from the company's perspective.....seriously how thick are some of you? if you're trying to make money, pre-staging is going to raise a red flag. so while it may not literally be cheating, the company will still find you cheating them of their efforts to earn money. therefore, we can resign to call it cheating, insofar as "cheating" is the reason this change is happening

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Considering an important factor is that you need to have a very high energy spec to make it even useful. Consider the lower level players with only a few hundred energy. Even with prestaging most would probably make it less then halfway without buying gold for refills. Even those with very high energy and prestaging could not make it through prestige without using gold.

If anything prestaging is going to keep the keen players in the hunt longer because the higher you got the better the payout. I'm certainly going to consider buying and using gold to move further up the levels because the payouts were so good and in fact I did.

It also gave weaker players a very slight glimmer of hope but again depending on your level and unit buildings you could have been snookered.

If prestaging was such a big issue then the logical move would have been to create new missions specifically for these events. What are the odds a beta tester figured that out and mentioned it. But I would suspect that the devs just took the easy way out and recycled things including the boosted units which appears to have been a mistake according to CJ.

In the end I would actually think prestaging would increase sales because the value for your investment was high.

But with this version of the event I didn't buy gold nor am I really going to use much since the payout is marginal.

And the real moral to all of this is that if you see a good deal take it because this apps track record is to reduce payouts over time as folks get addicted.

What increased difficulty actually did was neutralize the +2 energy regen bonus.

IMHO, I think I is GREE messing with people who map an event, like devin.

GREE publishes nothing of the event. Other the. AN INCORRECT start time and finish.

When someone maps it out for all to see they don't like it. This is payback. And they aimed it at devin. Hence the name of the unit name!

PLAY FREE! Hit the where it hurts.

And devin, if I ever meet ya, I would gladly buy you a beer and an iTunes card for all your hard work!

Let's see what happens in the next event? Maybe this is an attempt to slow the unit deflation.

It's not a cheat or an exploit. We didnt " cheat " gree out of money, GREE CHEATED ITSELF if anything.