no one suggested this.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikosuave
no one suggested this.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikosuave
I was referring to your misuse of the word "definition". I couldn't care less what definition of "hacker" you choose to use.Quote:
Originally Posted by (BF) Tuna
Quote:
no one suggested this.
Page 8.Quote:
It's hacking and the players involved need to be banned. In fact it's information theft and authorities need to be informed. We don't know what other info has been stolen. Maybe credit card info which resulted in illegal purchases.
Lawyer up, class action suit on the way!
It really, really seems like you're not reading anything in the thread, just shouting from your soapbox.
In this game 1 cycle old is history, 2 cycles old is ancient.Quote:
BZ what is your definition of not happening for a long time?
Obviously in some matters (ie, chasing down Chinese gold cheats) this doesn't hold, because of the nature of the event in question. But in terms of the potential benefits that data about your profile presents then anything not current is useless. Especially since the parts of the data used that aren't very public already (cash on hand, gold on hand) change significantly in short periods of time.
Thanks for the lesson in semantics.. zzz
And, page 8 was yesterday's read (for myself at least). Pardon me for not retaining what some moron wrote.
Speaking for every player in the game does not help you make your point.Quote:
Originally Posted by bald zeemer
Had it not given the designer an advantage over the average player, it would have never been developed in the first place. So, by default it is altering the game experience, regardless as to whether the player who's data is being extracted is aware. I know that you know this. You are just a stubborn proponent who is unwilling to admit it.Quote:
Originally Posted by bald zeemer
Lastly... Had there been no advantage of extracting such data, the designer wouldn't have wanted to share it with others. (I could be mistaken, but I believe you were one of those who he wished to share it with...)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bald zeemer
I will concede that the information obtained is obsolete at this point but your stating that this has not been practiced for some time is misleading. To me mid July is recent history. If it was still being used just over a month ago i find it hard to believe that it was just suddenly dropped.
It's been out of use for pretty much as long as it was in use.
As we've been saying, there is little to no benefit in using it, which is why it got dropped. It had been used in the cheater chat, but the negatives outweighed the positives and it was abandoned. The key point that I think has often been missed in this thread (especially by anyone who has ever used the phrase "proponents of the database") is that everyone acknowledges that there are severe concerns with it from a privacy standpoint, and that it more or less gives everyone a sour taste in their mouth. The fact that it doesn't actually do much is why those of us saying it's a non-issue are happy to believe (or, in some cases, know for a fact) that it is no longer in use. To those 'on the outside', so to speak, there is apparently the view that this thing is powerful. From that starting point I can see how you would imagine it's still being used. But the starting point is the issue.
At this point it is a privacy issue for me. It is my business how much I have spent on this game. For you to say that it is no longer being used is just simply untrue. You may not be but others still are. The fact is that a member of a top syndicate used some sort of program to intercept and post my information publicly as recently as July.
The fault lies with gree that they are somehow unable to encrypt this data but it also lies with anyone that has utilized this method. I'm glad that you can admit that it left a sour taste in your mouth and maybe you are only referring to the database that was compiled. I don't know for sure.
What I do know is that the methods that were developed to obtain this information are still very much in use. And if it gets ignored it will continue.
@BZ
I'll give you this... If it was designed by a high-end player and was only distributed to high end players, then it would be of little use because, as you've said, you pretty much all know each others stats etc etc... To where it would be obsolete. Unfortunately, you can't say for sure, with 100% certainty, that it hasn't found its way to various other players who could still be using it to their benefit. So please stop speaking for the entirety of this game's players.
It has also been said that, what the average player does in game on a regular basis (be it during Syndicate War or just robbing someone) is roughly the equivalent of what this decyphering program does... The major difference being that, this decyphering does not require the use of in-game resources such as health or stamina. (Oh, and it tells the user a whole bunch of other information that would otherwise be unknown to the average player = advantage... <--- Fact)
Now, I know that most of you top-ranking guys are in syndicates where a lot of intel-sharing is going on.. Which of course would be a more efficient way of avoiding scouting attacks during Synd Wars (granted, Tier3 gold spenders and above, don't really care). However, for a potential syndicate with no intel-sharing sources & no heavy gold spenders willing to waste gold on scouting... This decyphering app could easily turn a top500 team into a top250 team by circumventing the whole need for scouting.
The scenario above may be a "hypothetical" to you... But you're assuming that this program is no longer being used.
I'm pretty sure I've said at least half a dozen times that I never liked the idea. My points were simply that I don't believe it violates TOS (as it currently stands) and I don't believe it is an issue of enough import to deserve response from Gree.Quote:
The fault lies with gree that they are somehow unable to encrypt this data but it also lies with anyone that has utilized this method. I'm glad that you can admit that it left a sour taste in your mouth and maybe you are only referring to the database that was compiled. I don't know for sure.
On the 'current' thing, that's just a terminology issue, then. I consider being used in July, but not since, as "not currently in use". Further statements by myself of "not current" are not intended to imply that it was not being used in July.Quote:
At this point it is a privacy issue for me. It is my business how much I have spent on this game. For you to say that it is no longer being used is just simply untrue. You may not be but others still are. The fact is that a member of a top syndicate used some sort of program to intercept and post my information publicly as recently as July.
On the privacy issue I think the fault definitely lies with Gree and their lax standards on privacy/sensitive info in general. As I've said earlier in the thread I don't think this is actually Gree's #1 poor practice on privacy, but I would certainly like them to fix this up at the same time that they fix up the insane amounts of data they attach to tickets.
The info in tickets can be used nefariously against someone in real life (and in game - cf baddad's scenario). That is clearly the bigger issue.
There are intel sharing groups at your level. They recruit publicly for syndicates to participate. Relatively often, in fact.Quote:
Now, I know that most of you top-ranking guys are in syndicates where a lot of intel-sharing is going on.. Which of course would be a more efficient way of avoiding scouting attacks during Synd Wars (granted gold spenders don't really care). However, for a potential syndicate with no intel-sharing sources & no heavy gold spenders willing to waste gold on scouting... This decyphering app could easily turn a top500 team into a top250 team by circumventing the whole need for scouting.
It requires no stamina whatsoever to visit a hood, check the players profile, and rummage in their inventory. Doing this will give you the vast majority of the information that the database obtained. If you want collection cycles then just visit regularly and note when buildings come up. Again, requiring absolutely no stamina usage whatsoever. And taking pretty much the same time that repeat-bombardment via the data sniffer would take, were anyone to try to use it in this manner.Quote:
t has also been said that, what the average player does in game on a regular basis (be it during Syndicate War or just robbing someone) is roughly the equivalent of what this decyphering program does... The major difference being that, this decyphering does not require the use of in-game resources such as health or stamina.
You ignored the Synd War scouting thing by telling me that intel-sharing occurs at "my level". Don't ignore the program/database's potential advantages in a syndicate war. Okay?
And yes, you're right about traveling to a rival's city and... blah blah blah... You're wrong about the time it would take though. Plus skill point allocation.. I know you guys with million+ atk/def don't care... It is still an advantage to know these things that the average player would otherwise not know.
Also, if you don't see it as an issue and that you're positive it's obsolete & no longer in use.. Why are you still discussing this? Don't you have better things to do than go back and forth with the little fish in the pond?
Also have to add- For supposedly not being a proponent of this database, you sure know a lot about it. More than you're willing to tell I'd bet.
Could be wrong, but I thought to use it in a syndicate war, you'd need to hit the opposing player anyway to capture their info.Quote:
Originally Posted by (BF) Tuna
Edit: this is a really dumb argument, and this topic is 22 pages too long.
You could be wrong considering that player data needs to be sent to both rival syndicates upon being matched to each other. Maybe not so dumb...Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMoney
Edit: This topic has gone 22 pages without an official response from GREE. Which is what I'm most interested in. (Will agree, that's too many)
Unless your stats are 4-figures skill points are irrelevant. Even then it's debatable.Quote:
Plus skill point allocation.. I know you guys with million+ atk/def don't care... It is still an advantage to know these things that the average player would otherwise not know.
I've explained repeatedly in this thread why I talk about it.Quote:
lso, if you don't see it as an issue and that you're positive it's obsolete & no longer in use.. Why are you still discussing this? Don't you have better things to do than go back and forth with the little fish in the pond?
Also have to add- For supposedly not being a proponent of this database, you sure know a lot about it. More than you're willing to tell I'd bet.
And I don't decide who I do and don't talk to based on their stats or their syndicate. You seem hungup on a weird 99%-er vibe, with some big kabal at the top keeping all the little people down or some similar nonsense.
I know about it because it was discussed, at length, by all involved. On the forums. Publicly. I know most of the people behind it and most of the people targeted by it, so I've heard all about it privately, too.
And it is not more than I've let on. Between myself and the other guys in this thread who know what's going on we've given just about as much information about the database as is possible to give. But because this information just reinforces what we're saying you choose to believe that we're hiding all the juicy bits. People love conspiracies, but in the end if you take them at all seriously you're taking the first few dozen steps down a road that leads to excellence in tin-foil hat design.
k thx for the background on how you've been involved with it. Now do this one (and read my reply to BigMoney)
"You ignored the Synd War scouting thing by telling me that intel-sharing occurs at "my level". Don't ignore the program/database's potential advantages in a syndicate war. Okay?"
I didn't ignore it, I've answered it repeatedly within this thread.
Myself and others pointed out that scouting info-sharing is more effective than the database would be, if anyone used it, anyway. So use the real, existing tools that provide the benefits. Don't worry about the hypothetical uses of a non-used tool that would be less effective.
As it stands your concern with the database is that people who don't have it might use it for something it's never been used for to perform an easily performed function to a lesser standard. As I've said time and time again - this is not in the top-10 issues in CC today.
Okay, fine..... Still want Official word from GREE. Regardless as to what it will be.
Two things though,
1.)Anyone who's, in the know answer, is not GREE's answer
2.)A lack of an answer from GREE, does not mean, "It's okay", is their answer.
So I'll leave it at that. Had fun going back & forth with you all & thanks for increasing awareness of this "obsolete & no longer used" tool. Especially, for those of us who weren't on the forum when the initial discussion took place.
(I enjoy being a pest, if that hasn't been made apparent)
In case you missed it in the other thread, transferring accounts between players is a TOS violation.
;)
Yeah, just found out. It was a joke anyways. Might be recruiting this guy tho. Potentially just as good.Quote:
Originally Posted by bald zeemer
As if I'll let you :pQuote:
Originally Posted by (BF) Tuna
lol. you guys did better than us, sooo... I've got nothin to offer anywaysQuote:
Originally Posted by genaks
Really? With those many points to you alone? Weird...Quote:
Originally Posted by (BF) Tuna
Edit : Just saw your rank. 210.
One word- "Inactives"
Okay. I'm done further derailing this thread.
Everyone from top syndicates sharing intel should be banned for modifying gameplay for others.
BF Tuna, if you have that much IP at rank 210, you might want to consider a higher placed syndicate. If your stats are good enough, you can apply for almost every group in the top 25..
The question at hand is not the sharing of intel but how the intel was obtained.......pretty sure you already knew that.Quote:
Originally Posted by mxz
The only time I've seen any mention of a team having intel on a team through any means other than scouting was Solemn Carnage having Rogues' full team and stats before the war ever started. Someone asked that question in one of these marathon threads. Give me an hour or two and I'll find who asked it.
Wow! So most of the top 100 syndicates should be banned then! Great idea! That will solve all the problems with this game then!
I concur. Everyone should be banned for hacking! Only teams that communicate on the in game forum should be spared. But if they post a scouting report on the in game forum...B&!Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistress Nikita
Then "Third party software altering the game experience" would include excel being used to record the stats of your opponent in war, and Kakao and GroupMe being used to communicate those stats to other players who otherwise wouldn't have access to those stats. In conclusion, everyone needs to scout their own targets and not share that information with anyone, or you'll be in violation of TOS!Quote:
Originally Posted by mxz
I think I understand now! Thanks! mxz, you're the balls. (basketballs, nothing sexual there, no TOS violation)
Ugh.. what have I done?.... Teams willingly share intel with each other as a means to increase the points they gain by circumventing the scouting process. There are no hacks, or glitches, or exploits (typically).. they just tell each other all of their members stats..
and yes, I know that the amount of IP I put up could get me into a T25. I am loyal to my team though. There's a much longer story with more details that I don't care to type out though. Plus, its more gratifying to build a solid ship than to hop from one to the next.
Mxz, curious does a pvp event have to occur in order for my information to be sent or is it sent every time I enter another's hood?
What are steel and diamond?? (bottom right corner)
They're for other games. The original structure was expanded and modified to build other games.Quote:
Originally Posted by TMI
Didn't you have to change name and quit because you got caught hacking bad dad with Ian kiddo?
can you do my profile? :)
Wow! If people are claiming its a TOS violation to read this data in the privacy of your own home - where GREE sends it all - then what is THIS??
I thought you were a creator of SAS? Is Balthazar now the head of SAS?
No, I quit because it was the only way to break my addiction. You're thinking about the time I hypothesized what could be done with an account if one had control, but ultimately voted to do nothing and told Ian to be conveniently unavailable if asked to do so. Had someone been foolish enough to give control over their account to other people in order to find ways to boost their IPH and stats or to be able to play even in the event of a device failure, they should probably consider themselves lucky that said players would rather disband the syndicate than do any of the things that would have been possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragmondino
You're Vlad? But, you're still in SAS. You only turned control over to a puppet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Killshot-CC
No, I was just an officer in SAS. I created Rogues Gallery out of one of SAS's syndicates when we decided to leave. I'm sure you saw the letter I wrote when I left. You just didn't see my name listed because Blather-zar blacked it out along with any dissenting comments from the chats.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistress Nikita
http://i.imgur.com/oAk6GZW.jpg
So what's your big issue with Balt here?
And I thought I remembered from the screen shots posted from chats about bad dads account in SAS when his money went and things were changed it was you and Ian the biggest culprits. Hence the name changes from you two and hiding out in lower syns..
No, I never changed my name.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragmondino