How is it possible?

Ok, so as promised, here’s some data from 48 battles over the last 2 frontlines… our faction has kept track of FL battle results for most of this year.

http://i61.tinypic.com/nb6nuh.jpg

The data shows the total deploy and control points earned by all 3 teams combined in each battle. The majority of the battles are on the straight line, which has a gradient (ignoring the outliers) of pretty close to 36% or 1/2.75, where 2.75 is the max deploy multiplier. In any one decent sized battle the total number of control points available should be equal to 36% the total deploy points. 36% of deploy points incidentally is the control points you can earn if you deploy on one node, completely unopposed.

However, there a clear outlier (plus a few others just off the line, particularly in bigger battles). This is the battle result of the outlier… the last battle of the war, where the main node was continually changing hands up to the last moment.

http://i62.tinypic.com/34eb6ok.jpg


1.3b deploy points are scored, but only 400m control points are earned (30%), so we seem to be missing roughly 80m points.

As I say, the battle was very close one until the end, as well as being the last battle of the event, … so it might be the case that deploy points don’t necessarily calculate correctly when servers are under-strain, perhaps particularly if nodes are changing hands in the last few seconds.

Now one alternative explanation would be that the relationship isn’t meant to be a linear one, and that there is an extra hidden deploy multiplier that kicks in at higher deploy levels (as suggested in the FAQ), increasing the deploy points scored for a given number of deploys and control points. However if we look at points per deploy scored across all the battles….

http://i62.tinypic.com/ajw4cx.jpg

… we see that control points per deploy are lower in bigger battles… falling below 10k, whereas deploy points remain pretty constant at 27,500 per deploy…. So again this would seem to suggest that control points are getting lost in bigger battles.

Finally, if I expand the dataset to include a few more wars, we see more of a scatter, with more battles below the line… which at least does at least seem to suggest it used to be more of an issue than it is today.

http://i59.tinypic.com/fcuy5x.jpg


However, it would seem that there still is a problem with under-recording of control points in the very biggest battles, with obviously big impacts on the points scored by the factions affected. Unless anyone has an alternative interpretation?

Ps, yesterday I thought that I had some battles where too many deploy points were awarded, however after double checking the data, this doesn’t seem to be the case

Ozy, thank you very much, it is great to actually have some data to support my hypothesis. I have long thought that these deploys are getting lost in the servers and not counting as control points on the node, your analysis pretty much helps to prove this.

This really does need Gree attention ASAP. I don't get how other issues get answered and this one keeps getting passed over. This affected our team multiple times last war and cost us multiple big wars. We were out deploying the opposing team, yet all of their deploys were counting on the node, and ours werent. In the end they took control of all nodes, while we had a higher deploy point total... not possible. Gree, we have plenty of evidence to support this... please do something about it.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias

Well that misses out the deploy multiplier, but nonetheless, the original scenario had 1 team deploying more, but not winning a single node. Your scenario has two teams each winning a node each, but the team deploying less winning overall... completely different scenario, and obviously feasible.

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The deploy multiplier on a node is something not seen. Something behind the scenes. The 2.75 deploy multiplier in the bottom left of your screen has nothing to do with what is happening on a node.

Control points are nothing more than a total of points added together for the points on the nodes you control. On the final flash screen, you cannot see what was deployed on a node, only the points you deployed out, and the control points. What goes on a node is different from what you deploy in the bottom left of the screen.

A gunner is 10000. A gunner in bottom left at 2.75 bonus is 27500. A gunner on a node with 2.75 is 10000. the 2.75 doesnt go on a node. The modifier of up to 5x depending on what the other team deploys as well, is not shown on any persons screen in FL. It is hidden. And my guess would be that it is designed to benefit the team that already holds the node. I am also going to assume that the nodes initial points also goes into the hidden modifier. The Command Center is worth 1000, so your first deploy of a gunner isnt 10000, its 11000, but only on that node, and the 1000 points isnt added to your deploy points on bottom left either. Possibly later in the node battle that 1000 points comes into play with the 5x modifier in some way.

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Originally Posted by SGT Rud

The deploy multiplier on a node is something not seen. Something behind the scenes. The 2.75 deploy multiplier in the bottom left of your screen has nothing to do with what is happening on a node.

Control points are nothing more than a total of points added together for the points on the nodes you control. On the final flash screen, you cannot see what was deployed on a node, only the points you deployed out, and the control points. What goes on a node is different from what you deploy in the bottom left of the screen.

A gunner is 10000. A gunner in bottom left at 2.75 bonus is 27500. A gunner on a node with 2.75 is 10000. the 2.75 doesnt go on a node. The modifier of up to 5x depending on what the other team deploys as well, is not shown on any persons screen in FL. It is hidden. And my guess would be that it is designed to benefit the team that already holds the node. I am also going to assume that the nodes initial points also goes into the hidden modifier. The Command Center is worth 1000, so your first deploy of a gunner isnt 10000, its 11000, but only on that node, and the 1000 points isnt added to your deploy points on bottom left either. Possibly later in the node battle that 1000 points comes into play with the 5x modifier in some way.

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There's no evidence of any hidden node level multiplier... Max deploy points per deploy is 27.5k, max control points per deploy is 10k.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias

http://i62.tinypic.com/34eb6ok.jpg

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20691 + 18102 + 10628 = 49421 total deploys You take your total deploys and and add up the unit strengths of all the deploys, and you will equal the total control points at the end. Problem is you cant tell if the deploy was a gunner or a tank or a boat.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias

There's no evidence of any hidden node level multiplier... Max deploy points per deploy is 27.5k, max control points per deploy is 10k.

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Your deploy points do not do onto the node, so once max 2.75 is reached, its still only 10000 going onto the node. So, Gree says there is up to a 5x bonus on the node which is adjusted by the other teams deploys, but there isnt a hidden multiplier? That 5x you cant see. 2.75 for deploy bonus (which isnt on the node itself) isnt 5x anything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SGT Rud

20691 + 18102 + 10628 = 49421 total deploys You take your total deploys and and add up the unit strengths of all the deploys, and you will equal the total control points at the end. Problem is you cant tell if the deploy was a gunner or a tank or a boat.

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Yep and in a large battle the control points should equal 1/2.75 of deploy = 36%. As I've shown, they are sometimes less. I don't need to know what units are used, just the ratio between them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SGT Rud

Your deploy points do not do onto the node, so once max 2.75 is reached, its still only 10000 going onto the node. So, Gree says there is up to a 5x bonus on the node which is adjusted by the other teams deploys, but there isnt a hidden multiplier? That 5x you cant see. 2.75 for deploy bonus (which isnt on the node itself) isnt 5x anything.

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Yes I understand that. If for every 10k that goes into the node, a max of 27.5k goes into the overall deploy points, where does this hidden bonus show up in the score?

The FAQs are riddled with errors, so i wouldn't take what gree say as gospel

The 5x hidden bonus you speak of us non existent. Most of the wars come out where (assuming all 10k ships are deployed) Deploy Points = Deploys * 10,000 * 2.75 (less a little bit for the lower multipliers at the bottom) and Control Points = Deploys * 10,000. The math adds up 95% of the time.

It is these 'glitched' battles where there are hundreds or thousands of deploys being sent to the server at once that there begin to be missing control points. As evidenced by 1) The screenshots posted here and I have more, of teams winning all nodes with fewer deploy points than other teams 2) Ozy posting his graphs of the control point ratio going down the more deploy points in a war (more strain on the servers). And tons more of other proof.

Max deploy points are from gold ship: 12k. So max control points per deploy is 12k.

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Originally Posted by Annihilator2

Max deploy points are from gold ship: 12k. So max control points per deploy is 12k.

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Max average observed is 10k.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias

Max average observed is 10k.

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What idiot buy these ships with gold in such case?

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Originally Posted by Annihilator2

What idiot buy these ships with gold in such case?

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I doubt if anyone buys ships, unless by accident.

anyone from gree care to respond here? my factions tickets sent in during FL still remain completely unanswered as well.... Has all support vanished?

a week after my original ticket i finally got a response saying they are sorry for the delay and that the points got screwed up, and they will pass it over to the developers to fix... no try to fix the problem or provide any compensation even though they pretty much agree they that cheated us out of hundreds of millions of points??? Are you kidding me? And nobody from gree even cares enough to respond here.

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Originally Posted by andy2

And nobody from gree even cares enough to respond here.

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You got it. Get used to it. They seem to be using the 'lalallalalala I can't hear you' defence a lot lately. Seems to work well enough,

Doesn't make sense on paper, but when you see it happen in real-time it makes perfect sense


At least to me.


And my vision is 20/16

so how many other issues will get 'looked into' before this one?

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Originally Posted by andy2

a week after my original ticket i finally got a response saying they are sorry for the delay and that the points got screwed up, and they will pass it over to the developers to fix... no try to fix the problem or provide any compensation even though they pretty much agree they that cheated us out of hundreds of millions of points??? Are you kidding me? And nobody from gree even cares enough to respond here.

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And now I get a survey... bad idea gree.

keeping this on the front page, i know there are a lot of other issues now, but it is ridiculous you wont answer this.

Particularly as other issues are at least getting acknowledged

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias

Particularly as other issues are at least getting acknowledged

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Right? I guess a major flaw in one of their top 2 money making events isnt worth responding to a ticket or forum post...

any word here gree?

Do I get a prize for guessing the answer you would get?

Yes you get the prize of being ignored by Gree. Don't feel too special though, many people win.

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Originally Posted by andy2

... To have more deploy points in FL than another team... yet have that other team win every single node?

Gree this has happened to us many times, it seems as if our deploys are not counting on the node we are deploying them to and we are getting cheated out of hundreds of millions of points... that we spent money on. Am I missing anything here? This is not mathematically possible based upon how Gree has told us the game works. My entire team has sent in tickets to gree and we receive either no response or something completely unrelated. Where is the support? How is this possible?


To be perfectly clear I am talking about an example like this

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Scores

Team	Deploy Points	Control Points
1	300,000,000	0
2	270,000,000	200,000,000
3	0	0

How can the team who deployed 300m not win a single node? Gree staff... I have plenty of pics if you want to actually explain how any of this is mathmatically possible.

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I'm inquiring about this for you. When I get an answer I'll let you know.

Any update yet?

All I can say is that it's a game and the goal of gree is money. You all act like this is a living. I love reading all the complaints and lmao.

Anything yet?

anything yet?

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Originally Posted by major willy

All I can say is that it's a game and the goal of gree is money. You all act like this is a living. I love reading all the complaints and lmao.

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This is the best and most logical post here. The answer would be for you to buy more gold lmao

I know the answer.... but how about now?

I'm still waiting for them to fix the IOS issue of the base decorations, to view on rivals lists and an easier way to build walls with concrete lol

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Originally Posted by Relic

I'm inquiring about this for you. When I get an answer I'll let you know.

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I had this happen to my faction a few months ago too and my tickets get (pardon my language) stupid responses. Gree CS ends up looking like a bunch of monkeys when they ignore legitimate questions and assume the senders are idiots. This is a real problem. And let me spell it out for most guys on the forum and Gree engineers that don't understand the problem, it actually IS mathematically impossible. Last I checked, your game is supposed to be based on numbers so if you can't explain it, you are saying the game is broken with your silence.

We await your rebuttal...

its easy, its not possible in reality, but in gree land anything goes

we chased GREE for ever during the fall when this happened during a multi bn match between PEPA and Birds, the final answer we got was that deploys during final seconds (not clear how many) may at times not get recorded because they are still being processed when the final win/lose decision is made

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Originally Posted by pelle plutt

its easy, its not possible in reality, but in gree land anything goes

we chased GREE for ever during the fall when this happened during a multi bn match between PEPA and Birds, the final answer we got was that deploys during final seconds (not clear how many) may at times not get recorded because they are still being processed when the final win/lose decision is made

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Yes I can believe that, and kind of figured so... so how about we fix that? Maybe a 60:00:05 battle and last 5 seconds it updates the nodes with pending deploys and doesn't allow more deploys? I don't know. Do something!

This glitch is bigger than deploys not counting during the last seconds of a battle. Although I can see how that is easily an issue. I have been a part of many big wars where with 5 minutes left in the war we would show as having more faction deploy points than each of the other teams, yet one of the other teams would have 'control' of ALL nodes. Not mathematically possible and not because of last second 'pending' deploys. The deploys counted, just not towards the node. For the entire last 5 minutes our lead in deploy points could increase - and our deficit on the node would actually also increase. Again, not possible.

I have been contacted by the lead developer who says that they are 'working' on a fix, yet gives no actual updates and it has been weeks if not months since I have initially sent in my first tickets. Customer service has not done one thing to make this right for my team, or any of the others who may have faced the issue. I know this is not surprising, and I dont need anybody telling me that, but I refuse to let them get away with this as much as I can help it.

how about now?

Yes I still have the awnser��

how many more events go by before we get an answer?