No , spend 5000 returned again ^_^Quote:
Originally Posted by 09cobaltss
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No , spend 5000 returned again ^_^Quote:
Originally Posted by 09cobaltss
That was well thought out... And appreciated by more than will comment. Always feel free to comment...you have to learn to ignore the background noise is all...Quote:
Originally Posted by kerazie
Background noise to Spock = reality to everyone else. He's said the advantage is usually gained in f2p games by those who pay, but he didn't pay enough to be competitive. But he still expects to be able to compete with those that are much better without having to pay for it. Seems legit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Spock
The only thing I get out of your post is that you think people are better than me because they spend more gems. Games should be about skill not how fat a wallet is. Yes, I admit I am not the best, but that's not the point here. The point is items and content are out of reach from me because I do not spend as much as others.Quote:
Originally Posted by busteroaf
I completely understand how this game is made by a business whose sole purpose is to milk us for all we have. And I may have gone off track with my previous post, but the point was that content shouldn't be restricted to those who don't or can't pay. Everyone should have a chance.
In my earlier post it wasn't about being able to compete with people who spend money in wars. Actually a gem free war or arena would be nice to see where everyone actually does stand. Would the top ten now still be in the top ten? Probably, but I wonder how many less points they would have without being able to gem up?
Ooo and on a side note, summoning stone should have a gold cost to it. A million to get a summon or something. Ebs love gold too!
Ooo and another thing about the eb, Only 6 days and some change to get the + version for the rewards chest? A night to a day to get first craft, almost three days to craft. You really have to be on the ball to get the reward dont ya?
Its not about spending gems, but let me add an example from a line conversation I had.Quote:
Originally Posted by kerazie
"What's with u people wasting money just to get epics and forcing other people to become stronger by making them get stuff force them to work harder thats just dumb. Just to get in a good guild"
"I'd rather be good but ur forcing people to become stronger and its just a game i know that I want to be in a guild badly but I quit knights"
This is also from the same person that said they spent $300 on gems. No wait, it was 300 gems to level. Wait no, only 30 gems so far, they still have 270 left. And this person is level 64, has only gained about 10 levels in the month and a half I've had contact with them. But they want to get into a top 10 guild to get an epic to get better. Would you want this person in your guild? Would you?
Would you carry them to an epic, or would you rather have someone who could drop gems if needed, and doesn't have to wait for mommy and daddy to let them play for the night? I'm sorry, but this is the general feeling I get from a VERY large portion of those that play this game, and are floating around in Line chats. It is few and far between that you find the diamonds in the rough who actually are very much f2p, but are willing to listen, and do what it takes, and who even as a f2p person, have shown that they know what they're doing, to the point that you know what, I WOULD vouch for them and carry them to an epic. They've maxed out a castle, they're maxing appropriate armors that will help them, actively asking for feedback from others on their progress, leveling, etc...
But apparently people like me are "forcing" people to spend money to become better. I, nor anyone else has every made anyone spend to get better. But all the "thousands of guilds" that you think will be competitive, will be filled with people like the above. And without fat wallets, it comes down to coordination, and again, most of the "thousands of guilds" (and players) lack even the basic understanding of how guilds work. The only thing that would be different, is that the point totals would be much closer for the top ten, and I can safely say that the guilds that are in the top 10/25/50, would still be about the same. Guilds who wait for 8 hours before declaring because they don't have the people online? They'd stay right where they are. They wouldn't instantly become more competitive because you couldn't gem. Guaranteed.
As far as the content... just because its there, doesn't mean that EVERYONE is entitled to it, even p2p or f2p. Level 20 players can't do epic boss, almost at all. Level 40 players can kill Level 15, but not 43... and so on. The rewards for these events are easy for some, hard for others, and impossible for many. Do you want a full revamp of the EB too?
Ok let's see.
No one wants a moocher in the game let alone a guild. I'm not talking about handouts, I guess it is just our different perspectives in why I perhaps come off as a freeloader. I just need to get past the fact that gems are king.
Btw is their a way to get a Blazeborne Vanguard + without paying for it?
epic plus version, chests only, unless they give it out again for referal bonus a few weeks back...
no freeloaders allowed...Quote:
This is also from the same person that said they spent $300 on gems. No wait, it was 300 gems to level. Wait no, only 30 gems so far, they still have 270 left. And this person is level 64, has only gained about 10 levels in the month and a half I've had contact with them. But they want to get into a top 10 guild to get an epic to get better. Would you want this person in your guild? Would you?
True , very true ..I remember I defeat my first epic boss at level 40 :)Quote:
Originally Posted by busteroaf
You will never understand it Buster. Notice this large growing forum? How about the large amount of gems being spent on this paltry guild war? I would argue it is not working while you would argue for me to shut my mouth stating I am an idiot.. This is how you roll... anyone who tries to talk about bettering the process is jeered and sneered at by you and your pea brain...if it doesn't fit into your model that person is stupid..meanwhile less and less people comment. They mostly don't comment now and have left the forum because they get tired of your attacks on them..Quote:
Originally Posted by busteroaf
If u could just become capable of objective thought you might be able to get the fact F2P is very important to the overall health of this game and F2P players have as much right to comment on this forum as you. Just because I argue this, does not mean I don't spend but you have never figured that out either because again you are not capable of objective thought hence you attack me as usual whenever I comment... I have tried to be nice but I am done with that..
I spend a lot of money though I think the guild war setup is not sustainable, but that doesn't stop me from playing for Centurions. We played you first war and beat you silly by outspending your weak whiny ass, but I digress. You are a terrible GM but you are good at destroying this forum...the best thing that GREE can do with you is to boot you off the site. Then maybe people will start coming back..you need to go hang with King Mark...so we don't have to put up with you any more..
Ohh and your armor was weak and you hid along with the rest of your guild. I guess you need to save your precious gems for when you strip for eunuch...because you can't spend enough money. You may actually beat us but I don't really care because I will go back to my F2P guild at the end of the war and I'll come back and pay more cash when I feel like it again...IT IS JUST A CARTOON AFTERALL..
THIS IS MY ACTUAL REALITY.
/yawn
They added power attack to arena & took away gem to save win streak. I said a long time ago I don't think you should be able to buy AE, but to think it would ever happen in guild war is an excercise in futility. This is Grees model. Don't expect it to change.
Ooooh, Spock took the gloves off. Lets dance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Spock
Let me address your Guild War comments first:
You "beat us silly" by outspending us. That is generally how it happens unless I'm mistaken. I would have hoped you beat us since you likely had more active too. Maybe I'm wrong. Can't go back and check that. And I'm such a horrible, terrible GM, that with such weak and horrible armors that you didn't even want to farm me consistently, while I was sitting at the bar drinking a beer and eating a burger. Must be some weird alternate reality where the gm has such weak and horrible armors that you don't want to beat because he gives less points. Oh wait, was it actually because you couldn't beat me? Did I rotate my armors too much for you to say "don't try to farm Buster, you won't win"? That seems more likely. Makes sense.
Also, please tell me again how I'm a terrible GM, and what makes you say that? Because we lost a battle? Because I'm not normally GM of this guild? Because I likely have one of the best sets of gear available, for the exact situation that presented itself, like I mentioned above: To rotate and prevent you from scoring more points than you did. Yeah, its all my fault. I should quit the game. And how exactly did I hide? Or the guild hide? I guarantee I was listed in the second slot, right under the guild sentinel, the entire war. Exactly where I am in every other guilds list that we face. You could have found me. I didn't even change my name. BusteRoaF. The whole war. Didn't think I could make myself invisible. Must be a new tactic I'll have to investigate.
And to the guy talking about saving gems for stripping: What did Cents have after the first war against us? 330k? Something close to that? I could be wrong. Just asking though, because with a 3-2 W-L record, and one of those wins being relatively small against us... it sure does seem odd that with only two other wins, (and 2 loses) you've still got 2.4 million total. So rounding up, you're averaging 500k for each of the other four wars. Seems unlikely you're going to farm for 500k and get no win bonus, so the loses are likely much smaller, and the wins are much bigger. Is that a fair statement? Seems like someone is getting a few big strip wars for their remaining wins, and they don't want to let on, while trying to make others out to be the "stripping" people. You know, place blame first, and then you're off the hook. Oh, I know what it was. You must have faced guilds with MUCH STRONGER GM's with MUCH BETTER armor, who you could beat, straight up, with no stripping, consistently.
Anyone want to wager a guess which situation seems more likely? We all know stripping is a mainstay in the wars. Stop trying to act like you don't participate in the practice yourself.
In regards to all the f2p people being necessary:
Sure. Of course they are. Having only spenders would severely limit the fun in the game. But are they necessarily competitive? No. That is the thing. I'm looking at the leaderboards right now. Rank 201 is sitting at 104k points, after bonuses. I've got around 94k myself. Hell, factor in win bonuses, and it is actually closer to 141k, which would put me around rank 150. By myself. I'm comparing my own scores against a whole guild's TOTAL. Guilds only 130 places back from our guild. Do you honestly think that these guilds, are ever going to pony up the points/gems/cash necessary to convince Gree to revamp the whole guild wars? Or, if they were to stop spending, that they would get Gree's attention? If you are truly living in reality, you know that it isn't going to happen. And it won't happen until everyone banded together and said "no we aren't spending" and them to lose money for an entire war, before they listened. If Gree (and every other company that uses the exact same "highest points wins" system for war, since Gree isn't the only one) knew of a way to change it so that EVERYONE could compete fairly without the use of in game currency that could be bought with actual money, while still earning money... do you not think the would? Everyone and their brother would want to play the game, because you could pick it up and know you could be competitive.
Can you honestly come up with a money making strategy that would appeal to EVERYONE and make them the same, if not MORE money than what they currently make? Please, enlighten me if you can.
Did I ever say that f2p people didn't have the right to the game, or these forums? Of course they have the right to play, and comment. Go for it. I don't care. What I do take issue with, is people saying "its not fair, you had epics first because you spent money for them, you took the easy way out". When I open chests, I have the same chance of getting good gear out of chests as the next guy. Just like winning the lotto. The more tickets I buy, the more chances I have. My apologies if I occasionally open multiple chests because I have the ability. And last I checked, winning guild wars is not the easy way out. Do you, Spock, think Guild Wars is the easy way out? How dare you try and set yourself apart from the rest of the players by participating and spending money in a War, to win a prize that will give you a competitive advantage against other players. Shame on you. (See how silly that sounds?)
What I have said was, in regards to the "fairness" is if you willingly accept that you don't spend enough to be competitive with the top tier, don't complain that the rewards (or accessibility to them) aren't fair enough for you. The game, by design, isn't meant to be "fair" to those that are free-to-play, or minimal pay-to-win players. Hell, how far can you get in Arena now as a f2p player vs the old Arena? Is it fair? Hell no its not. But does that mean that they should change it back? They made it so people can get more rewards, even playing for free. They just can't get to the top, where the best rewards are.
Again, for example, like I said earlier: Level 20 players can barely beat the weekly boss. Level 40's can consistently beat level 15 and craft the regular armor. Level 60's-80's are able to get to 43, and able to craft the EB+. Do low level people argue that the bosses are too hard for them? Has Gree changed it? No. You level up and get better armor, and eventually you can compete, for free too. Eventually, and IF you put in the work. And in reality, the EB continues to get harder and harder. Last I checked, the Hydra Hunter and Living Flame armors haven't increased in strength to match, so those new players using the big four, are actually at a disadvantage, as the bosses get stronger and stronger. Is it fair? How dare Gree keep making the bosses harder. How dare they make level 60 on the boss, you know, (sort of) hard to beat?
This isn't an "I'm a paying elitist" post. This is a "the game isn't fair by design, and it doesn't look like Gree is going to do a damn thing about it" post.
Also, if Gree (or the mods) thought I was such a detriment to the forums, You would have thought I would be banned by now. But, never happened. I apologize for making valid points, and not making bogus claims about people regularly. Maybe you should petition them to ban me.
I didn't check all 50 pages of this thread regarding the Kal/Chrom armors. For them to be even partly useful, how about giving bonuses depending on the lowest level of all guild elements. Ex. If all guild element bonus is on 5%, then the Kal/Chrom armors get 5%.
Monch
@buster...boring yawn...nobody understands you because your brain works at such a high level..I get it...everyone gets it ...the smart ones have left the forum...that leaves a handful of dummies including me...oh and the new folks that like the game that want to make it better that you haven't squished yet with your powerful mind...
This forum did not deserve you...go away...I ignored your friend request too...I am done with you dude...
I am wondering if there isn't something more to this myself. On the surface the armor appears really weak...maybe a new metal element bonus?Quote:
Originally Posted by monch9
GREE Can we please get this ???Quote:
Originally Posted by Voxx
@Busteroaf: It's never only a matter of "money making" in the immediate future, but developing and taking care of your product so that:
1. your customers are happy with it and keep playing (and paying).
2. enlarge the number of paying customers.
As far as I can see now, as a spender (not competitively but yet in the past I've used a modest amount of 200 gems per war knowing we were not aiming for nothing more than top 50 or top 100), is their actual strategy is wrong because they are assuming the psycology-addiction-mechanics will do the longevity work for them. What I see atm is a spamming of new features that makes the game even more frenetic and are not welcomed by neither old time f2p or p2p. It's clear that they want our money, but they don't even bother taking care a bit of the p2p who would (according to your thoughts) ofc deserve a sort of balance in high level competitive play and uniqueness of their prizes, instead we now have a useless non plus epic and gwar epics freely fuseable from everyone; i'm not even taking into account the cheating issues of the past.
Everyone who's been playing this game for a while is unhappy with the development, for one reason or another, except you who can (as far as i can see) empathically link your interests with the ones of the developers. How long do you think this will last? No long-term innovation, ppl gets tired, new games with similar mechanics are on the store.
I can't blame Gree for being willing to earn money, hell that's what this whole thing is made up for. But when you get your money you can do it wisely with a bit of ethic, or you can grab whatever you can until you product lasts. The difference is a long term guaranteed earning.
But specifically speaking, in this game the problem is if you want to spend gems, you have to spend tons of it, or it's not worth to. Ofc the chest mechanics can trick you into spending your first ones, and poor will ppl would keep opening like if they were in Las Vegas. Then they quit after receiving crap or getting an epic that hasn't changed anything in their gameplay (they still end up ranked 10.000-1.500 in arena, and GW depends on where you are and how much you are willing to spend).
A different strategy would be limit the amount of gems you can use to get to the top of the various parts of the game, so that everyone can be tempted to spend their little amount of gems and end up in a good position (if they are good).
The game as it is now, it's more a bank account measurement. And the f2p are here only to illude the p2p that there's a lot of ppl playing this game and you are "stronger" (cooler?) than all of them, but the fact is they could be nothing more than stupid npcs to you, for the way you interact with them.
@Ithiliond well phrased...but there is nothing to reason with there..he is truly beyond help. Just don't take his upcoming attack personally...
What you call a bank measurement I call an auction...the highest bidder wins all. We have talked about a tiered approach to the game where guilds bring a war chest to buy a tier and battle. That would be a lot of fun... It is not very fun now...none want too fight.. They want to strip for their alliance teams is all. The current system is broken pretty badly, if you are after competition..
Do you have any ideas to share?
Here's an idea,
Stop making suggestions that go against Grees model. Go play Grees other games, realize that K&D requires less money while offering more gameplay, & we will see you when you get back.
Probably already been mentioned, but I also wanna mention it:
Lower the damn chest prizes, or increase the actual chance of getting Epic's/Reward. Its incredibly unfair that there was a period where everyone could get easy free fusion epics for noooooooo effort, to now having to pay 250+ euro's and only getting 2 legendaries and no Epics from chests and still not being able to compete against users who are wayyyy weaker and put no effort into getting high armor.
Its just disrespectful and absurd. No one cares, but I'm incredibly close to quitting despite it being my fault to a degree since its a gamble. At least make the older Legendaries or Epics double the chance or something. Not even getting into GWs..
I'm an Adult player aged 40+ and know other older people play too. Age is not even an issue for my requests but thought I would add that older people obviously play this cute game.
GREE, PLEASE add STRATEGY to the mostly automatic battles! Please add the abilities for. Knights to use actual SKILLS! I don't want to watch my knights fight, I want to be able to use skills or other fighting abilities! Also, any other classes besides Knights in the works?? Any plans for this??
I hope others agree!
@Ithiliond Apparently you didn't read my post in another thread on the war, or the epic, or whatever it was. I forget off the top of my head. This is one of the few threads I actually still read on here. I know I know, hard to assume that people read other threads. But if you had, you'd know that I've also said that the game is getting tiresome for many, myself included.
I apologize for that personal attack. It was a killer one wasn't it?
What you say is valid. I can't deny that. It would make sense to build longevity through customer service and fun things that EVERYONE can participate in. But that isn't the model that these games follow. Look at nearly any other game in the market. They start off simple enough, but if you want to get into the end game, and get the best rewards, they all inevitably funnel you down "spending lane". They start off unlocking extra armor or inventory slots, and you assume that as you get higher level you will get more and more, only for those slots to slow down, your gems earned from quests slow down, etc etc. Suddenly you're presented with the option of "buy more" or potentially miss out on some content/armors/weapons/characters etc. All the games follow this, or funnel you in the same direction. This isn't a Gree thing, its the market.
As far as me siding with Gree, it is on a purely business "they're out to make money, just like the other game developers" basis. Other than that, I find their "new content" isn't anything new. Take Arena. They made it so more rewards would be given in the hope that more people would spend more money. Well, the whales are spending still... not sure about the f2p players. If there was a way to go back in time and change the entire mechanics of the game, or even do it now, to allow the brand new person to pick up and play, and feel they could legit be top player in something with minimal buy in, and minimal spending all around, please, let me know what that is so that I can make the next great game.
lol that is the most mindless argument i ever heard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eunuchorn
A lot of my friends are not spending money on this game because for what? To get into the top 50 and get a worthless legendary ... even legendary plus doesnt cut it to spend cash on. And if you want to shoot for top 10 you need to spend 300,-- EUR? LoL sure i will.
People do understand that in some countries 300,-- is the month rent of a 50 mē flat.
As long spending normal quantities of cash 5 - 30,-- wont give you a chance to reach something that is worth my cash, im not spending, so does my guild, so do most other people with less than 15k points in a 24h war.
Im not sure about that, but i think instead of 500 people spending 50.000,-- EUR for a war, GREE could have 20.000 people spending 5 - 10,-- while having fun and enjoying the game because.
It would put competition back into this game instead of an epeen comparison of your wallet size.
Quote:
Originally Posted by firefly333
You just answered it all on your. What company would trade a 2,5 mill profit to a 200k profit for the "fun" of the players. I recommend that you dont start a companyQuote:
Originally Posted by shush
^ They are / will lose players like that though. I of course don't know how they stand at the moment, but there is a breaking point eventually. Even me, I love this game, but I'm pretty damn annoyed at Greed to the point of me almost quitting too. Others have done the same.
Though all I'm asking for is some balance and a bit more security with a little less BS gamble when it comes to chests and or gem spending. First they make epics fusion-able to even level 30 players, then they remove the fusioning part, then they add it back in but only for some..then it takes you hundreds of euros to even get one..then next week they will probably be giving them out for free.
By lowering the prices and/or by putting less emphasis on paying to win, I can see them actually converting more f2p players into occasional spenders, while also attracting more players that will be more satisfied = also more people spending.
Im just upset/salty at the moment though, so I'm not sure howmuch sense im making xD
But HOW. HOW are they going to change the whole model of these games to convert all these non-spenders to $5-10 spenders? This is how ALL of these games run. Gree is not the only one who does this. I really hope you people understand that last sentence, so I made it bold.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryanv2
Do you want them to literally just have a market where they sell Epics that you can flat out buy? If you notice the Gem-apaloozas or whatever they are called, they give away prizes for spending gems. 50 gems get you some fusion boosts. 1500 gets you an old armor. 5000 gets you an epic, or legendary, that is often outdated, but for some, still viable.
Do the conversion. What is that in real money? 5000 gems is 6.25 of the biggest gem packs you can buy (800 for $100). Even on sale, at their average sale price of $80, or 20% off, that is $500. And say you bought iTunes/Google Play gift cards on sale at 20% off. That epic that you are getting, is STILL costing you $400 in real in game currency. Sure, you get other things when you spend gems, you could get top rank in Arena, open a ton of chests and possibly get more epics. But it is still costing you $400.
And you think they are going to convert the game to where people are spending $5-$10 and it will be competitive throughout? How many of those $5-$10 spenders, are going to pony up 40x what they normally would, just for one epic? Does that seem feasible to you? That is like saying "lets turn all the slot machines in the casinos into machines where the player wins the majority of the time" It isn't practical.
I never said its the best way of running a business, but these companies are making hand over fist. They're still doing something right.
K&D: the only Gree game without constant story LTQs. Get your gems ready for the new year, because I assure you, it's coming.
Thank you for this answer. It's true that the money game strategy has spread all over the app market, but I believe showing a little more care and love for customers and game balance cannot hurt.Quote:
Originally Posted by busteroaf
It's simply a matter of how you see your product: a mere money investment, or something to build and let grow, just like any other commercial activity (like a pub: you can invest your money buying one and letting others manage it, or you can work hard in first person to improve the quality of your service/location/food and get more compensation in return). Ofc the latter is harder and not assured but we are talking about a game that is already successful, or maybe it was.
I'm not trying to convince you we can change this, nor that we are entitled to keep whining about gree's market choices. I first went here to suggest a couple of points, and i think i will later on.
The answer, imho, is in what shush said. I think that there are many players who can't or won't spend more than 10-30$/€ per month, but they don't do that since it's pointless at the moment. Moreover i'm pretty sure that if the game was less money hungry and more appealing to newcomers (to the point that I myself could start speaking of it as a different kind of game definitely worth my time) i could have convinced at least three of my friends to start playing and i know for sure (because i know them) that they could have invested 10-20€ once in a while.Quote:
Originally Posted by busteroaf
The problem is there is no actual data to compare, but while maybe now they get more money, i think they also risk more.
****
SUGGESTIONS:
1. The game is filled with tons of armors nobody takes into account since ages, with no balance. Super rares are weaker than rares, ultra rares are stronger than a lot of legendaries.
What about introducing a real innovation in the Arena? You can make Tier fights, in which players are limited to certain rarity restriction on their lineup. For example: tier 3 bracket allows players to wear only one single epic (or less rare armors), and two legendaries (or less); tier 2 bracket allows one ultra rare and two super rares; tier 1 bracket allows one rare and two uncommon.
Every tier has its own prizes at the end of the tournament.
2. If point one is appealing, consider reworking and rebalancing the stats of all armors of the same rarity (like all rares plus version should have a sum between 1350-1500; super rares+ should be slightly stronger; more ultra rares plz; legendaries are messed up)
3. Insert a way to convert regular non-epic armors to plus version via quests and/or paying gems.
4. About GWars: Insert a real bonus in points for defeating HC, GC, GS and GM in android. Give the GC a bonus in points earned or stat bonus at a certain point of the war and for a limited time. Create alternative guardians that increase your guild mates' points instead of reducing your opponents'. Give every guild the possibility to start a tier battle for a short time during the war, no refusal, the winning one (or a radom one) choses the tier.
5. Add 4 men battles in which you are entitled to swap the position of one of your knight once per battle, and maybe you can chose to drop a special attack in favour of an effect dependant on the element combination of the current armor.
6. Another idea is on my mind is creating a Guild sided copy of the world, or a different one, where the whole guild advances getting rewards and discovering new storyplots. You can develop this by letting the GM see which kind of battles are needed to advance for the quest (every battle differs in elements, number of enemies, presence of bosses, special abilities and level difficulty) and set up groups of guild mates to face it. But maybe i'm dreaming too much over this.
7. Oh and... set a limit to the number of energy refills one can do during a single gwar battle, or (about arena) during a whole day. I know you won't but this would be a nice start.
Have a larger amount of gems you can buy at a better discount. I bought 7600 at one time. I know my GM is buying by the truckload.
800 at a time is silly, give us a larger volumn discount on more gems bought at once.
Because people need to buy more than $100 of gems at a time.
I spend money on the game and even this is a little mystifying. You really need that many gems at once?
Moderation man.
Please get some advice from people who actually play the game. Giving away Aegis of the Dragon+ as a reward when getting Glacius+ is a prerequisite is just silly. Why not give a different element boss armor?
Hi buster, this is DK Fire and you know we need more than $100 of gems at once for a war. Its just a fact of war if you want to win. Id just think Gree could give volumn discounts.Quote:
Originally Posted by busteroaf
Oh I know, but still... when most people see spending more than $100 for gems... it gets a bit out of hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by firefly333
Like I said, I spend gems, and I don't ever want to see something more than $100 on my credit card from iTunes. It would be nice to get a bigger discount but... I'd also like to make a car payment this month too.
Each week the following thing happens to me: I reach a point where I can no longer be assured of beating the epic boss with 8 energy. When that point happens, there is a time when I actually DON'T want to be playing (farming snakeskins or whatever). Let's say the boss is dark and I am at 8 energy with one hour to max. Ideally, I want to wait until I have just a little time until 10 energy and then I can fight and if I need to, wait a while to get more energy and fight again. But if I farm snakeskins now, the 'attack the boss now' is triggered and I have to fight within the next two hours or it goes dark again. But now I don't want to fight in one hour because I would only have an hour to charge up when I might need more time. So I can either go ahead and keep farming now waiting the full two hours for the boss to go dark again (thus wasting an hour's worth of energy) or I could stop farming snakeskins to avoid triggering the boss. When I am in these cases, sometimes I just stop playing all together which Gree doesn't want. Other times I might start playing on kingdom or darkness just to avoid triggering the boss. And depending on circumstances, there can be lots of different cases where this can happen (you have a specific limited time to play and so need to fight the boss at times X and Y or you aren't flexible with friends or ...) -- But I don't understand what the function of this trigger is. If they want a trigger to fight the boss, fine (buy why?). But then you should be able to turn it off thus resetting the timing. Is there some reason they want this function in the game? And am I somehow misanalyzing the situation I am in?
Farm Dark Prince zones.
Though, I agree with you, they could make it so Epic stage of all zones WILL NOT trigger EBs.
I'm new here and just read through this whole forum. I'm not trying to start (or continue) any fights, but the above quoted statement just stuck in my mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by busteroaf
Have you ever been to Vegas (or any other decent casino)?
What do you think those banners over the slot machines saying "97% payback" mean??
The player DOES win most of the time!! AND STILL the casino's make TONS of money.
Yes the casino's should (and do) cater to their "Whales" but they cater to their "ordinary" players too.
I am constantly getting offers from my favorite casinos to come out - stay free - eat free, etc.
Let me tell you a little about myself.
I'm 58 (WOW soooo OLD and still playing Knights and Dragons)
I go to Vegas at least 4 times a year - ALWAYS with free rooms, yet I never spend more than $100 a day in Vegas. I talked with a slot host once and was told that the $100 a day casino gamblers are the ones that the casino's like best because they are consistent. It's easily budgeted income, they know the cost of inviting me (and the thousands of similar people on their lists) out to the casino, and they know exactly how much profit they will be making on that offered weekend.
I play K&D the same way. I spend in "real" cash, about $40 a month with Gree, and if the game stays interesting I will continue to spend that money. From an accountants point of view, that's Bankable and predictable Cash Flow. and expected earnings based on cash flow is what makes a corporations stock and value go up. Which is what Gree wants more than anything.
Eventually the Gem heavy top guilds are going to get bored with buying the bragging rights of "I won every guild war since forever" it just can't sustain itself. If the same guilds stay on the top forever and the gap between them and the "normal" guilds stays so large, people will stop competing with them.
If a game can't be kept fun for the "normal" player it will eventually fail. So how would Gree keep the game fun fo me? (I believe that while "older", I am a "normal" player).
I would like to see more guild war stats - how many of my guild participated - Who declared - Who fought (and who they fought, did they just hit the guardian for the possibility of the personal gain, or did they jump in and do their part for the whole guild?)
I would like to see an in game means of contacting Guildmates that allows me to keep a log.
On my phone, my guild chat drops off after about 15 lines, I would like to be able to keep more of the chat. Ideally I would like to keep a permanent log of all of my guild chat (if there is a way to do that, I would love to be told) I would also like to be able to toggle guild chat across the bottom of my screen while I'm playing in the normal play screens, the last two posts that you see across the bottom of the screen during war are great, but when I'm waiting for my war energy to refill, I like to go out and farm items for my upgrades. Why can't those chat line be available while I'm doing that?
I would love to know what the chances of getting something good are in the chests.
While it's possible that I'm just unlucky, every time that I have done the special quests (like this month's Boss Rewards) to get any keys that are better than silver, I wind up getting the lowest possible rewards out of those chests. The news tells us what we are guaranteed if we open 11 or 40 chests, but how about letting us know what the odds are when only opening the 3 that we can earn by crafting the 3 bosses? (I know this may sound a little "whiny" but what the heck)
It would be nice to be able to choose from a larger list of opponents in the Arena. Since the change the opponents offered to me don't seem to follow any pattern that I can see. It is interesting to note that I can consistently defeat 5 and then it doesn't seem to matter who I select, I run a 50/50 chance of defeating #s 6 and 7, and IF I make it past #7 I rarely make it through #9.
Now, I don't play all day, I don't have alarms on my phone set to let me play whenever the energy is full, etc. I do have a "real" job that I need to go to every once in a while.
It would be nice to choose some special armor (epic, legendary, etc.) and then have a way to link quests, or Arena and boss prizes (drops) to help meet that goal. something like I choose to work towards a Blazeborne Vanguard, and then the quests I'm offered, and the boss drops, etc are geared toward giving me things that can be used to upgrade my "quest choice" make the quest for the special armor more difficult, and the other drops and prizes collectable until you succeed in the master quest.
That way, once you win the quest armor, you are at least ready to start enhancing it. Possible Arena prizes could include fusion armor geared toward the quest armor. include changes to the standard "in game" boss drops to give a chance of something geared towards the quest armor as well.
Anyway - probably way too much for a first post.
and I do know that "in life" the rich get richer and the rest of our lives just sometimes suck, but I play games to escape "real" life, so I'd rather not listen to "the rich" telling me to "just suck it up and let us get richer"
Grumpy for a reason, Gramps because I am
GrumpyGramps
Still waiting on stackable armours... easy fix and no loss on profits for gree
Back to one epic war a month would be nice, I know you want to squeeze as much profit out of a "free" game as you can but 1 epic war every week almost is beyond insane.
You do realize 97% payback doesn't mean the person hitting that slot machine wins 97% of the time right? The house only winning 3% of the time would mean they give away money. The hit tables are WAY lower, likely in the 30-40% range, depending on how loose they want to make the machines.Quote:
Originally Posted by GrumpyGramps
The Payback means that over time, the machine will pay back 97% of what it takes in, in the form of jackpots, and all the other small winnings combined. And how much do they take in? Millions. That is why even with only making 3% (97% payback seems a little high, but eh, ...) even if the machine makes 1,000,000 a year, then 3% of that is how much? 30,000. Of course they can still make hand over fist.
As far as the free offers. Good for you. Hook a brother up. My friends have won two trips to Vegas doing local radio station stuff. Never been there myself.
But the reason they cater to people like you, or those $100 a day people, is because empty rooms and empty seats in front of the machines in the casinos is the biggest reason they don't make money. If they can guarantee someone will come in and spend a few bucks here and there, that is a few more bucks here and there they didn't have before, even if they have to eat the cost of some low priced food and drinks, and a bed for the night. They're already paying a cook, and a cleaning crew, they have to pay huge electric/water bills. These are marginal costs to them. Same as a restaurant/bar. Main goal is to put butts in seats. Every empty seat is $1000's.
You can, and yet can't, equate this game to a casino though. There is no grand payback. You can't take that epic that you got lucky off one random key, and sell it for 5000 gems, and then re-buy more chests and continue to get lucky. (Another especially good reason to NOT have trading.) You spend gems, and might get some extra stuff to level your armor, but that is it. And that one armor isn't going to win you the game. You still have to compete against other players, or play smart enough to match elements against the bosses, and heaven forbid other content when it comes out. The game isn't setup to be a "get lucky and win the game" type game. Sure, there are stories of arena players playing for almost free after buying some energy, consistently getting gems out of key rewards, but that should also come with a "results not typical" disclaimer.
My issue with the "general $5 a day/month/whatever idea" people, is that they aren't making the content to where that is enough to get by. I understand it. Does it suck for the 99%? Yeah. But my prior example was on them turning around and literally selling an epic. $5 won't cut it. And it really doesn't get you anywhere in this game. It will barely get you a DPC pull for crying out loud. Again, not saying that it wouldn't work, but they would have to re-work the entire game structure to be able to make it so that people paying $5 felt they were getting their moneys worth. Then what do you do to the people that have spent $1000's? Spit in their face? Magically say "hey, thanks for supporting this game, and all the other f2p players that have never spent money on the game... but, we're changing things so Joe Five Spot can now win the arena with $5. Have a nice day.
I admit I haven't read through the thread aside from the last page and what I may suggest here has probably been mentioned countless times. But HELLO. This is a complaint from a "whale". I spend a lot of money on this game... way too much that if I were to look over my credit card statement, I would most likely delete the game. Luckily for GREE, my girlfriend does that. BUT, here's my problem. After all the countless money I have poured into this game, I am still stuck with poor arena stats, poor epic boss stats, poor war stats, and so on. All of this goes back to the lack of good armor choices I have. Open some chests? Well, I must have horrible luck because I've opened over one thousand chests and have never been lucky enough to get over a three star. Yes, I am being serious! I had to combine multiple times to get my first two epics, which happen to have the lowest stats as epics because they are the oldest ones! I luckily got the beastmaster+ through the gem extravaganza because I thought I would take advantage of the increased chance of getting good armors in the winter chests and I was getting jealous of all these jokers in arena with maxed druids!
Now you have complaints from the average buyer who spends about 40 a month on this game, but what about those of us who spend hundreds and get a pile of dung in return???
So, my suggestion is, there should be an increased chance of getting great epics and legendarys depending on how many chests are opened. I don't want to spend 5000 gems for a bunch of two stars when I can get better chances getting a three or four star from opening the golden chest! I honestly wonder what kind of algorithm your developers used for the winter keys chest, because they excluded my device from it! Increase the chances with each key and you'll increase your profit. Win/win, I believe?
I've seen it done in a lot of the card games with similar rarity based chest content. Open 3 packs at X level, then move up to Y level. Open a few more, then move up to Z level.
I could live with that.