Thanks, Gree - the ONLY Dark Forest prize with worth anything now WORTHLESS

[Zenobia]

They changed the Top 50 prize from 5% alliance defense (GREAT!) to 5% infantry defense (UTTERLY AND COMPLETELY WORTHLESS LIKE EVERY OTHER PRIZE THIS WAR!)

AND they did it less than 24 hour before the start of war, making it NEALY IMPOSSIBLE now for guilds to change their war plans. MANY has specifically planned everything all around that prize. And now, gone! Poof! Along with my last iota of hope for this game.

F U, GREE!

[NinjaHonu]

They changed the Top 50 prize from 5% alliance defense (GREAT!) to 5% infantry defense (UTTERLY AND COMPLETELY WORTHLESS LIKE EVERY OTHER PRIZE THIS WAR!)

AND they did it less than 24 hour before the start of war, making it NEALY IMPOSSIBLE now for guilds to change their war plans. MANY has specifically planned everything all around that prize. And now, gone! Poof! Along with my last iota of hope for this game.

F U, GREE!

Wow Z you are fast! LOL. But I agree.. this is BS! Took weeks to assemble a solid team to push for top 50! FCK!

[Zenobia]

Dear Gree,

1) A lot of guilds were going to spend gems to get the ONLY good prize in this war - Top 50. We are no longer going to spend those gems because you totally nerfed the award to be worth 75-80% less that it was. You are going to lose money over this.

2) A lot of guilds spent the last 2.5 weeks specifically working their guild to be int he best position possible to get that prize. All that effort is now WASTED thanks to you nerfing the prize 15 hours before the start of war. Players are going to quit the game over it. Paying players. You are going to lose money over this.

In conclusion, it is in your own best interest to REINSTATE THE 5% ALLIANCE DEFENSE prize for Top 50.

Sincerely,
Thousands of KA players

[Lys]

Wow.

**** move, I'll agree to that. I was so glad to finally see an Alliance Defense Boost reward, but now it's just a singular category... Tsk tsk.

Outside of Top 3, there's nothing that's must have at this point. I mean, seriously... +2% Honor From Fights... The crap is that?

[Yessfsdd]

Hiya Zeno,

Looks like i'll be seeing more of you at GoW, join my rally, im sure you will figure out who this is :cool:

[War Eagle]

Oh wow. That was the only decent rank prize outside of the top prize. Talk about a BS move, Gree. Doesn't surprise me one bit, though.

[dookie]

skip the war then guys, re-discover real life for a weekend...honestly do you think it is worth loosing sleep over with constant battles? I think not.......6 pack, xbox and BF4 or me

[Namine33]

Wow.

**** move, I'll agree to that. I was so glad to finally see an Alliance Defense Boost reward, but now it's just a singular category... Tsk tsk.

Outside of Top 3, there's nothing that's must have at this point. I mean, seriously... +2% Honor From Fights... The crap is that?

Dont forget the +5% raid gold !!!

[Kendra !!!]

Dont forget the +5% raid gold !!!


Jajajaja yeahhh thats s u c k s !!!! Another bad point GREEdy !!!

[larrydavid]

Suck my balls gree

[PedroPimples]

That's probably dropped my spend by a couple of mountains.

[Quisp]

Well they saved me some cash for the weekend so I guess I should say thanks no point in any gems for this war

[Alexius]

But yet again, we spend. Why wouldn't they?

[Capitalsfanatic]

Nothing will change. Alexis is right on. We'll spend anyway and Gree will rake in revenue...anyway. As long as we customers, collectively, do nothing more than rant & rave, and jump up and down...BUT STILL SPEND...nothing will change.

[KillerKT]

Well said capital

[CJ54]

I checked in with the leads/design team about this one, and this actually wasn't as cut and dried as it appears.

We've never used the flat defense boost in KA as opposed to the typed defense boosts, and we wanted to this time. The problem is, it turns out in testing that that the flat defense boost doesn't work (it just doesn't do anything, in KA). That would take a game update to fix, which we are not able to do before the event. So the choice was to change the boost or to give people a boost that doesn't actually do anything (yet), so we went with the former. We do hope to use the +defense boost in the future though, since it is obviously pretty popular, but it would be preferable that it functions (for obvious reasons).

I do apologize for the lack of messaging on this; the info on this change hadn't made it to everyone yet.

[Alexius]

I checked in with the leads/design team about this one, and this actually wasn't as cut and dried as it appears.

We've never used the flat defense boost in KA as opposed to the typed defense boosts, and we wanted to this time. The problem is, it turns out in testing that that the flat defense boost doesn't work (it just doesn't do anything, in KA). That would take a game update to fix, which we are not able to do before the event. So the choice was to change the boost or to give people a boost that doesn't actually do anything (yet), so we went with the former. We do hope to use the +defense boost in the future though, since it is obviously pretty popular, but it would be preferable that it functions (for obvious reasons).

I do apologize for the lack of messaging on this; the info on this change hadn't made it to everyone yet.

But we wouldn't get the bonus until after war anyways. Couldn't GREE fix the reward that can't be used during war, after the war in an update so that it would be ready? By the time people found out that the boost isn't working properly it could be fixed in an update. A 5% infantry defense is not something to spend that amount of money on, especially when a quest just gave out a 20% magic defense.

The most upsetting part is the planning and preparation that goes into war and it changed so close to war that we didn't have the opportunity to adjust plans.

[Ryans67]

5% alliance is roughly equal to 20% in a single category. Seems like an easy solution.... top 50 should be a 20% defensive boost.

Also... When has Gree started testing things before they are released? New years resolution?

[CJ54]

But we wouldn't get the bonus until after war anyways. Couldn't GREE fix the reward that can't be used during war, after the war in an update so that it would be ready? By the time people found out that the boost isn't working properly it could be fixed in an update. A 5% infantry defense is not something to spend that amount of money on, especially when a quest just gave out a 20% magic defense.

The most upsetting part is the planning and preparation that goes into war and it changed so close to war that we didn't have the opportunity to adjust plans.

Short answer on the first one is, we might have been able to get it working server-side before the end of the event (although that is not certain) but it would have been one of those "hey guys, this is totally working on the server but doesn't show up on your device yet" situations that tend to go over like lead balloons. Due to Apple's 1-2 week review process on game updates (and our resulting workflow to deal with that as efficiently as possible) it takes a good deal longer to get a client update out the door, and a client update would be required to show the effects of the boost. Also, honestly, hacking in hard-coded boosts rather than doing it the proper (longer) way is a recipe for unintended behavior.

If we'd caught this earlier, we could've upped the boost amount, but now that the event is started that is very likely a bad idea. I'm honestly glad this one was caught before the war and we didn't have to change it midstream (or explain to people that they were about to get a bum boost for a couple of weeks).

I do completely understand the frustration about the planning that goes into these things, and I'm not just saying that. I ran a hardcore raiding guild in another game for several years (boy howdy do I ever know the joys of watching all my careful cat-herding go up in flames due to technical stuff) and there's no way around the fact that this sort of last-minute change just stinks. The silver lining at least is that it has us looking at the boosts and also seeing if we can implement this one so that it works, for future use.

[Lys]

Thanks for a relatively quick turnabout on answering this. While still bummed about it, I can understand the reasoning behind it, as you're right about the lead balloon analogy. 5% Infantry Defense is still a bit on the low end here compared to what what listed prior, but eh. I do think whoever comes up with the junk like "+2% Honor From Fights" should be hung from a ceiling fan by their feet though, it truly is a useless boost that eats up something that could be a better incentive to rank. Unlike others, I do still enjoy the raid gold payout, as I'm a heavy raider, even if I only stockpile gold most times lately.

Sounds like there might be a big update soon though, would enjoy to see a bunch of things fixed and better features implemented. Again, thanks for the pretty quick response to this, although if you can find the time I'd suggesst trying to jump ahead of the inevitable oncoming train with a quick heads up on the future if you can.


Short answer on the first one is, we might have been able to get it working server-side before the end of the event (although that is not certain) but it would have been one of those "hey guys, this is totally working on the server but doesn't show up on your device yet" situations that tend to go over like lead balloons. Due to Apple's 1-2 week review process on game updates (and our resulting workflow to deal with that as efficiently as possible) it takes a good deal longer to get a client update out the door, and a client update would be required to show the effects of the boost. Also, honestly, hacking in hard-coded boosts rather than doing it the proper (longer) way is a recipe for unintended behavior.

If we'd caught this earlier, we could've upped the boost amount, but now that the event is started that is very likely a bad idea. I'm honestly glad this one was caught before the war and we didn't have to change it midstream (or explain to people that they were about to get a bum boost for a couple of weeks).

I do completely understand the frustration about the planning that goes into these things, and I'm not just saying that. I ran a hardcore raiding guild in another game for several years (boy howdy do I ever know the joys of watching all my careful cat-herding go up in flames due to technical stuff) and there's no way around the fact that this sort of last-minute change just stinks. The silver lining at least is that it has us looking at the boosts and also seeing if we can implement this one so that it works, for future use.

[PedroPimples]

Why would an alliance attack mod work but an alliance defence mod not?

[CJ54]

Why would an alliance attack mod work but an alliance defence mod not?

That was our initial reaction, too. I believe we just missed it in the big boost standardization project last year and we did not know until now. It's understandable that we wouldn't have noticed; plus-flat-defense is rare in all the games because too much of it could rapidly lead to big blocks of people not able to attack each other successfully. And that rapidly leads to people not playing anymore, seeing as how this is a pvp game. So that particular boost is a rare spice.

[NinjaHonu]

That was our initial reaction, too. I believe we just missed it in the big boost standardization project last year and we did not know until now. It's understandable that we wouldn't have noticed; plus-flat-defense is rare in all the games because too much of it could rapidly lead to big blocks of people not able to attack each other successfully. And that rapidly leads to people not playing anymore, seeing as how this is a pvp game. So that particular boost is a rare spice.

Thanks for the updates CJ. It's much appreciated. I feel like KA forums haven't been getting mod love lately. LOL.

[Shiloh]

First off, that's a very reasonable and detailed response, CJ, Thank you. Secondly the prize after adjustment seems pretty much in line with the rest of the prizes and even a little better than the lvl 50 prize. Maybe this one can be let go?

[Alexius]

It's not supposed to be in line with the rest of the prizes.....it's supposed to get better as you go up...

[Zenobia]

I checked in with the leads/design team about this one, and this actually wasn't as cut and dried as it appears.

We've never used the flat defense boost in KA as opposed to the typed defense boosts, and we wanted to this time. The problem is, it turns out in testing that that the flat defense boost doesn't work (it just doesn't do anything, in KA). That would take a game update to fix, which we are not able to do before the event. So the choice was to change the boost or to give people a boost that doesn't actually do anything (yet), so we went with the former. We do hope to use the +defense boost in the future though, since it is obviously pretty popular, but it would be preferable that it functions (for obvious reasons).

I do apologize for the lack of messaging on this; the info on this change hadn't made it to everyone yet.

Fine If you are unable to give us the awesome prize promised, then PLEASE at least do not substitute a prize 30% of the value of the original prize. If it is to be infantry not alliance defense, then it should become 15-20% not remain 5% totally devaluing it.

[Zenobia]

That was our initial reaction, too. I believe we just missed it in the big boost standardization project last year and we did not know until now. It's understandable that we wouldn't have noticed; plus-flat-defense is rare in all the games because too much of it could rapidly lead to big blocks of people not able to attack each other successfully. And that rapidly leads to people not playing anymore, seeing as how this is a pvp game. So that particular boost is a rare spice.


Obviously, I do not know but I suspect it may be related to the thread Rsd started about how all of our defense is actually already calculated incorrectly, under what it should be. Have you looked into that? Thanks for talking to us a few minutes BTW. I know all your other games are much more important to Gree than we are based on your spending 10 times as much time there as you do with us.

[Shiloh]

It's not supposed to be in line with the rest of the prizes.....it's supposed to get better as you go up...

Top 75 prize = 3% beast defense
Top 50 prize = 5% infantry defense
Top 25 prize = 5% machine attack

To me it's clearly better than the 75 and probably a lot better than the 25.

[Romel]

It's kind of a lose-lose situation for GREE. If they put 20% infantry def, then they would have to upgrade top 25 onwards too.... And the stat inflation issue will be talked about - although it already is an issue .
If they went with 5% alliance defence and it didn't work after war, I'm sure as hell we would give them hell too 😓

[Alexius]

Top 75 prize = 3% beast defense
Top 50 prize = 5% infantry defense
Top 25 prize = 5% machine attack

To me it's clearly better than the 75 and probably a lot better than the 25.

Yes but when you calculate the ROI it's value has decreased substantially, especially when you compare it to previous wars. You can get top 75 mostly free. It takes half a mountain per person average to crack top 50 and a full mountain per person or more to crack top 25. $50 for a 1.25%def increase? Not getting a whole lot better especially when that same half of a mountain gets you a 5% defense increase in an ltq or a 1mil raw stat increase in raid boss.

[Shiloh]

Yes, Alexius, the entire prize scheme for this event is unimpressive for guild rewards, that seems to be the intent and actually a logical one. The elite guilds are creating monster llps without those accounts needing to spend a dime, so boosting individual rewards and reducing guild rewards is clearly GREE's objective. Just like GLTQ's are much less frequent now, and require individual accomplishment to really pay off.

20 mil stat lvl 80 toons that didn't require spending aren't good for anyone.

[Person]

Yes, Alexius, the entire prize scheme for this event is unimpressive for guild rewards, that seems to be the intent and actually a logical one. The elite guilds are creating monster llps without those accounts needing to spend a dime, so boosting individual rewards and reducing guild rewards is clearly GREE's objective. Just like GLTQ's are much less frequent now, and require individual accomplishment to really pay off.

20 mil stat lvl 80 toons that didn't require spending aren't good for anyone.

20m lvl 80 toons only required spending during the previous RB, or Giant spending with the scratchoffs

[Shiloh]

20m lvl 80 toons only required spending during the previous RB, or Giant spending with the scratchoffs

Yes, which was individual spending, winner.....GREE! But it's the massive bonuses those toons have acquired through guild wars that make those legendary units really shine.

[sousas]

Yes.
In a few months we will have units 1 million strong, making the 100k units obsolete, but bonus live forever.

[collage]

Yes.
In a few months we will have units 1 million strong, making the 100k units obsolete, but bonus live forever.

Agreed...... +1

[Master Stormzs]

I wonder if we, the players, can do anything about this??? Anything at all...Still such a shame about the top 50 prize alteration so late before the war. Guess Gree can't have ppl playing passive either as that would reduce potential income streams (asuumig that your defense is high enough that it will fend off a majority of the attackers)

[Rocco69]

anyone know what individual quest lvl 25 requires for win? lvl 24 is 500 for a 12K/19k unit

[Lys]

anyone know what individual quest lvl 25 requires for win? lvl 24 is 500 for a 12K/19k unit
1200 wins this time around. Gives +18% Beast Defense

[Xaix]

Gree instead of changing it to 5% infantry defense u should've changed it to 5% alliance offence.

Also for the individual rewards, the Top 900 and Top 1200 is the same at 9% more defense from magic.
and Top 4500 and Top 5000 is same as well at 6% more defense from magic.