Transparency Required - an open letter to Gree

[ChangeMW]

Don't be fooled by my Junior Member profile on the forum. I am no newbie. I have been playing this game for almost a year now and my faction usually ranks under the top 25 of factions. I never posted on the forum before because I never saw the need, although I have followed everything on here since I started playing.

I have spent thousands of dollars on my addiction to Modern War. Whatever your personal view is of people spending gold, it is irrelevant. It is my choice to do with my money as I please and if you want to comment on that, go troll elsewhere.

My point is, I have invested some serious money here. I have done so because I actually love this game and my team. And despite all the complaints here on the forum, I know the vast majority of you love it too, otherwise you would not be here reading my post. We all just want some things to change.

As someone with a vested financial interest in this game and as someone who cares about the future of this game, I believe I have the right to raise legitimate concerns without fear of being banned. I also believe Gree owes me, and in fact all of you, a comprehensive response on these issues and not an automated email in the hope that we will go away and continue spending. In fact, I am sure I am speaking on behalf of the majority of the Modern War community when I say what I am about to say.

Gree, you promised to be transparent. Unfortunately a lot of things seem to be going on that suggest you are anything but. In fact, some very questionable things seem to be taking place – or at least that is what we are starting to believe. This is all fine and well when people are not spending real money, but when you are dealing with consumers who pay you real money, it becomes a very different ball game. We have rights as consumers and above all deserve to be told what we are spending our money on. You, on the other hand, have a duty to treat us fairly. You are an international business, so you should know that.

I would ask Gree to reply in open forum to each of the following questions, as they go to the heart of whether we are all treated fairly. Give us comfort, Gree, that there is a level playing field so that we can move on and continue to spend money and play this game.

1. Players or Factions with connections to Gree: Do any players or factions have any connections with Gree that could give them an advantage over any other players? This would include, for example, players who are rewarded with gold, units, money or other incentives for providing assistance of some sort to Gree; factions who are able to request Gree to change top prizes during WD Events or otherwise cause Gree to intervene; or players who have any affiliation with Gree (such as employees or contractors of Gree who also have live accounts in the game and who participate in events). If so, how many players fall in this category and are any of them in any of the top 10 factions? If some sort of "reward" program exists for those who assist Gree, please provide details of this and how all players can join (I assume it will be open to everyone, not just a select few).

2. Information: Are any players or factions privy to any information about the game that would give them an advantage over other players? For example, are any players given information about upcoming events, releases, new buildings, the way in which quests will be run or other changes to the game before they are implemented? If so how can all players get access to this same information so we are not disadvantaged?

3. Access to Gree Support: Do any players or factions have priority access to Gree support or Gree developers? If so, can all other players obtain this same level of access? If not, what "categories" do you operate and what do players need to do in order to get this same access?

4. Access to Gree systems: Do any players have access to Gree systems or servers? If so, please provide details. What steps do you take to ensure your servers and systems cannot be accessed by players in an unauthorized way to manipulate the game in their favor and to the detriment of other players? Rumors persist that some individuals in the very top factions can access and change game data. Are you aware of these rumors and can you give us all absolute comfort that is not the case?

5. Lifespan of Modern War: Lots of us have asked whether all the recent changes signal your "last hurrah!" with this game. We are left wondering, are you trying to get the last bit of revenue from us before consigning Modern War to the scrap heap? Everything points to it: events have become ridiculously expensive and the stats inflation is simply not sustainable. Gree, tell us, do you plan to close down the game at some point? Do you have a date in mind? Can you give us an undertaking that you will inform all of the MW community at least three months in advance if you do decide to pull the plug, so we can stop spending and burn through our piles of gold? Or will you commit to refund all gold left unspent at the point that you close the game?

I hope to hear from you very shortly on this, Gree. I think we all do. If you do not see fit to reply, or delete this or ban me, so be it. We will all draw our own conclusions from that.

Thank you for your time and look forward to open dialogue on these issues.

[Agent Orange]

Good questions

[Bobar]

Would like to know the answers

[Maddog's Wife]

I would like to see official answers the the above referenced questions. Thank you for asking them, Change.

[Maddog11]

Bump for answers

[soonerjlc]

It would be truly amazing to see how huge the impact would be if the leadership at Gree would address these questions. I think many others feel as I do, the game and community are wonderful, but I am hesitant to continue to invest money due to concerns about how long the game will be around.

[MadAtWorld]

Gree is not a new company. Modern War is not its first game. Look at other games they had that are no longer around for answers. This game, and all others, are not intended for long term play. A few years at most. The company is continually investing in "the next big thing". Research and development. Paying programmers for a product that is not yet earning any revenues. When a game begins to lose money, they must end it, so that their new projects still in development can continue to release. Each game also requires servers and customer support. In past Gree games, they have shut down with notice ahead of time. However, their stance on the gold issue has always been that you spend it or lose it. No refunds, no exchanges, nothing. My advice... buy only what you need for this month, do not stockpile.

I sympathize with the amounts of money spent on accounts. I have done so as well. However, it saves me a great deal of frustration having a slightly different view of my "investment". I equate the money I spend in Modern War and ither games as an entertainment expense. The same as if I were to go to a movie or a football game. If the movie is not a blockbuster or your favorite team loses, you are not entitled to a refund. I do not consider those investments, they were more like rent, a way to enjoy my time for a few hours. That being said, you may have seen me post in forum before about getting what I pay for, or getting my money's worth. Both of those gold true. If you went to a movie and the sound was not working you should expect to receive a free ticket to another showing because you did not get the entertainment you paid for.

I am 100% in support of transparency. All consumers have a right to know what they are buying and to get what they paid for. But Gree will not answer your questions. For anything they say can and will be used against them. Good luck though, sometimes miracles do happen. Perhaps being the one-millionth customer to pose the question you'll be rewarded with an answer.

[Aks]

They will never answer these question.. They running a business.. No one discloses the business strategies.. They really just dont care.. But still you might get lucky to have answers.. In that case you will be extreme luky with all due respect..

[1GaDawg85]

What answers????

[ChangeMW]

@MadAtWorld: I think you are getting the wrong end of the stick here. I am not trying to get back some of the money I spent on the game. At some point I will quit or the game will be shut down, and I won't get back a cent. It is money spent on entertainment, gone forever and I will have nothing to show for it. What I do want to know going forward, though, is whether we are all playing the same game, or whether there are people or factions that have an unfair advantage over 99% of the other players. The answer to my questions may hasten my and other players' decision about when to stop our spending on this particular form of entertainment, or may give me the assurance I am looking for to continue to spend.

@Aks: You also misunderstand. This is not about Gree's business strategies at all. I am asking a seller to explain its product to me, the customer. If I pay to enrol for a competition, I am entitled to know whether my entry fee buys me the same chance as any other competitor or if others have an unfair advantage over me. This is basic consumer law all over the world. If the competition owner refuses to answer I will infer from that there is something it wishes not to tell me, so I will not spend. And if it lures me into spending by giving false answers (or if it omits to tell me something that it knows will influence my decision - and more about that later) then it has a case to answer.

[honest Abe]

Rumors of this games death are greatly exaggerated. That said, it is hard to develop a user base like mw with recurring revenue. Gree has tried, all their recent games have been flops. Cc, ka and mw are their ONLY successful titles with significant and recurring revenues. Their Asian business is a disaster thanks to the court ruling, you would think they would be taking more care of one of their few hits. They are trying to stabilize and grow revenue but are getting to the point where they are getting blood out of stones. For those of you who need a lesson, this company is valued on a revenue multiple basis, they higher the growth rate the higher the multiple. One bad quarter and the multiple goes down. Given Japan is flat , they are trying show growth from the us. The problem is if they are not careful revenue will go down. It's sort of like state taxes, there is an optimal point to raise to before aggregate revenues begin to decline as people move. This has not yet reached terminal velocity but they are pushing the limits.

[rellehcs]

Bump for good luck.

Great questions, but I doubt we will see any real answers...Just denial mixed in with more smoke and mirrors.

[Tealeaf]

I have read in the forum before some time ago a SUP member admitting he had met in person with senior person within Gree, but I can't remember the thread. He was answering a number of questions thrown at him.

[Esohceekayes]

Thank you for your email. We have passed your concerns on to our programmers. We now consider this issue closed.

[K4S]

Highly doubt we will see any answers, but would like to bump just incase.

[Swamp rat]

Great questions asked but I feel like the others they will not be answered. I've only spent hundreds maybe close to a grand on this game my addiction as well. It will be a disappointment when it ends because there have been a lot of freindships made thru this game and others like it. I would like to know how much traffic these games give Group me and Palringo it's probably enormous.

[yan840016765]

Great questions asked but I feel like the others they will not be answered. I've only spent hundreds maybe close to a grand on this game my addiction as well. It will be a disappointment when it ends because there have been a lot of freindships made thru this game and others like it. I would like to know how much traffic these games give Group me and Palringo it's probably enormous.

They should charge palringo, Line, Kakao, Group me and whatever chat channel that ppl have to use to replace the crappy in game channel GREE might intentionally set up that way. Then this game will probably last longer than what we expect LOL

[2000y2k]

Just like diverguy or whatever his name is who always posts info about the new cash buildings a week before they come out. How do you even get that info and if he can get it why can't Gree post it for everyone?? Seems like pretty basic questions.

Why do some have access to information that others do not and what other info do they have that they choose not to share?

[Hupernikomen]

CJ response to the thread asking him which SUP faction he was in:

Here we go again. I should sticky something about this in the helpful threads section so someone can just link to it every time it comes up.

I haven't actually used my live account in over a year and half, except to boot up and test specific features. I've never been a member of any faction in the game aside from a one-person test faction I haven't used in a year. It's just easier that way. There are other staff members who have had accounts, but we have a super-strict "no giving yourself stuff on the live servers" policy specifically to avoid advantages like that (I've actually banned the account of a staff member who was newer and hadn't gotten the memo) and none of them are in factions that have placed on the boards.

---------------------

CJ, why not answer the reasonable questions posted above.

While you are answering those I have a few to add:

1. Why is it so hard to explain events in detail before they come out? At least A&F makes an attempt on CC

2. How many players are beta testers, and what in game advantage do they receive?

3. Why does every event have an implentation fiasco? Do you have any sort of qc department at all that monitors these games?

4. Why has gree fractured the player base by inflating stats and making all new players and any future players meaningless to established factions?

5. Has gree considered starting a second server where the game can start fresh free from all the history of hackers and to allow players who have finally wrapped their brain around the game an opportunity to start fresh and be relevant?
I would be happy to leave this server to the giants in the top 100. They will keep spending their gold to try and stay #1 and a huge player base would be opened up to new found competitiveness in mw2. I have seen this done successfully with other games. Yes, i know you have new games, but those are not mw. This structure is the best. Start fresh and don't go crazy with the stat inflation. 10% growth per quarter in stats of prizes is plenty.

I know you are mainly a message board moderator and go between, but surely you can chase down some real answers for us.

[Octane]

Well said!! Being a junior member here myself but have also been playing the game for close to two years I ask myself those same questions everyday. Especially after seeing so many top factions splitting and going for streaks. Doubt those questions will ever get answered but at the same time I feel answers are owed to us.

[Jerle]

I can answer some of these. Though on a philosophical note: Why do you think you'd get banned over this? Usually people who get banned are the ones who come in with guns blazing, wearing, and general unpleasant attitudes - this is one of the better written and well constructed posts like this I've seen in a while.



1. Players or Factions with connections to Gree: Do any players or factions have any connections with Gree that could give them an advantage over any other players? This would include, for example, players who are rewarded with gold, units, money or other incentives for providing assistance of some sort to Gree; factions who are able to request Gree to change top prizes during WD Events or otherwise cause Gree to intervene; or players who have any affiliation with Gree (such as employees or contractors of Gree who also have live accounts in the game and who participate in events). If so, how many players fall in this category and are any of them in any of the top 10 factions? If some sort of "reward" program exists for those who assist Gree, please provide details of this and how all players can join (I assume it will be open to everyone, not just a select few).


Some employees play MW and our other games. This is normal in the gaming industry - how can you improve your own product if you don't play it? To my knowledge none of us are in any of the top 100 factions anywhere. No lists or identifies of such players will be provided.

We do reserve the right to occasionally reward players who have been extremely helpful for one reason or another. A few hacking fixes last year were helped along by some dedicated players who sent in detailed steps on how to reproduce. This is fairly rare though.



2. Information: Are any players or factions privy to any information about the game that would give them an advantage over other players? For example, are any players given information about upcoming events, releases, new buildings, the way in which quests will be run or other changes to the game before they are implemented? If so how can all players get access to this same information so we are not disadvantaged?


We don't release information ahead of time outside of the company. There are occasionally users who've figured out how to decode some things in the data sets and get sneak peaks of upcoming features that we've deployed but not activated - this would be how some people post LTBs and whatever before they arrive. Improving this is on the bucket list.



3. Access to Gree Support: Do any players or factions have priority access to Gree support or Gree developers? If so, can all other players obtain this same level of access? If not, what "categories" do you operate and what do players need to do in order to get this same access?


Support ticket triage is a complicated business anywhere you go. All I'm going to go into here is that while there may be varying response times for any given ticket, the team is always working to bring down the queue size and answer everyone as fast as possible. Since last year the average response time has improved by literally days.



4. Access to Gree systems: Do any players have access to Gree systems or servers? If so, please provide details. What steps do you take to ensure your servers and systems cannot be accessed by players in an unauthorized way to manipulate the game in their favor and to the detriment of other players? Rumors persist that some individuals in the very top factions can access and change game data. Are you aware of these rumors and can you give us all absolute comfort that is not the case?


Read back on the forums about a year (before I started posting) and you'll notice a LOT more threads about hacking. Skillpoints hacks, various item hacks, etc - we've dealt with quite a number of security problems and the game is in a good state now. Engineering takes credible reports of exploits very seriously and any new expoits are smashed as soon as we can find them. No outside sources have privilged access to our servers.

Anyone who says they can change game data is lying. There have been various player exploits, but something that can change game data for all users has never happened and would be a giant bonfire's worth of alarm bells the moment it happened.



5. Lifespan of Modern War: Lots of us have asked whether all the recent changes signal your "last hurrah!" with this game. We are left wondering, are you trying to get the last bit of revenue from us before consigning Modern War to the scrap heap? Everything points to it: events have become ridiculously expensive and the stats inflation is simply not sustainable. Gree, tell us, do you plan to close down the game at some point? Do you have a date in mind? Can you give us an undertaking that you will inform all of the MW community at least three months in advance if you do decide to pull the plug, so we can stop spending and burn through our piles of gold? Or will you commit to refund all gold left unspent at the point that you close the game?


We're in the middle of developing a cool new event and some new features for Modern War, which you should see early this year. You don't do that on a game anyone's intending on closing.

[whammo]

I can answer some of these. Though on a philosophical note: Why do you think you'd get banned over this? Usually people who get banned are the ones who come in with guns blazing, wearing, and general unpleasant attitudes - this is one of the better written and well constructed posts like this I've seen in a while.


Not true and you know it.

I'm living proof of that.

Thanks for showing up to at least provide an acknowledgment of the questions posed to Gree.

[CJ54]

Support ticket triage is a complicated business anywhere you go. All I'm going to go into here is that while there may be varying response times for any given ticket, the team is always working to bring down the queue size and answer everyone as fast as possible. Since last year the average response time has improved by literally days.

I can expand on that one a bit: everyone goes through the ticketing system for resolution of issues. Everyone. If you mail, call, send a carrier pigeon, whatever, you end up answered via ticket (and slower in those cases, usually). If you have a question or concern, it goes through the tickets. I used to occasionally pull a particularly ugly issue sent via PM in the forums when I had time to spare from the normal day, but I haven't done so in a very long time because A: It's inconsistent and B: people then flood my inbox with individual issues rather than sending them to the (much larger than me) Support team.

As for the average response time, this time last year (at the height of the new faction feature craziness) it was hovering somewhere around 15 days for a first response. As abominable as that sounds, that is actually very close to industry standard. We're currently around a 5 day average response time (usually lower with intermittent spikes), although this varies based on staff and incoming ticket volume. If a bad flu is wrecking the Support department during a widespread WD issue, response times are going to go up.


Not true and you know it.

I'm living proof of that.

Thanks for showing up to at least provide an acknowledgment of the questions posed to Gree.

Jerle doesn't moderate the forums. If you have an issue with moderation, you can send me a PM.

[whammo]

I can expand on that one a bit: everyone goes through the ticketing system for resolution of issues. Everyone. If you mail, call, send a carrier pigeon, whatever, you end up answered via ticket (and slower in those cases, usually). If you have a question or concern, it goes through the tickets. I used to occasionally pull a particularly ugly issue sent via PM in the forums when I had time to spare from the normal day, but I haven't done so in a very long time because A: It's inconsistent and B: people then flood my inbox with individual issues rather than sending them to the (much larger than me) Support team.

As for the average response time, this time last year (at the height of the new faction feature craziness) it was hovering somewhere around 15 days for a first response. As abominable as that sounds, that is actually very close to industry standard. We're currently around a 5 day average response time (usually lower with intermittent spikes), although this varies based on staff and incoming ticket volume. If a bad flu is wrecking the Support department during a widespread WD issue, response times are going to go up.



Jerle doesn't moderate the forums. If you have an issue with moderation, you can send me a PM.

This basically confirms what has been my experience over the past year. Normally when there is an issue worth reporting, a player is somehow being unfairly compensated for event progress or progress on an event is impeded completely. Unfortunately, if you submit a ticket, your issue has no chance of being resolved prior to the conclusion of said event.

After the first four or five times of unsuccessfully reaching resolution of an issue, and then being basically told to pack sand when trying to seek recompense.

I no longer fill out support tickets for anything as I know what the end result will likely be. Is there any effort being made to make improvements in this area of the game? A better system or even just a few more able bodies would make a world of difference.

Actually that would require more effort than its worth. Changing policy, however, to a "customer is always right" policy... especially when there is screenshots to support claims or no evidence to the contrary would probably make the most sense.

Thanks for taking time to reply.

[whammo]

Jerle doesn't moderate the forums. If you have an issue with moderation, you can send me a PM.

I may just do that when my secondary now primary account is unbanned...

[CJ54]

I may just do that when my secondary now primary account is unbanned...

Well, not to get too much into unrelated forum moderation process here, but considering that using multiple forums accounts is generally grounds for one or both being permanently banned (we only allow one, check the sticky at the top) I'd say you're doing pretty well at the moment. Again, send me a PM.


This basically confirms what has been my experience over the past year. Normally when there is an issue worth reporting, a player is somehow being unfairly compensated for event progress or progress on an event is impeded completely. Unfortunately, if you submit a ticket, your issue has no chance of being resolved prior to the conclusion of said event.

If we have to individually clear the issue and it is widespread, that is going to be true, but we generally do global fixes these days for those types of issue. Those generally happen with one weekday of the cause being found, although if the issue is just going to keep happening over and over during the event we may have to hold off until said event is over.

[whammo]

Well, not to get too much into unrelated forum moderation process here, but considering that using multiple forums accounts is generally grounds for one or both being permanently banned (we only allow one, check the sticky at the top) I'd say you're doing pretty well at the moment. Again, send me a PM.

Sure I'll do that... had my main account not been permanently banned for literally no reason I would still be sticking to one account. I'll PM ya.

[andy2]

If we have to individually clear the issue and it is widespread, that is going to be true, but we generally do global fixes these days for those types of issue. Those generally happen with one weekday of the cause being found, although if the issue is just going to keep happening over and over during the event we may have to hold off until said event is over.

How about the recent boss event fiasco when the bug was found and then waited multiple days and over an entire war event to be fixed. There have been multiple calm and reasonable posts just like this one asking for a response on the topic only to be ignored. CJ you do seem like a reasonable guy you really do, but telling people to 'calm down' over that bug and that it 'had absolutely no affect on the war' are just outrageous and untrue statements. Please address the situation and why it is OK to delay fixing the event until after the WD event therefore putting all of those who should have gotten the reward at a disadvantage to all of those who did not earn the reward.

[Inimical]

I for one would like to know reward level tiers.
I personally received 700 gold for an undisclosed reason about 10 months ago. I was/am very greatful. It's the most gold I've ever had.

But there has been multiple reports of player(s) receiving 5 and 6 figures in gold; on more than one occasion. If that player received the minimum 5 figure amount; at 10,000 gold that is over $600 in free merchandise! And, I was there when that member bragged about it happening multiple times. Once, yeah ok, twice? That makes them a white hat hacker. Which is either a violation of the terms of service; yeah, I read it. Or, it makes them a contractor or staff member of Gree. This person is known on the forums and in game; and he damn sure is in a top 100 faction. If this player had been rewarded with $600 in indestructible items, this person would have been a monster than and a middling player now. Instead he used it over and over during WD earing at least 300% in attack and defense bonuses.

I would like to know if the policy of rewarding violations of YOUR terms of service is still precedent and the actual amounts.

[CJ54]

I for one would like to know reward level tiers.
I personally received 700 gold for an undisclosed reason about 10 months ago. I was/am very greatful. It's the most gold I've ever had.

But there has been multiple reports of player(s) receiving 5 and 6 figures in gold; on more than one occasion. If that player received the minimum 5 figure amount; at 10,000 gold that is over $600 in free merchandise! And, I was there when that member bragged about it happening multiple times. Once, yeah ok, twice? That makes them a white hat hacker. Which is either a violation of the terms of service; yeah, I read it. Or, it makes them a contractor or staff member of Gree. This person is known on the forums and in game; and he damn sure is in a top 100 faction. If this player had been rewarded with $600 in indestructible items, this person would have been a monster than and a middling player now. Instead he used it over and over during WD earing at least 300% in attack and defense bonuses.

You're talking about the bonus program. You can send a message to Support asking for details on the bonus program and they will send you the explanation of that one. It doesn't have anything to do with reporting technical issues.

[Hooligany]

I can answer some of these. Though on a philosophical note: Why do you think you'd get banned over this? Usually people who get banned are the ones who come in with guns blazing, wearing, and general unpleasant attitudes - this is one of the better written and well constructed posts like this I've seen in a while.



Some employees play MW and our other games. This is normal in the gaming industry - how can you improve your own product if you don't play it? To my knowledge none of us are in any of the top 100 factions anywhere. No lists or identifies of such players will be provided.

We do reserve the right to occasionally reward players who have been extremely helpful for one reason or another. A few hacking fixes last year were helped along by some dedicated players who sent in detailed steps on how to reproduce. This is fairly rare though.



We don't release information ahead of time outside of the company. There are occasionally users who've figured out how to decode some things in the data sets and get sneak peaks of upcoming features that we've deployed but not activated - this would be how some people post LTBs and whatever before they arrive. Improving this is on the bucket list.



Support ticket triage is a complicated business anywhere you go. All I'm going to go into here is that while there may be varying response times for any given ticket, the team is always working to bring down the queue size and answer everyone as fast as possible. Since last year the average response time has improved by literally days.



Read back on the forums about a year (before I started posting) and you'll notice a LOT more threads about hacking. Skillpoints hacks, various item hacks, etc - we've dealt with quite a number of security problems and the game is in a good state now. Engineering takes credible reports of exploits very seriously and any new expoits are smashed as soon as we can find them. No outside sources have privilged access to our servers.

Anyone who says they can change game data is lying. There have been various player exploits, but something that can change game data for all users has never happened and would be a giant bonfire's worth of alarm bells the moment it happened.



We're in the middle of developing a cool new event and some new features for Modern War, which you should see early this year. You don't do that on a game anyone's intending on closing.

Hi,

1. May I also join in to help gree identify some game issues etc so that I can be rewarded? I don't mind to be a beta tester if needed.
2. If information of following events r not released to employees or external players, how do people obtain such information? Isn't there a non disclosure agreement that the employees new to adhere to in order to prevent leaks?
3. If players can access information on upcoming events, Gree should be better off by providing information and explanation to educate or walk through the players in an open forum like here instead. Having more information off the official forum discredits the gaming developers.
4. With most of the events now being increasingly difficult n challenging, is this how each event will progress? By encouraging more spending n rewarding only those who r able to complete, leaving behind others who spend lots of time but non or light gold players to struggle n give up?
Majority of the game is funded n profited from the top 20% of spenders but the remaining low spenders of 80% is what keep the game alive with activity. Have that in mind else you will have too limited players playing that all the heavy gold users find the game too boring to play any further.

I hope that events should be made challenging but not impossible for 95% of the players to complete.
Have clear communication n instructions on how new events r played.
Do enough testing before releasing new events to prevent bad customer experience which in turn overloads your CSOs.
Be transparent n truthful to your paying customers. Never try to cover up a mistake by lying as players r not stupid.

[Inimical]

Cj54,
I am no novice.
I know the gold program, I've never qualified, but I understand how it works.

Please don't make me spell it out. How many players have received 50k in gold while helping your QC department do their damned jobs? And, again if it's 25k gold lets not act like that is the cut off line. There are multiple ayers as you stated that have found holes and sent step by step instructions on fixing them. Please don't tell us that it never occurred to you all that the way they figured this out was by themselves hacking.


And hooligany, cj54 answered your question about #2. Players can decide game updates.

[CJ54]

Cj54,
I am no novice.
I know the gold program, I've never qualified, but I understand how it works.

Please don't make me spell it out. How many players have received 50k in gold while helping your QC department do their damned jobs? And, again if it's 25k gold lets not act like that is the cut off line. There are multiple ayers as you stated that have found holes and sent step by step instructions on fixing them. Please don't tell us that it never occurred to you all that the way they figured this out was by themselves hacking.


And hooligany, cj54 answered your question about #2. Players can decide game updates.

That's nuts. At those amounts, you are talking about the bonus program or fantasy scenarios.

Speaking as someone who's spent an ungodly amount of time pouring over in-game comments and forum posts, players say all sorts of stuff. We perma-mute 3 or 4 trolls a month for claiming to be GREE employees (note for anyone reading: don't do that), there was that awful chain message promising X gold and Y in-game cash if people posted it on Z number of player walls (note to anyone reading: don't do that, you'll get banned), people regularly claim to be hacking when they aren't to upset people they are raiding repeatedly, and PJ famously claimed to have a cloaking device for a couple of weeks back in 2012 and got us a couple hundred tickets from people asking why THEY didn't have a cloaking device.

Follow these kinds of thing up with good 'ol games of telephone and you arrive at a whole lot of mistaken assumptions.

Also, I don't know what you mean about players deciding game updates. I'm pretty sure I didn't say that, because they don't. Jerle did forget about the beta players though, and sometimes beta players leak info when they aren't supposed to (that happened in a different thread a little while ago, actually). It's pretty unheard of NOT to have beta testers, for just about anything.

[Inimical]

Sorry cj54, that was players DECODE updates. That's how they know content ahead of time.

Gotta love autocorrect. Sometimes Siri and I speak different languages.

And I'd rather PM you my question instead of starting another bonfire of inquiries. I'd rather say them here and have the question answered once and for all. But I'll voice my concerns privately and hopefully you can address the concerns.

[Thief]

Transparency:

Honestly most of the questions that have been asked have all been answered at one point or another (although perhaps there needs to be a sticky public statement added to the top to allow the transparency to be open going forward)

Now what i don't understand is why we can't get specific details about events. The medals event for example was a new event. You stated that ALL events would need to be complete and that X amount of medals would be awarded from each event type. However that wasn't quite true so while some didn't get the memo about needing all events complete and spent 30k+ gold to complete others gave up early because they didn't want to take the 30k gold risk.

The biggest issue is communication. Yes you maybe had more people spend the 30k this time but they won't do it again. So where did the 14 medasl that everyone was awarded come from? was that from 1500 attacks during WD? Isn't that one of those all encompassing EVERY event? I understand in the situation your not going to be able to make everyone happy but how about a guide on how you plan the next 70 medals to be? Crime City has A&F spell things out for the community:

Why not say Medals

Crate Auctions (4) Medals 1 at 5, 10, 15, 20 Bows
Black Skull Commander (?) Medals at....X, X, X and X...
Limited Time Mission (10?) 4 Medals for completing Normal and 6 for prestige
Epic Boss (10) Medal for every other goal. Must complete 100
Lockbox (4) 1 at 5,10,15,20
Cuba: 1500 attacks, (14 medals?) Faction streak wins (4 medals) *must reach 12/12 and Faction wins (4 medals) must rach 50 wins

[whammo]

Transparency:

Honestly most of the questions that have been asked have all been answered at one point or another (although perhaps there needs to be a sticky public statement added to the top to allow the transparency to be open going forward)

Now what i don't understand is why we can't get specific details about events. The medals event for example was a new event. You stated that ALL events would need to be complete and that X amount of medals would be awarded from each event type. However that wasn't quite true so while some didn't get the memo about needing all events complete and spent 30k+ gold to complete others gave up early because they didn't want to take the 30k gold risk.

The biggest issue is communication. Yes you maybe had more people spend the 30k this time but they won't do it again. So where did the 14 medasl that everyone was awarded come from? was that from 1500 attacks during WD? Isn't that one of those all encompassing EVERY event? I understand in the situation your not going to be able to make everyone happy but how about a guide on how you plan the next 70 medals to be? Crime City has A&F spell things out for the community:

Why not say Medals

Crate Auctions (4) Medals 1 at 5, 10, 15, 20 Bows
Black Skull Commander (?) Medals at....X, X, X and X...
Limited Time Mission (10?) 4 Medals for completing Normal and 6 for prestige
Epic Boss (10) Medal for every other goal. Must complete 100
Lockbox (4) 1 at 5,10,15,20
Cuba: 1500 attacks, (14 medals?) Faction streak wins (4 medals) *must reach 12/12 and Faction wins (4 medals) must rach 50 wins

This type of approach is extremely.easy and takes very little effort. In exchange? You'll receive the benefit of much happier players who are informed about why they actually are playing.

Would love to see some better communication on game events. I've noticed the same thing on crime city boards, Thief.

[ChangeMW]

CJ, thank you for taking the time to reply. And apologies for not coming back to you earlier, I have been a bit busy.

You ask why I would be concerned about getting banned. To be honest I have seen friends banned left right and centre on here for simply raising issues. So you have to understand that this is an issue. Instead of letting this thread go on and on, I will create new ones on specific issues as and when.

Thanks again for responding. I am hoping this will continue as long as I raise issues that many other players are concerned about as well.

[The Pharoah]

I think there are two ideas in all these questions that people need to grasp:

1) Players and factions who consistently place highly are spending HUGE amounts on gold, and are hugely organised both as players and as factions. My credit card bill probably features about £600 worth of transactions on this game this month, and my recent stat increases basically prove that the more you spend, the stronger you get, and the less you spend, the weaker you will typically be in comparison to players of your level. Ditto for organisation - the more closely your faction works together, the better the rewards.

2)The lack of information generally about rewards/objectives/targets is not accidental. Like most companies, I imagine Gree makes most of its money from an elite of customers (remember the game is free to play) and some of those customers - like myself - are quite clearly a bit obsessive/compulsive about pursuing reward units. If I commit a vault of gold to an objective, I will have to spend whatever is necessary above that to finish that objective and get the reward, or the money I have already spent is essentially wasted. This urge to 'go the extra mile' is very powerful and if you were to know exactly what was required in order to complete every objective and earn the monster rewards *in advance* you'd be more likely to say "Hell naw" and just do what you could and save your money for something else. Your logical mind craves information to plan with, but your instinctive mind is screaming "Must...complete...must...complete!!!" Guess which one is easier to sell to?

[MW_player]

Just like diverguy or whatever his name is who always posts info about the new cash buildings a week before they come out. How do you even get that info and if he can get it why can't Gree post it for everyone?? Seems like pretty basic questions.

Why do some have access to information that others do not and what other info do they have that they choose not to share?
The MW toolkit available in the App Store gives you this info. It is free.

[ChangeMW]

@ The Pharaoh: I too spend insane amounts on this game. And I agree you need to do this in order to keep getting stronger. But there is a fundamental problem underlying all of this: The vast majority of stats increases these days come through boost units. So even if you spend enough to get the same toys as the guys in the layer just above you, you will never catch up to them.

Your stats may go up by the same percentage as theirs, but in real hard number terms, they will continue to pull away from you. The boost units just ensure the relative gap between players stays the same. So those who are currently on top will forever stay on top unless our hosts Gree change something to give us a chance to catch those who are ahead of us.

The other problem with this is that events like the Boss seem to be based on the total attack devastation that a top player in the range could deliver. And since the top players will in real terms be able to score much more than you as time goes on, it will become increasingly impossible for you to get the same prizes unless you spend disproportionately more than the top guys.

Not sure what the answer is, or if there is one.