Reinstate epic armor fusing.

[taylor1993]

It needs to be done. It is the only way to allow f2p players a fun game. I personally am not f2p but I feel that if gree wanted to make epics unfusable it should have been done from the start. Now the spending elite will just further themselves from the majority of the player-base. With that being said I do believe that the rates should be nerfed. They made a huge mistake with how easy it was to get a epic with the right combo.

[BileJAR]

Epics were too easy to fuse, due to the low variety in epic armors. I am in fact content with this. If you want to get Epic armors, open the chests, if not, then don't. The mono legendary armors are decent enough.

[Tachycardia]

Won't happen.

It will flood the game with epics and, more importantly, it will reduce their overall revenue.

[gnolaum]

I know why they removed; so that people wouldn't cry about not being able to get Beast Keys since they fused it already. If Beast Keys/Chests are a legitimate, non-cash, method of getting Epics on par with the difficulty of fusing epics then I won't complain.

But perhaps Gree is considering turning fusion back on after the quest involving the armors is complete?

If they are on par with the rest of the chests (i.e. a really bad gambling game to harvest money from those with either too much money, or too little self-control), then I'll be annoyed.

[taylor1993]

It's going to reduce their revenue in the long run. They have made endgame content exclusive. It alienates so man people. They should reintroduce them with a newly designed fusion rate. It could be done. I do agree they were far to easy to obtain.

[Tim9870]

Someone in my guild fused tectonic 2 days ago. I guess there's still a chance maybe just lower.

[Rafa]

So... since last week:

1 - cant fuse epics -> ok, i will buy gems and open chests as usual or spend on gw
2 - Get **** from chests (expected, whatever)
3 - There is still the brand new gw, woot! -> cheaters are making me spend gems just to defeat their guardians and this keeps happening to everyone. Really gree??
4 - Why am I still playing this game? Its not like I dont buy gems... its just too much stuff at once, you are being super greedy imo for me to be ok about it. Will try to win next gw, if issues like this are still hitting the game theb you lost a reliable customer.

Hope you got good stuff coming up

[SerKnight]

Someone in my guild fused tectonic 2 days ago. I guess there's still a chance maybe just lower.

Got proof of this?

[SolarWind]

So... since last week:

1 - cant fuse epics -> ok, i will buy gems and open chests as usual or spend on gw
2 - Get **** from chests (expected, whatever)
3 - There is still the brand new gw, woot! -> cheaters are making me spend gems just to defeat their guardians and this keeps happening to everyone. Really gree??
4 - Why am I still playing this game? Its not like I dont buy gems... its just too much stuff at once, you are being super greedy imo for me to be ok about it. Will try to win next gw, if issues like this are still hitting the game theb you lost a reliable customer.

Hope you got good stuff coming up

Hi guys, I'm new to the Forum.

Couldn't agree more with Rafa.

Yes, I also think that getting Epic was wayyy to easy - there should be no guaranteed combo. However, the problem I have with the current system is:

1) you get many unwanted armours from chance chests (I have 2 of the same Epics). Fusion was a nice way to use them. I think they should change to make fusion difficult e.g. you need at least one EPIC armour (obtained from chest only) in the mix to fuse a different Epic armour. I think that is fair.

2) Too much reliant on lottery system. Personally, I would like to see:

- An additional option to buy non-plus versions of ALL armours that is NOT part of GW rewards (this still gives people incentive to win GW to get the best armours). This can be the 999 gems for legendary and 1999+ gems for epic (or whatever), at least you know what you will get. I think overall, more people would end up spending as they do get what they want rather than relying on dumb luck.

- Keep the + version as non-guarantee only so people who want the best will need to spend more on average to get the best

- Keep the normal chance chest so people who don't want to spend as much still have the chance.

This way, I think they will end up with happier customers (not that they care). I mean, a guy who is prepared to spend £1000 on the game for whatever reason should have more control and walk away with something good. Yes, some people get lucky that's fine, but I think making your high paying customer happy seems like a better strategy than just pure lottery. Also, winning GW shouldn't be the only objective, some of us might just want to collect the armour they like.

Just my opinion. Thanks for reading guys.

[iH8t2lose2]

Someone in my guild fused tectonic 2 days ago. I guess there's still a chance maybe just lower.
Was he the same person who bought all of your element bonuses ?

[Lieda]

I do not agree with epic fusing, but Id like to see + versions fusing. 2 maxed regulars = plus version.

Epic should be left on chests, however, Gree can you please let us get it? Making it so the chance is 0,1% wont help, 2X Chances or even 4X chances special chests are just meaningless. The banners are so nicely made, the armors so well exihibited but the chances so RETARDED that personally i consider scam. Yes someone will get one eventually otherwise it would be simply a lie, wich we wouldnt take it easily.. But gree makes people believe they will actually get anything... Something is verr wrong with the way you guys want to make money wheter its gw or chests... But not running off the topic much, epic should be something more exclusive, yet its almost, but not impossible for a f2p to get it, they canwith the time being save 30 gems and give it a shot, but just dont have any expectation on this... For the above said reasons youll just get a headache instead.

[busteroaf]

I do not agree with epic fusing, but Id like to see + versions fusing. 2 maxed regulars = plus version.

Epic should be left on chests, however, Gree can you please let us get it? Making it so the chance is 0,1% wont help, 2X Chances or even 4X chances special chests are just meaningless. The banners are so nicely made, the armors so well exihibited but the chances so RETARDED that personally i consider scam. Yes someone will get one eventually otherwise it would be simply a lie, wich we wouldnt take it easily.. But gree makes people believe they will actually get anything... Something is verr wrong with the way you guys want to make money wheter its gw or chests... But not running off the topic much, epic should be something more exclusive, yet its almost, but not impossible for a f2p to get it, they canwith the time being save 30 gems and give it a shot, but just dont have any expectation on this... For the above said reasons youll just get a headache instead.

This is the way it is in most every game.
Some form of level system for cards/armors/etc: common, uncommon, rare, high rare, super rare, super super rare, legendary.

If everyone has EASY access to the top end armors, they are no longer EPIC and legendary etc. They become common.

Why is this such a hard concept to grasp? Just because you play the game, does not mean you should be entitled to EVERYTHING in the game. Ever play Dragon Vale I think it was? Breeding dragons and feeding them to make them bigger. I think there's a Dragon City etc that is similar. You needed like 500 crystals to be able to get the rainbow dragon or something like that. So, unless you had 50 friends sending you 1 crystal each, every day, you were likely never going to get it without buying the crystals yourself. The top end armors/gear/cards whatever, is reserved for those that are either lucky in those "Poor me. It is SOOOO deceptive its a scam" chests or those that are indeed the top end of the end game, and spending money.

If you don't like it, go play a game where they give you everything and you just have to unlock it.

[SolarWind]

This is the way it is in most every game.
Some form of level system for cards/armors/etc: common, uncommon, rare, high rare, super rare, super super rare, legendary.

If everyone has EASY access to the top end armors, they are no longer EPIC and legendary etc. They become common.

Why is this such a hard concept to grasp? Just because you play the game, does not mean you should be entitled to EVERYTHING in the game. Ever play Dragon Vale I think it was? Breeding dragons and feeding them to make them bigger. I think there's a Dragon City etc that is similar. You needed like 500 crystals to be able to get the rainbow dragon or something like that. So, unless you had 50 friends sending you 1 crystal each, every day, you were likely never going to get it without buying the crystals yourself. The top end armors/gear/cards whatever, is reserved for those that are either lucky in those "Poor me. It is SOOOO deceptive its a scam" chests or those that are indeed the top end of the end game, and spending money.

If you don't like it, go play a game where they give you everything and you just have to unlock it.

I don't disagree with you. I used to play dragonvale. The only difference is in Dragon Vale, you have three options:

1) Buy the dragon with large amount of gem (most expensive - can be like $100+ - but guaranteed )
2) Buy gems to skip breeding time and try again (usually costs less than 1) in real money) - this is like chance chest though in my experience, much better success rate.
3) Don't spend gem and hope for the best (most likely will NOT get all dragons).

I wouldn't mind having option (1) equivalent in KnD personally. Doesn't have to be available for every epic, just need cover all the elements. They can keep the very best armours for guild war and chests.

[Lieda]

I suppose you work for Gree, no problem, im not saying that they should simply hand stuff to everybody, the fact is that once upon a time games were something in wich you had to "fight for".and in this one, they even brought "pay for" concept to a whole new level of "pay for a chance", im not talking talking chests as an isolated case here.

In most games and the said above you could simply pay for what you want, yes f2p they need money to keep going, it cant be simply handed out free, but honestly there should be some common sense and respect to the playerbase, wheter they pay or not. in mostly i do not speak for me, i tried the "special" chest once, and already figured out it isnt worth it, i just moved on, period. but its not me here posting on every special chest they bring up that they spend up to thousands to get but a bunch of garbage. Their fault, dont spend at all then and chest would be gone, mostly its all the playerbase fault, they simply comply. But chests for starting out, everything else follow the same rule, its not a battle of some knights looking pixels, its a credit card x credit card battle, you cant be in top ranks in arena without expending loads of money, your guild gets nowhere in gw without loads of money, in most cases you have to expend more than the reward worths... Thats what i dont appreciate and all in all, its my opinion, and its based on facts.

[taylor1993]

This is the way it is in most every game.
Some form of level system for cards/armors/etc: common, uncommon, rare, high rare, super rare, super super rare, legendary.

If everyone has EASY access to the top end armors, they are no longer EPIC and legendary etc. They become common.

Why is this such a hard concept to grasp? Just because you play the game, does not mean you should be entitled to EVERYTHING in the game. Ever play Dragon Vale I think it was? Breeding dragons and feeding them to make them bigger. I think there's a Dragon City etc that is similar. You needed like 500 crystals to be able to get the rainbow dragon or something like that. So, unless you had 50 friends sending you 1 crystal each, every day, you were likely never going to get it without buying the crystals yourself. The top end armors/gear/cards whatever, is reserved for those that are either lucky in those "Poor me. It is SOOOO deceptive its a scam" chests or those that are indeed the top end of the end game, and spending money.

If you don't like it, go play a game where they give you everything and you just have to unlock it.

That's exactly the point you are GUARANTEED that dragon after you spend the crystals. There is no promise you will recieve anything when opening the chest. Epic fusing could easily be reinstated with minimal consequences so long as they come up with a new formula for fusing them. Maybe a chance rate to fuse them which is lower than all other armors.

[busteroaf]

That's exactly the point you are GUARANTEED that dragon after you spend the crystals. There is no promise you will recieve anything when opening the chest. Epic fusing could easily be reinstated with minimal consequences so long as they come up with a new formula for fusing them. Maybe a chance rate to fuse them which is lower than all other armors.

The point with the DragonVale vs KnD... it was impossible to breed the rainbow dragon. Much like trying to fuse Black Kal and White Kal. And yes, you COULD buy the dragon outright there, not here. So yes, there is a slight difference.

But what was happening in KnD, was that you could conceivably level a toon/armor high enough to kill the Epic Boss level 15, craft the armors, and then have an almost guaranteed chance at an Epic. That is a failed mechanic. Epic's are not meant to be had by all. Otherwise, they'd give the new Epic from Guild Wars to every tier. But they didn't. That means, reserved for only a handful. That is the way the rest should be.

As far as the chests go. Its like playing the lottery. If you haven't noticed, not everyone wins the 100 million jackpot. If you're lucky, you might match 2 or 3 numbers and get your money back. The luckier they are, the more you make. And technically, you ARE getting something guaranteed. Lots of EP feeder armors. But you want Guaranteed EPIC armors. Nice try. Not going to happen.

Or, ever buy a pack of baseball/football/basketball/WoW/Magic/Pokemon/YuGiOh/Whatever cards? You are guaranteed you'll get the listed number of cards/armors on the package/chest. That is it! You want the Gold Hologram Michael Jordan card? That is 1:2500. You want the Spectral Tiger Mount from WoW? That is like, 1:1000. You want the Jester's Mask card from the Ice Age expansion from Magic the Gathering?... you get the idea. Cards/Armors/whatevers aren't super rare because they are in every pack and everyone has them. You pay for a CHANCE every time you buy things like that.

[Wdraizen]

It is actually sad to see how the game has become. I've been an active player since the game started and have been collecting and upgrading armors. Ever since they've released EPPIC armors which I've attempted several times to fuse but fail I see low level players that has this armor and easily knock my knights off which is soo frustrating. They should've made the epic armors exclusive for chest and or guild war prizes. now it's very hard not to see someone with 2 or more armors killing my knights.

[Justx]

Hah, I'd say that more than a "handful" of people have them now though.
@Wdraizen
Yeah I agree, it's pretty disheartening to see a level 70 beat me because he has an arsenal full of epics.

[taylor1993]

The point with the DragonVale vs KnD... it was impossible to breed the rainbow dragon. Much like trying to fuse Black Kal and White Kal. And yes, you COULD buy the dragon outright there, not here. So yes, there is a slight difference.

But what was happening in KnD, was that you could conceivably level a toon/armor high enough to kill the Epic Boss level 15, craft the armors, and then have an almost guaranteed chance at an Epic. That is a failed mechanic. Epic's are not meant to be had by all. Otherwise, they'd give the new Epic from Guild Wars to every tier. But they didn't. That means, reserved for only a handful. That is the way the rest should be.

As far as the chests go. Its like playing the lottery. If you haven't noticed, not everyone wins the 100 million jackpot. If you're lucky, you might match 2 or 3 numbers and get your money back. The luckier they are, the more you make. And technically, you ARE getting something guaranteed. Lots of EP feeder armors. But you want Guaranteed EPIC armors. Nice try. Not going to happen.

Or, ever buy a pack of baseball/football/basketball/WoW/Magic/Pokemon/YuGiOh/Whatever cards? You are guaranteed you'll get the listed number of cards/armors on the package/chest. That is it! You want the Gold Hologram Michael Jordan card? That is 1:2500. You want the Spectral Tiger Mount from WoW? That is like, 1:1000. You want the Jester's Mask card from the Ice Age expansion from Magic the Gathering?... you get the idea. Cards/Armors/whatevers aren't super rare because they are in every pack and everyone has them. You pay for a CHANCE every time you buy things like that.

I completely agree with what your saying about epics being much too easy to fuse but none the less and I don't expect guaranteed epic armors. I think that would be pointless. I would buy every one. The point is all the games you listed above are pay to play. KnD at its core is a f2P game. Most of the things you used as examples are all p2p. I could trade for a gold hologram Michael Jordan card (ironically I have his rookie card :D) my big thing is that it gives free players something to work for as an ultimate goal. The way they release epic armors was a mistake in the first place. They should have either been unfusable to begin with or very difficult. Since they have already released them as an obtainable Item I don't think it is right for them to just take it away. My personal opinion. I have already listed a simple solution for the problem I'm hoping they actually take a look at it and consider it.

[Rafa]

Ok here is my suggestion to easily fix low levels getting epics:

Make it so epics are only fusable if you fuse two legendaries '+' .

Low levels wont get it ever. If you wanna make it even harder make it so mono legendaries wont result in epics aswell.

[busteroaf]

I completely agree with what your saying about epics being much too easy to fuse but none the less and I don't expect guaranteed epic armors. I think that would be pointless. I would buy every one. The point is all the games you listed above are pay to play. KnD at its core is a f2P game. Most of the things you used as examples are all p2p. I could trade for a gold hologram Michael Jordan card (ironically I have his rookie card :D) my big thing is that it gives free players something to work for as an ultimate goal. The way they release epic armors was a mistake in the first place. They should have either been unfusable to begin with or very difficult. Since they have already released them as an obtainable Item I don't think it is right for them to just take it away. My personal opinion. I have already listed a simple solution for the problem I'm hoping they actually take a look at it and consider it.

The idea of the buying card packs was to counter the "the chest is unfair with the low drop rate". I'm aware Magic, Pokemon, YuGiOh and all the like are p2p. But for those that want the best cards, you HAVE to spend more. You can buy the starter packs and never buy another card and play just fine, just like you can play this game as f2p, never spend a cent, and still play. You might not win too often, but you can still play.

[Edwinz]

Someone in my guild fused tectonic 2 days ago. I guess there's still a chance maybe just lower.

Tell ur guildmate to show some proof pals...

[-Solo-]

Must also be the guy who also abused the glitch on your team, right?

[taylor1993]

The idea of the buying card packs was to counter the "the chest is unfair with the low drop rate". I'm aware Magic, Pokemon, YuGiOh and all the like are p2p. But for those that want the best cards, you HAVE to spend more. You can buy the starter packs and never buy another card and play just fine, just like you can play this game as f2p, never spend a cent, and still play. You might not win too often, but you can still play.

I never said anything about the chest drops :P I have gotten all of my epics for chest. I just believe that it should not be the sole means of obtaining them.

[Stooboot]

Won't happen.

It will flood the game with epics and, more importantly, it will reduce their overall revenue.

The game is already flooded with them what about the ppl that dont have them now the only way to get the is 2 buy 50 to 70 chests because 11 or 22 sure doesn't work


Must also be the guy who also abused the glitch on your team, right?
Honestly how is forsaken still where there at? Obviously they spend alot but there needs to be some kind of punishment and it cant just be kicking 1 player off the team, half there players are unbeatable with those bonuses

[busteroaf]

I never said anything about the chest drops :P I have gotten all of my epics for chest. I just believe that it should not be the sole means of obtaining them.

You didn't mention chests. My original post was where the reference came from. Then you said my games listed were p2p. I tried to say consider the started pack as the f2p version. Boosters from there on out are like the chests. Maybe that was confusing for some.

And chests are not the only way to get epics. You can win a guild war, or place in the Top 10 and still get epics.

In what other games do they freely give out the top tier of whatever for free? You want the best/most rare cards in Magic and other tabletop games? You buy boosters, or you have to win tournaments. Want the best cards in Rage of Bahamut (f2p card game) ... win the guild wars there, or get lucky in their multitude of card packs. Sure, you can trade trade trade and sell sell sell over and over and save up bit by bit to outright buy one off the market, but in order for those to hit the market, you'd have to have gotten it from either an event or a card pack. And since KnD doesn't have trading, that doesn't apply. Either chest it out, or win an event. That keeps it to a small group, and retains the rarity of it.

[Justx]

"Free"? Lol.

Okay, let me dish out 2000$ so I can get gems and use them in the guild war so I can be #1 or top 10.

Sure it's "free", but it's anything but that; when the only way you can even get into the mid to low hundreds is through moderate gem spending. To get into the top 10 in which you also obtain the armor you have to do heavy gem spending in order to even compete, which is not free.

[busteroaf]

"Free"? Lol.

Okay, let me dish out 2000$ so I can get gems and use them in the guild war so I can be #1 or top 10.

Sure it's "free", but it's anything but that; when the only way you can even get into the mid to low hundreds is through moderate gem spending. To get into the top 10 in which you also obtain the armor you have to do heavy gem spending in order to even compete, which is not free.

You catch on quick. Its not free. They've essentially taken Epics off the free table. You want them back? Spend some money. Again, not every player deserves access to everything.

Any game that allows you to buy in-game currency to purchase any sort of refills is obviously not truly f2p. Well, it still can be, but don't expect to get the best stuff when you don't spend money. That is the nature of these games.

[Justx]

Well truth be told, I don't really care all that much. I'm more bummed than anything since I didn't get one epic from all the fusion crap from before/during Beast Brawl I.

And of course, any game that has in game things such as gems or diamonds or whatever is ostensibly f2p but it's more p2p than anything when you get down into it.

[SerKnight]

I think that if GREE were to reinstate this at all they would need to drastically reduce the outcome % for epics.

[Justx]

Well that's a given, I'm just curious as to how low now if they were.

I'm guessing some where near DPC level.

[shukai84]

if it is as low as dpc, then players will complained that it is impossible to get epics? lol

[Bride of Eunuchorn]

Well truth be told, I don't really care all that much. I'm more bummed than anything since I didn't get one epic from all the fusion crap from before/during Beast Brawl I.

And of course, any game that has in game things such as gems or diamonds or whatever is ostensibly f2p but it's more p2p than anything when you get down into it.

Grees Motto:
Free to Play, Expensive to compete

[toogoodformyowngood]

Ok here is my suggestion to easily fix low levels getting epics:

Make it so epics are only fusable if you fuse two legendaries '+' .

Low levels wont get it ever. If you wanna make it even harder make it so mono legendaries wont result in epics aswell.


Yea I think this is the best Idea, epics can only be fused from Legendary+

[taylor1993]

You didn't mention chests. My original post was where the reference came from. Then you said my games listed were p2p. I tried to say consider the started pack as the f2p version. Boosters from there on out are like the chests. Maybe that was confusing for some.

And chests are not the only way to get epics. You can win a guild war, or place in the Top 10 and still get epics.

In what other games do they freely give out the top tier of whatever for free? You want the best/most rare cards in Magic and other tabletop games? You buy boosters, or you have to win tournaments. Want the best cards in Rage of Bahamut (f2p card game) ... win the guild wars there, or get lucky in theor multitude of card packs. Sure, you can trade trade trade and sell sell sell over and over and save up bit by bit to outright buy one off the market, but in order for those to hit the market, you'd have to have gotten it from either an event or a card pack. And since KnD doesn't have trading, that doesn't apply. Either chest it out, or win an event. That keeps it to a small group, and retains the rarity of it.

Not for free. You still have to earn the epic boss armor to become be eligible for a chance to fuse for it. All I'm saying is make them fusable again with much lower odds.

[Zyntree]

I've got to agree, I sure wish I had fused an epic. That's not to say i didn't try, but I certainly didn't succeed. I'm personally glad they took them out of the fusable category, although I wasn't when it first happened. I really wanted tectonic (still do I suppose). But they should be rare and epic.

My biggest gripe is that they let too many in and now young players whip the older ones because they got lucky enough to get one. Way too many epics out there. Maybe with some rebalancing or stronger plus legendaries or something Gree can rectify this... making Moontide and BV not so dominant.

Although the epics only with fusing + legendaries is an interesting thought as well. We'll see what happens.

Oh, and my guild doesn't spend gems (except I spent 10 once :) and we're in the top 250, so it is possible. Just not possible to be in the top 25 w/o lots of gems I don't think.

[ryankellly]

needs to happen, love this game but gree is forcing your hand to spend money to be a top tier player.

[jibrish]

I like this idea because I feel it adds another aspect to the game. IMHO I think that if you can't get good armorby fusing high level armor, they should remove it from the game.

[Paladineguru]

I like this idea because I feel it adds another aspect to the game. IMHO I think that if you can't get good armorby fusing high level armor, they should remove it from the game.

And how would you level your high level armors. Truth is there's already a flood of epics. And with removing them from fusing, and taking away free gems, if you don't place in top ten in the first few months of guild wars, you will have to pay for it . If you don't like it go a play a free or a one time fee game.

[Ithiliond]

With the actual top guild requirements, if you wanna be on top you should spend loads of your money to be competitive. It's not a matter of 20$ (or €) once in a while, you need 3 epics or legendaries+ and all slots upgraded to stage 3.
Who is willing or have the possibility to do that? Probably only a little portion of the whole community. So while maybe some of those "few big payers" will spend more, the others that could afford/want to spend little amounts of money once in a while will change their mind (or they will after they discover how tricky the chests drops are).
It doesn't seems a nice idea, to me.

Flood of epics is reduced introducing new fuseable legendaries.

[Sakino]

Nah, i think i will keep playing this game but i will avoid spending 20.000 € to get six maxed epics. Tomorrow, time sto spend 6,99 to buy ∞Blade III, i think is a bit better and cheaper. I want to know how siri will slain the worker.

[busteroaf]

With the actual top guild requirements, if you wanna be on top you should spend loads of your money to be competitive. It's not a matter of 20$ (or €) once in a while, you need 3 epics or legendaries+ and all slots upgraded to stage 3.
Who is willing or have the possibility to do that? Probably only a little portion of the whole community. So while maybe some of those "few big payers" will spend more, the others that could afford/want to spend little amounts of money once in a while will change their mind (or they will after they discover how tricky the chests drops are).
It doesn't seems a nice idea, to me.

Flood of epics is reduced introducing new fuseable legendaries.

Top guild requirements, because there is obviously a desire by more than just "a handful" to want to be on top. Did you see the graphs and charts for the top 10 battles? Yes, the trickle down effect wears off rapidly to the truly f2p people, but we are the ones supporting everyone else.

Also, for the loads of other games that don't require a monetary investment, or "a monetary investment to progress", such as WoW (since everyone pays a subscription fee within a dollar or two of everyone else each month) ... the investment is much different. Instead of spending money to be on top, you spend time. As in, hours at a time if you want to get somewhere and advance. Large chunks of hours devoted to raiding. This game isn't meant to be a 24/7 game. The way it is designed is such that you can log on here and there, collect some gold, farm an area, craft some armor, hit the home button, and put your phone back into your pocket, and on with your life.

[Ithiliond]

This game isn't meant to be a 24/7 game. The way it is designed is such that you can log on here and there, collect some gold, farm an area, craft some armor, hit the home button, and put your phone back into your pocket, and on with your life.

That is not true. To be on the top bracket in the arena you have to play continuously, and/or to pay to refill your energy. Same thing with clan war energy, and boss energy too. The most efficient way to be on top is playing the more frequently possible you can.
Spending gems is a plus, but gem spender would not probably be interested in spending gems for filling an energy that leads to rewards they don't need (except for clan wars), and if they do so, it's because they are already playing 24/7 and want to go over the limit set by the whole time mechanics.
The base mechanics of the game advantages playing frequently. It's not like if you are stronger, you get more points; you have a better edge, but you mostly need to play more.

[busteroaf]

That is not true. To be on the top bracket in the arena you have to play continuously, and/or to pay to refill your energy. Same thing with clan war energy, and boss energy too. The most efficient way to be on top is playing the more frequently possible you can.
Spending gems is a plus, but gem spender would not probably be interested in spending gems for filling an energy that leads to rewards they don't need (except for clan wars), and if they do so, it's because they are already playing 24/7 and want to go over the limit set by the whole time mechanics.
The base mechanics of the game advantages playing frequently. It's not like if you are stronger, you get more points; you have a better edge, but you mostly need to play more.

Only at the lower levels do you really need to log in frequently.

Arena: Every 75 minutes you can log in, play for about 2 minutes, and turn the phone back off. If you want to be extra competitive, do the same thing, but add in some gems and an extended period of time. Hell, I haven't spent a single gem on Arena ever and I'm sitting in the low 300's. Is it great? Nope, I'm def not winning a black medal, but I also don't need it. And I don't log in every 75 minutes to battle either.

For farming gold? Maxed out training fields or nests. Those take time to aquire the gold to fully flesh out, but once you do, you don't have to log and collect from that fountain every 5 minutes. Those only need to be collected every couple hours. And if I use all my knights, guess what, it takes over 2 hours for them to regen fully to where I can use them again to farm a level. Once they are regen'd, in a few minutes I'm done using them again. Same with the bosses. The first rush through the first 20-30 levels depending on your armors and how you are playing takes about half an hour, tops. Of the first day. After that, you're waiting for your energy to regen, every couple hours. I can't play "more frequently" and have my energy regen faster unless I chose to gem.

In my opinion, the base mechanics of the game favors those that get to 100, max out a few armors, and play smart. Yes, for those that want the absolute best rewards for guild wars/arena/epic boss, you have to gem. Other than that, you don't.

[template]

That is not true. To be on the top bracket in the arena you have to play continuously, and/or to pay to refill your energy. Same thing with clan war energy, and boss energy too. The most efficient way to be on top is playing the more frequently possible you can.
Spending gems is a plus, but gem spender would not probably be interested in spending gems for filling an energy that leads to rewards they don't need (except for clan wars), and if they do so, it's because they are already playing 24/7 and want to go over the limit set by the whole time mechanics.
The base mechanics of the game advantages playing frequently. It's not like if you are stronger, you get more points; you have a better edge, but you mostly need to play more.

See Busteroaf's response. It's largely true though. Once I have done my grinding for the day for snakeskins and farming my friend list for arena points, it's largely just log in here and there to do an arena fight, refresh an armor crafting timer or something similar. Being logged in more leaves me nothing to do unless I want to spend gems, which I'm loathe to do for daily activities.

[Rambozo]

I'm a gem buyer and I won't buy any gem until the Epic fuse is possible. I spent to much gems to get an epic and Nothing !! Only 1 4 stars.... I won't spend Any real money before a looooooong time !

[shush]

This game is heavy on pay2win.

The one who spend more cash will always win. There is no other way to compensate. No time invested, no intelligent playing no nothing that you could do to compete with somebody who invests cash.

Is it fair? Its their game, if you dont like it, dont play it.

I wanted to spend some cash on this game, but I dont see a reason why i should. The whole PVP aspect of the game is mood and there is no other reason why you would need to buy and spend gems.

So i stay with the PVE game, till im bored out.

[The Pale Rider]

Only at the lower levels do you really need to log in frequently.

Arena: Every 75 minutes you can log in, play for about 2 minutes, and turn the phone back off. If you want to be extra competitive, do the same thing, but add in some gems and an extended period of time. Hell, I haven't spent a single gem on Arena ever and I'm sitting in the low 300's. Is it great? Nope, I'm def not winning a black medal, but I also don't need it. And I don't log in every 75 minutes to battle either.

For farming gold? Maxed out training fields or nests. Those take time to aquire the gold to fully flesh out, but once you do, you don't have to log and collect from that fountain every 5 minutes. Those only need to be collected every couple hours. And if I use all my knights, guess what, it takes over 2 hours for them to regen fully to where I can use them again to farm a level. Once they are regen'd, in a few minutes I'm done using them again. Same with the bosses. The first rush through the first 20-30 levels depending on your armors and how you are playing takes about half an hour, tops. Of the first day. After that, you're waiting for your energy to regen, every couple hours. I can't play "more frequently" and have my energy regen faster unless I chose to gem.

In my opinion, the base mechanics of the game favors those that get to 100, max out a few armors, and play smart. Yes, for those that want the absolute best rewards for guild wars/arena/epic boss, you have to gem. Other than that, you don't.

Completely agree until this last line: "the base mechanics of the game favors those that get to 100, max out a few armors, and play smart." That was exactly how it worked before Epics.

[Zyntree]

Pale Rider,
You hit it on the nose. Plateauing is the name of the game. There is no where for anyone with 3 leg+ armors to go. I myself am not there yet, but close. The war was fun, I agree, and I enjoyed playing it... but the rewards for under top 10 didn't help armor wise. And right... Beast Keys... I'm going for the smaller pot because I'll be getting those armors anyway, but without a chance to fuse epics, and no armors to enhance, what good are they to me... they are not. So what do we do? Wait a month, see if GREE changes something to bring a new incentive, or we quit playing. At least that's where I'm at.

Having the best armor we can get, yet still being far below par... what's the point?

[busteroaf]

Completely agree until this last line: "the base mechanics of the game favors those that get to 100, max out a few armors, and play smart." That was exactly how it worked before Epics.

Must have edited the post before I got to it.

Like I stated before, it was my opinion, so I'm sure many don't agree. Since I clearly often disagree with many people here. Not on purpose though. I just view things differently.

Also, I don't feel that the epics are totally that far ahead of everything else, or change the base mechanics. At the end of the day, you still have to level. A level 50 with an under-leveled Epic will still do better on average than other level 50's without Epics, but that under-leveled armor also hurts them against someone with maxed out armors. A maxed out Big 4 can take down an under-leveled Epic with ease. That same level 50 vs. a level 100+ with the same under-leveled Epic, will do more damage just from the stat boost. Max level player with maxed Epic, yeah, mondo damage. Hence, getting to max level, and leveling your armors will always be part of the core part of "winning" or "doing well" in this game. It is a lot easier to do things at max level than non-max level.

[The Pale Rider]

I did edit to cut out what was essentially my personal situation, but the gist was 3 leg+ and whatever you got before fusing epics stopped) is the current plateu without buying a lot of chests.

I take your point as well. I just think getting to level 100 isn't as hard as it used to be before guilds. I've watched guys in my guild jump 20 levels in a week. They have access to all the higher level friends in the guild and in the first GW they got 2 sky+ and a combustion. So a lot of lvl 40-60 players rocketed to stage 2 of the game in a few weeks. No more quests, no more working on your city, just focusing on armor. You've got the arena, the bosses and the GWs once you're at stage 2. If you can't grow in those it'll become a detterent t continued play. Most of the members in my guild are still busy leveling armor, getting to 100 and finishing upgrading TFs. That's all fun and the rewards come constantly. Once you hit 100, max your TFs and have 3 leg+ the rewards used to come more slowly, now they come basically not at all.

That's what I think should change. +1 for fusing Epics only with leg+ armor.

[Zyntree]

+1 for fusing epics only with leg+ armors. That would take them out of the hands of noobs, make them hard to get, but still a possibility... and then that takes away the 100% fusion chance, since Cloudking and Ruby would not work and Corvus+ and Troll+ could give you 1/3 chance at tectonic.