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View Full Version : What the heck is the player database?!



TMI
08-29-2013, 06:49 AM
I've seen this term in a couple threads now (MT witchhunt and SAS intel sharing).
Before the trolls say "it's a databsae of players", what i mean is,
is it a spreadsheet? what information is on there? who created it? what was it's purpose when started? what is it's current purpose? Who are the ppl that originally used it and who are the ppl that are currently using it.

Thanks :)

Butt Futter
08-29-2013, 06:57 AM
It holds private info like gold on hand, gold purchased, money collected, etc.

iteachem
08-29-2013, 07:08 AM
Yup.. If you pm me i can send you the data base info that was gathered about me for an example. I was shocked when it was sent to me and quite pissed honestly.

cave man kid
08-29-2013, 07:08 AM
Then how do they get all that info

Rodney26
08-29-2013, 07:11 AM
Seems like bs.. I think seeing how much gold someone has is pretty low..

jmeijer
08-29-2013, 07:12 AM
If anyone has my info, can you please send it to me? Mafia ID = 102 573 080.

Butt Futter
08-29-2013, 07:12 AM
Rodney, this actualy exists. It's been confirmed by multiple syndicates and Teach has posted the information about him before.

iteachem
08-29-2013, 07:14 AM
Here is the file I was sent
https://www.dropbox.com/s/daco6lce66xn9hu/380946180485834369.htm

Also posted below. Game isn't too private if this info can be harvested


Player Info
Invite code: 847-233-708
Level: 209
Experience: 1,413,955
Mafia: 584 ( 453 henchmen )
Join date: 2011/08/13
Game loads: 11,811
Last load: 2013/05/19
Character Class: Goodfella
Is Banned: false
Is Muted: false
Is Test Account: false
Attack/Defense
Raw attack: 328,744
Server attack:
Attack:
Raw Defense: 307,695
Server defense: 443,986
Defense:
Building defense:
Skill Points
Attack: 316
Defense: 401
Stamina: 30
Energy: 1820
Free Skill Points: 0
Spent Skill Points: 627
Gold
Gold onhand: 0
Gold spent: 783,220
Respect
Respect onhand: 11,916
Respect earned: 409,918
Money
Total earned: 4,788,586,271
Money onhand: 106
Bank Balance: 56,485,095
Jobs: 79,850,752
From PVP: 80,814,775
From robbing: 777,265,607.0
PVP lost Att: 3,466,225
PVP Lost Def: 11,188,493
Lost to robs: 156,238,669
Jobs
Jobs completed: 29,320
Jobs failed: 0
Bosses Beaten: 3,375
PVP
Won: 79,565
Won as attacker: 73,851
Won as defender: 5,714
Lost: 10,925
Lost as attacker: 2,262
Lost as defender: 8,663
Robbery
Robs completed: 47,846
Robs failed: 959
Items
Items bought: 39,469
Guns bought: 1,846
Mele bought: 2,068
Armor bought: 3,044
Cars bought: 1,002
Buildings
Townname: Towerland
Buildings: 131
Buildings purchased: 291
Collect count: 31,320
Props purchased: 422
Expansions purchased: 22
Expansion direction: none
Building area: 1,348
Expansion width: 8
Expansion length: 14
Misc
Max health: 100
Current health: 0
VIP invites: 3
Unknown
Steel: 388
Diamond: 0

P.Squiddy
08-29-2013, 07:14 AM
How does one gain access to the "database"?

iteachem
08-29-2013, 07:15 AM
How does one gain access to the "database"?

No idea ... Ask Matt

P.Squiddy
08-29-2013, 07:17 AM
No idea ... Ask Matt

GREE did not let him access it did they? Or did he manage to get into the database himself. I know you said you have no idea... but youve problably got a better look at the picture than me..

Rodney26
08-29-2013, 07:19 AM
I know it exists bf.. What I'm saying is its bs to use it and pretty low

iteachem
08-29-2013, 07:20 AM
GREE did not let him access it did they? Or did he manage to get into the database himself. I know you said you have no idea... but youve problably got a better look at the picture than me..

I think they captured data that is sent when you attack and rob... Some kind of computer in the middle that captures and reads server data

Butt Futter
08-29-2013, 07:26 AM
I know it exists bf.. What I'm saying is its bs to use it and pretty low

Gotcha. I read it as you thought the idea of it was BS. My bad.

cave man kid
08-29-2013, 07:41 AM
And GREE has no problems with them getting everyones personal game info

Green Drake
08-29-2013, 08:07 AM
Here you go. This was an email that Matt from rogues sent me this very morning concerning this. But don't worry even though he passed it out to 25 other syndicates or roughly 1500 hundred people who have no doubt modified te program to see who knows what, rogue no longer uses it. So you are safe.

"This has been covered in detail on the forums and I really don't want to spend time rehashing it, especially when you refuse to back up your claims on a former player of ours, but here's a quick summary. It's called data reading and it's the thing people do to find out information on new buildings, etc. When I was a member of SAS a player set up a system to detect cash and respect hackers doing this. He left SAS and joined us. He's no longer on our team and we don't use the software he created. It's the same stuff Mxz, members of fight club, etc use.

With that said, It doesn't require hacking into Gree's information - you just pull data off your phone. You can't use it to your advantage because it doesn't tell you enough info. You can't tell collection times. You couldn't possibly use it to help yourself in war. It was a tool a member made only to find cheaters and access was given to every leader in a top 25 room I created for banning cheaters and hackers. We don't use it anymore though."

Green Drake
08-29-2013, 08:09 AM
By the way mxz. Sorry I robbed your dock this morning. Please don't hack my data.

Vito Corleone
08-29-2013, 08:21 AM
I heard RG had (has) a former Funzio programmer in their crew (some say he's just a programmer)...he knew how to access this data (knew that it was avilable). It's called the "icy metric" program. That's how it started...

Vito Corleone
08-29-2013, 08:39 AM
I'm not sure I want to find out how much gold I have spent so far...:rolleyes:

CCK-buttsy
08-29-2013, 09:11 AM
anyone have my info? id is 115 973 237

TigrisCauda
08-29-2013, 09:12 AM
I'm not sure I want to find out how much gold I have spent so far...:rolleyes:

Amen to that

P.Squiddy
08-29-2013, 09:15 AM
If you have my info please send.. ID - 146 260 106. If youve got the program send it to me too ;) lol

Vito Corleone
08-29-2013, 09:15 AM
All the gold spent on old crates...where the common had stats around 20. What a waste!!!

But we will probably say the same in a year. The only thing to keep is modifiers. I wonder what GREE will do when the player stats become so huge that it overflows...like the vault of cash thing.

Ben Weston
08-29-2013, 09:41 AM
do vaults of cash not work? never bought one myself.

bald zeemer
08-29-2013, 09:46 AM
All the gold spent on old crates...where the common had stats around 20. What a waste!!!

But we will probably say the same in a year. The only thing to keep is modifiers. I wonder what GREE will do when the player stats become so huge that it overflows...like the vault of cash thing.

Vaults of cash work when the display maxes and minuses. The cash goes away from your account, then comes back with the vault amount. I believe the vault amount doesn't max out, either - just the display.

Confirmed less than 30 mins ago.

Rodimus
08-29-2013, 10:02 AM
Wow, players executing queries on other players is sheer brilliance.

steamboatwilly
08-29-2013, 10:06 AM
icymetric.com

CCK-buttsy
08-29-2013, 10:18 AM
icymetric.comhow do you make an account... that link takes me to the log-in page

iteachem
08-29-2013, 10:55 AM
how do you make an account... that link takes me to the log-in page

Only rogues and the syndicates they have shared with had access..not sure who all had ability to go there

CCK-buttsy
08-29-2013, 11:24 AM
Only rogues and the syndicates they have shared with had access..not sure who all had ability to go therethat sucks...

MattThomas08
08-29-2013, 11:38 AM
Only rogues and the syndicates they have shared with had access..not sure who all had ability to go there

Rogues doesn't maintain the database. You'll have to contact the guy who maintains it, I don't know how to get in touch with him, I haven't heard from him in ages.

craftytempter
08-29-2013, 11:49 AM
I think everyone would want their data lol

montecore
08-29-2013, 12:30 PM
Here you go. This was an email that Matt from rogues sent me this very morning concerning this. But don't worry even though he passed it out to 25 other syndicates or roughly 1500 hundred people who have no doubt modified te program to see who knows what, rogue no longer uses it. So you are safe.

"This has been covered in detail on the forums and I really don't want to spend time rehashing it, especially when you refuse to back up your claims on a former player of ours, but here's a quick summary. It's called data reading and it's the thing people do to find out information on new buildings, etc. When I was a member of SAS a player set up a system to detect cash and respect hackers doing this. He left SAS and joined us. He's no longer on our team and we don't use the software he created. It's the same stuff Mxz, members of fight club, etc use.

With that said, It doesn't require hacking into Gree's information - you just pull data off your phone. You can't use it to your advantage because it doesn't tell you enough info. You can't tell collection times. You couldn't possibly use it to help yourself in war. It was a tool a member made only to find cheaters and access was given to every leader in a top 25 room I created for banning cheaters and hackers. We don't use it anymore though."

Unfortunately, I will need to call BS at a few points here.

The data is sent from the server to your phone. Your phone only displays some of it. The data can be captured with a network sniffer or an API, formatted and compiled into a database.

You could absolutely use it to check collection times, as follows:

I visit your hood at 8AM, 9AM, 10AM, etc. Each time I compile a copy of your cash on hand, collections, bank balance, etc. All I have to do is wait for the spike in "buildings collected" and see that you now have 100mm in your bank at 10AM, and I know your 24s come up due between 9AM and 10AM. Assuming an API can be used, it can even be automated.

Not useful in war? How about facing a team the first few hours on Friday and getting a view of the gold balance for the whole team. Then face them saturday, and sunday, and see how much gold they have left. Yes, a team can always buy more gold but with the bonus program and no ability to hide it there isn't much a team could do about it. This is ignoring the fact that a team could only try to be covert about their gold purchases if they knew other teams had this capability.

Should you try pushing Monday? It sure would be nice to know how much gold on hand the team in front of you has before you try, right?

So stop claiming that it can't be used to track collection times, or to benefit a team during a war. It absolutely can be. Whether or not Rogues ever used it for either purpose, I have no idea. So please don't take my post as an accusation that they did.

Ben Weston
08-29-2013, 01:16 PM
I hope everyone that admits to using this gets banned from both the game and forums, its cheating of the highest order and againt the ToS.

I bet you're the same people that say piracy isn't theft right?

montecore
08-29-2013, 01:19 PM
I hope everyone that admits to using this gets banned from both the game and forums, its cheating of the highest order and againt the ToS.

I bet you're the same people that say piracy isn't theft right?

I doubt it will happen for a few reasons. But I do hope that Gree either puts the info out there for everyone to see, all the time, or finds a way to hide it going forward. There really is no other good solution.

craftytempter
08-29-2013, 01:19 PM
well it must provide them some intel as if it didn't they would have shared it with everyone

Ben Weston
08-29-2013, 01:24 PM
I doubt it will happen for a few reasons. But I do hope that Gree either puts the info out there for everyone to see, all the time, or finds a way to hide it going forward. There really is no other good solution.

not arguing, but the people involved should banned without question.

Green Drake
08-29-2013, 01:27 PM
I doubt it will happen for a few reasons. But I do hope that Gree either puts the info out there for everyone to see, all the time, or finds a way to hide it going forward. There really is no other good solution.

Hahaha. I just pictured countdown timers above everybody's building illustrating. What a feeding frenzy that would be.

TZora
08-29-2013, 01:30 PM
This is actually cooooool .. whoever created the software, kudos :)
now you can go run a check on me and see how much i got from my zero iph :D

cave man kid
08-29-2013, 01:32 PM
I know this has been reported to GREE months ago and the people posting others stats never got banned

tatersauce
08-29-2013, 02:13 PM
Agreed the people using this should be banned. Banned I say...

Rebels
08-29-2013, 02:26 PM
Im sitting on the fence for this one.

A: Is it the people taking advantage of the system and having the know how? (I personally wouldnt want to be using it).

B: A problem that Gree needs to correct so this cant happen?

It is a clever tactic that may be a little bit under handed and abusing the game. No one should be playing around with the game data, collecting it, hacking it or anything from the stock standard game.

But is it a cheat? Someone has the ability to make a programme to read information without hacking the game. I believe Gree need to close this loop hole ASAP.

Its not like Gree is not making them a profit, with the amount of money people are spending. They should be able to fix this with the resources they have.

Ben Weston
08-29-2013, 02:34 PM
how is it not cheating? using software to skim info from the game about others which should be visible and using it to your advantage is cheating what ever way you look at it.

Xaviar
08-29-2013, 02:37 PM
I would love to get this software and see what it can truly do.

Rebels
08-29-2013, 02:42 PM
how is it not cheating? using software to skim info from the game about others which should be visible and using it to your advantage is cheating what ever way you look at it.

Your argument is a good one. You may be making me lean towards your way of thinking.

I doubt Gree will be able to identify who uses these methods though as they arent changing the game data just reading it.
Gree need to tighten up their code around the information skiming.

Cheating or not it will be hard to catch them so they need to take control of the issue.

I dont like any form of cheating and believe anyone doing so should end up with a big banner on their profile labeling them as a cheat.
Name and shame!

Rebels
08-29-2013, 02:44 PM
I would love to get this software and see what it can truly do.

I cant believe you said that!

Chica
08-29-2013, 03:01 PM
Aim bots just scan for data and send data to your pointer. Its not cheating if u still have to click right? CHEATERS!

Green Drake
08-29-2013, 03:28 PM
Your argument is a good one. You may be making me lean towards your way of thinking.

I doubt Gree will be able to identify who uses these methods though as they arent changing the game data just reading it.
Gree need to tighten up their code around the information skiming.

Cheating or not it will be hard to catch them so they need to take control of the issue.

I dont like any form of cheating and believe anyone doing so should end up with a big banner on their profile labeling them as a cheat.
Name and shame!

Luckily at least three members of rogue openly admit to using these methods. Not to hard to prove when they admit it.

Stooboot
08-29-2013, 04:29 PM
Either someone is hacking gree or someone who works for gree is letting this out and if its someone whos hacking whos to say that they can't hack your ip address or your account information?

montecore
08-29-2013, 06:59 PM
they dont encrypt. there is no hacking as far as accessing data that isnt already being sent to you, but it is data yku are not supposed to see.

Gingeasian
08-29-2013, 07:01 PM
It's also an invasion of privacy. Some might not care but others might not want everyone knowing if and how much they have spent on this game

Green Drake
08-29-2013, 09:29 PM
If a program had to be developed and used to capture the data as indicated by Matt Thomas then a hack occurred.
There are many applications of such a program that can be used to gain an advantage. Some outlined by montecore in response to the email MT sent to me. Regardless the information that they are able to harvest is not their business even if in their arrogance they justify the action by self appointing themselves to police crime city accounts.
Further I find it amazing that not only do they not see that they are wrong but rather they seem to be proud of their ability to hack accounts. Peppers had no problem admitting that rogues used the program on gree's own public forum. Matt Thomas detailed how the program worked via email to me and finally Beardy used it to gain my information and in a stroke of brilliance decided it was prudent to post the results on my wall.....all because I robbed him and he lost when trying to attack me back. Happy to say that beardy's ineptness earned him either a ban or a frozen account so gree will take action. I am interested to see if the admissions by pepper and MT will be dealt with in the same way.

cave man kid
08-29-2013, 09:38 PM
If a program had to be developed and used to capture the data as indicated by Matt Thomas then a hack occurred.
There are many applications of such a program that can be used to gain an advantage. Some outlined by montecore in response to the email MT sent to me. Regardless the information that they are able to harvest is not their business even if in their arrogance they justify the action by self appointing themselves to police crime city accounts.
Further I find it amazing that not only do they not see that they are wrong but rather they seem to be proud of their ability to hack accounts. Peppers had no problem admitting that rogues used the program on gree's own public forum. Matt Thomas detailed how the program worked via email to me and finally Beardy used it to gain my information and in a stroke of brilliance decided it was prudent to post the results on my wall.....all because I robbed him and he lost when trying to attack me back. Happy to say that beardy's ineptness earned him either a ban or a frozen account so gree will take action. I am interested to see if the admissions by pepper and MT will be dealt with in the same way..


You are lucky I had someone post everything on my wall and GREE did nothing

TZora
08-29-2013, 11:30 PM
Im sitting on the fence for this one.

A: Is it the people taking advantage of the system and having the know how? (I personally wouldnt want to be using it).

B: A problem that Gree needs to correct so this cant happen?

It is a clever tactic that may be a little bit under handed and abusing the game. No one should be playing around with the game data, collecting it, hacking it or anything from the stock standard game.

But is it a cheat? Someone has the ability to make a programme to read information without hacking the game. I believe Gree need to close this loop hole ASAP.

Its not like Gree is not making them a profit, with the amount of money people are spending. They should be able to fix this with the resources they have.
please don't put this on the players .. at least don't put gree's incompetence on smarties .. i don't personally recommend doing any of that type of stuff but i do laugh in gree's face when they can't handle their own shoot. each new update breaks the game into pieces .. each new "feature" introduced in this game brings a swarm of bugs and glitches and then their nerdy geeks post useless explanations that they are on it .. is there anything gree can do without using the word "sorry"? frankly, i'm tired of this game because of tens of events .. the game's broken .. glitches and bugs and what not .. then if someone finds their way into gree's butt, they're called out cheaters .. how's that fair?

PawnXIIX
08-30-2013, 01:24 AM
they dont encrypt. there is no hacking as far as accessing data that isnt already being sent to you, but it is data yku are not supposed to see.

This is just data that is sent from the server to keep the GUI displaying the proper data. There really isn't anything that can be used maliciously or against somebody. This is the same thing that every server/client game does nowadays. There doesn't really need to be encryption since the data is sent to a PHP socket, and it would check the data. The game doesn't call the methods on the device and then change data on the server, it simply tells the server the method and location and modify values, then sends the new values on the next update.

Example: Instead of calculating the money from the job you just completed, it calculates the money based on something like jobComplete([area], [areaID], [job], [jobID]) and on the secure server connection it then modifies the values on your profile. If the game were to calculate the return value for the money before opening a connection to server, then there'd be the vulnerability for an attack by modifying the un-encrpyted data before it reaches the server.

So yes, it should be encrypted. I think everything should be encrypted. Is it going to make much of a difference in this case? Not in my opinion. Most of the data actually accessible to the player can't really be abused.

Green Drake
08-30-2013, 02:13 AM
Wow. Just wow. I guess I am just blown away how some people will attempt to justify this as being acceptable. Ultimately I feel using an outside program to gather, copy and maintain databases on individuals violates multiple portions of the terms of service set forth by gree. But ultimately these violations are the sole discretion of gree. So rather than locking this thread I for one would like a representative from gree to chime in on exactly where the company stands regarding the collection of data, or at least my data by parties that are not myself or gree.

Please, Sirius, CJ, A&F will one of you please contribute what the companies position is exactly on this issue?

Chica
08-30-2013, 02:21 AM
And whoever is collecting the data should be able to see how much gold they have on hand and how much they spent for what purpose exactly?

kuksluk
08-30-2013, 02:25 AM
1. GREE really must encrypt their data! This isn't a free flash game you play to pass time (anonymously), serious harm can be done to us users if GREE fail to secure their game (just imagine if they also handled your credit card information!!).

2. This information was NOT meant to be public or it would be visible in every hood plain for all to see.

3. There are many ways in which this information can be used to gain an advantage in the game, but point 2 above should be reason enough to handle this issue accordingly (see point 4).

4. Who ever discovered this security issue AND decided to utilize it, and who ever else is/was using it is not playing a fair game and should be handled as a hacker/cheater/glitcher.

Question to GREE: What are you doing to fix this?? Why is this security hole still open when it's been public for a long time already?

Mistress Nikita
08-30-2013, 03:20 AM
I've been curious about this database for a while now, and once had started a very long thread about it, which gave one poor guy a permanent vacation when he tried to explain the difference between reading data and UDID hacking (the kind of real hacking done to my friend Baddad's account). This is what I have found out so far. And, since everyone seems to like numbered lists, I'll even use numbers.

1. That a top syndicate, that is higher than second, has a data reader.

2. That a self proclaimed smug syndicate has a data reader.

3. SAS first created their own data reader program, but the guy who made it left for Rogues, but has since left Rogues and is now MIA.

4. That you "register" online to become a part of the data-reader created in SAS.

5. That last I heard (and I heard this very very recently), the leader of a top syndicate who are a bunch of very noisy hired killers, is still a registered user of this database.

6. A certain narcissistic, hypocritical, tiger-loving blow hard, who presents himself as holier than thou, was also a registered user of this database, first created by SAS.

And, in case anyone else would like to change the subject, I think I'll have FISHSTICKS for dinner tonight. Look, I used ALLCAPS again.

VikesUK
08-30-2013, 03:26 AM
It seems to me that this data capture represents a form of cheating..........gaining an unfair advantage with information it was never intended should be available. Anyone involved should be banned from the game.

If you are going to argue that nothing is wrong with it because it doesn't involve modifying or hacking game code, then presumably you sanction the time travelling cheats as well........after all they don't modify or hack code to gain their unfair advantage.

hg789
08-30-2013, 04:02 AM
I wrote my own data reader months ago, just because i'm curious. I certainly haven't gained any competitive advantage with it, as i'm outside the top100 and not a gold spender. Sounds like all the top teams are doing it anyway, so it's an even playing field up there. I mostly just check out my fellow syndicate members and opponents who beat me.

There seems to be a fair bit of anger directed towards the data-reading "cheats" instead of the lazy programmers at Funzio/Gree. Returning the entire row from the db query instead of the relevent fields is just crap coding.

Anyway, i'd love to know more about these other readers. I'm starting to wonder if there is more to the story.

VikesUK
08-30-2013, 04:43 AM
I wrote my own data reader months ago, just because i'm curious. I certainly haven't gained any competitive advantage with it, as i'm outside the top100 and not a gold spender. Sounds like all the top teams are doing it anyway, so it's an even playing field up there. I mostly just check out my fellow syndicate members and opponents who beat me.

There seems to be a fair bit of anger directed towards the data-reading "cheats" instead of the lazy programmers at Funzio/Gree. Returning the entire row from the db query instead of the relevent fields is just crap coding.

Anyway, i'd love to know more about these other readers. I'm starting to wonder if there is more to the story.
To what end are you checking opponents? If not to gain a form of intelligence on them that the developers never intended you should have (an advantage), then it seems a very fascile activity you are using your energies on.

You suggest all top teams do it. They do not. Are you suggesting that all top team should participate in data cheating to 'level the playing field' as you put it?

If this is your implied suggestion, then you would have to extend that stance I think. It is not much of a secret that certain top teams include hackers/cash cheats/RP cheats. Should all top teams be obliged to engage in these activities too to level your playing field?

bald zeemer
08-30-2013, 04:50 AM
I struggle to see how any of the top teams would benefit from harboring RP hackers.

VikesUK
08-30-2013, 04:54 AM
I struggle to see how any of the top teams would benefit from harboring RP hackers.

Depends on your definition of 'top' - the poster I replied to appeared to be thinking as low as top 100/75/50. These teams certainly would benefit from anyone with several hundred doomsday frags, for example.

BigMoney
08-30-2013, 05:15 AM
I struggle to see how any of the top teams would benefit from harboring RP hackers.

Because certain top 25 syndicates have players with stats so terrible that they need 500 of the top RP items just to have a chance at attacking anyone.

bald zeemer
08-30-2013, 05:24 AM
Fair call, BM. And that certain syndicate stands out like a sore thumb for the insanely low average stats of its players.


Depends on your definition of 'top' - the poster I replied to appeared to be thinking as low as top 100/75/50. These teams certainly would benefit from anyone with several hundred doomsday frags, for example.

Fair enough. I came at it from a fairly one-sided perspective.

Green Drake
08-30-2013, 05:32 AM
What did the top 25 syndicates actually use the data for? I have a difficult to e believing that its sole purpose was to weed out respect point and money hackers........my kid could figure out a person with 500 doomsday was not legit.

Has to be a pretty effective recruiting tool, correct? To be able to see that player x has 1500 gold on hand and has purchased 40k gold seems to be pretty valuable info.

bald zeemer
08-30-2013, 05:46 AM
It's just as easy to get a pretty accurate idea of how much gold someone has spent as it is to see if they are RP hacking/time travelling. Even easier, if you are doing a detailed inventory check.

hg789
08-30-2013, 05:47 AM
To what end are you checking opponents? If not to gain a form of intelligence on them that the developers never intended you should have (an advantage), then it seems a very fascile activity you are using your energies on.

As I said, to satiate my curiosity. It in no way helps me to find out an opponents skill point distribution, gold spent, or anything else like that after i've just attacked/robbed them.

Perhaps if i had a database populated from previous attacks and hoods i've visited, shared and populated by numerous other players, then that that would be a different story. But personally I don't do that, so i maintain my claim that i've gained no competitive advantage.



You suggest all top teams do it. They do not. Are you suggesting that all top team should participate in data cheating to 'level the playing field' as you put it?

No, i just suggested that they probably already are. Post #60 listed multiple syndicates in the top 25 that have similar systems in place. I'm not naive enough to believe the others don't.



... It is not much of a secret that certain top teams include hackers/cash cheats/RP cheats. Should all top teams be obliged to engage in these activities too to level your playing field?

No, but it's also no secret Gree doesn't give a toss about cheaters. Cheaters just encourage non-cheaters to buy more gold.

BigMoney
08-30-2013, 06:38 AM
No, i just suggested that they probably already are. Post #60 listed multiple syndicates in the top 25 that have similar systems in place. I'm not naive enough to believe the others don't.

No, these aren't multiple syndicates in the top25 she was referring to, these are multiple syndicates in the top3 she was referring to. Plus one guy in HTC who everyone knows anyway.

montecore
08-30-2013, 09:23 AM
I've been curious about this database for a while now, and once had started a very long thread about it, which gave one poor guy a permanent vacation when he tried to explain the difference between reading data and UDID hacking (the kind of real hacking done to my friend Baddad's account). This is what I have found out so far. And, since everyone seems to like numbered lists, I'll even use numbers.


If you still think baddad was hacked, and he didn't willingly give his UDID to Ian so Ian could collect for him or score for him, then your detective skills need work. But I will humor you and go through your points anyway.



1. That a top syndicate, that is higher than second, has a data reader.


It wouldn't surprise me. I have heard "they have something similar" but nothing I would say is provable as a fact. I know they have planted at least one spy on SAS and in SAS chatrooms, and seem to gather information very quickly, so very little would surprise me.



2. That a self proclaimed smug syndicate has a data reader.


Maybe they do. But if you are going to grade all syndicates in the game on ethics since the start of the game to today, they would score higher than any other team in the top 50.



3. SAS first created their own data reader program, but the guy who made it left for Rogues, but has since left Rogues and is now MIA.


There was a very intelligent, and I believe ethical player, who put together a rudimentary database while in SAS which got much more advanced once he left. My favorite part to the database was that it could export your entire inventory into CSV or an Excel spreadsheet. I can't believe Gree won't put this together when it took this person a few hours. It had other ethical uses as well, which I tend to categorize in the "things anyone could do with Excel themselves if they didn't mind spending 100 hours to do it". And it could (and was) used to determine if people were time travelers or hackers.



4. That you "register" online to become a part of the data-reader created in SAS.


Once the player left for Rogues, everyone in SAS lost access. We also lost access to our website, many of our spreadsheets and battle data, and all kinds of stuff. I still hope at some point RG takes a look and gives us copies as I'd love to know what a ponse I was in our first battle, or how I did in the very first PVP event we won. My understanding is that everyone in Rogues was given access to it once he joined.



5. That last I heard (and I heard this very very recently), the leader of a top syndicate who are a bunch of very noisy hired killers, is still a registered user of this database.


I went on a bit of an OCD sociopathic rampage against Rogues a few months back, and bagging on the database was one of my targets. A friend in Rogues downloaded about 1600 documents which I showed to various players and syndicate leaders. I was pissed off that they had access and others did not. My goal was to get them to open it up for all of the other syndicates or shut it down completely, and the eventual result is that RG opened it up for the top 25 leaders in his leader's chatroom. Since then I heard they stopped updating it and stopped using it completely. It was suspected they just moved it somewhere new but with the creator gone and the headaches it has caused I tend to believe them.

I have always gone out of my way to not name the person who created it, even when asked point blank, because I do believe they are ethical, I loved discussing technology with them, and I always liked them.



6. A certain narcissistic, hypocritical, tiger-loving blow hard, who presents himself as holier than thou, was also a registered user of this database, first created by SAS.


I actually never had an account, I believe back then it was just open access if you had the link. I can assure you I never had a login/password since the member went Rogue.

I know that you think about me constantly. Many have commented on this seemingly explosive attraction you feel towards me. All you can think about is montecore. Always on your mind. But I want to remind you that while I am a real person at the end of this keyboard, you have fallen in love with an online persona. You don't know the real me and frankly I don't need yet another stalker trying to win my affection.



And, in case anyone else would like to change the subject, I think I'll have FISHSTICKS for dinner tonight. Look, I used ALLCAPS again.

As esteemed judge of character, and a refined palette to boot. Treat yourself to Heinz, the others are simply catsup.

LegoCity
08-30-2013, 11:54 AM
1)If you still think baddad was hacked, and he didn't willingly give his UDID to Ian so Ian could collect for him or score for him, then your detective skills need work. But I will humor you and go through your points anyway.


2)Once the player left for Rogues, everyone in SAS lost access. We also lost access to our website, many of our spreadsheets and battle data, and all kinds of stuff. I still hope at some point RG takes a look and gives us copies as I'd love to know what a ponse I was in our first battle, or how I did in the very first PVP event we won. My understanding is that everyone in Rogues was given access to it once he joined.


3)I actually never had an account, I believe back then it was just open access if you had the link. I can assure you I never had a login/password since the member went Rogue.

.......

1)This is the most stupidest excuses I ever heard. If I put my wallet on the table and somebody take it; takes all the money and thats not make him a thief ?
2,3)Sorry, but I would say 'I dont think so' :rolleyes:

You people steal/ hack whatever you name it, have guy create computer programs....are u SAS all work in CIA :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

montecore
08-30-2013, 12:12 PM
1)This is the most stupidest excuses I ever heard. If I put my wallet on the table and somebody take it; takes all the money and thats not make him a thief ?
2,3)Sorry, but I would say 'I dont think so' :rolleyes:

You people steal/ hack whatever you name it, have guy create computer programs....are u SAS all work in CIA :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

If I gave you my bank password and told you that you could use it in January, it's one thing. And if you used it in February without asking, it's fair to say it is inappropriate. But it doesn't mean you hacked anything.

You can believe what you want, but I think Matt and just about anyone in Rogues wouldn't disagree with me on points #2 or 3. They might disagree with others, but not those two.

Rogues may not even have access to some of our old spreadsheets, as access to some of it may have been taken by killshot.

MattThomas08
08-30-2013, 12:30 PM
If I gave you my bank password and told you that you could use it in January, it's one thing. And if you used it in February without asking, it's fair to say it is inappropriate. But it doesn't mean you hacked anything.

You can believe what you want, but I think Matt and just about anyone in Rogues wouldn't disagree with me on points #2 or 3. They might disagree with others, but not those two.

Rogues may not even have access to some of our old spreadsheets, as access to some of it may have been taken by killshot.

I have all the data and could possibly be persuaded to pass it along. I'm a real data hoarder. You're right though, since I set up all the sheets for SAS, I took em all with me :-/.

montecore
08-30-2013, 12:41 PM
I have all the data and could possibly be persuaded to pass it along. I'm a real data hoarder. You're right though, since I set up all the sheets for SAS, I took em all with me :-/.

I think providing copies of the data is the right thing to do, but you hold the documents and it's obviously your decision.

Rebels
08-30-2013, 12:56 PM
I think it's time everyone puts past incidence's behind them and makes a step forward. Don't look in the rear view mirror all your life...... You won't see what's happening ahead.
I believe everyone enjoys CC and its up to us as players not just Gree to make it an enjoyable game but a game with honest respectful morals.

We have two well know members of the community, that a Lot of people look up to and ask for advice setting an example that could be a little tidier.
As 'leaders' of the community we lowly humble meek peasants look up to members such as yourself. I am not bagging anyone and I may be speaking out of place, but we all can make this game a better place. :)

Cheers Jimmy

mxz
08-30-2013, 01:26 PM
Maybe they do. But if you are going to grade all syndicates in the game on ethics since the start of the game to today, they would score higher than any other team in the top 50.People are going to start thinking you blue Dippy......

montecore
08-30-2013, 02:22 PM
People are going to start thinking you blue Dippy......

montecore sold his forum account to me over a month ago.

CohibAA
09-02-2013, 05:28 PM
No official reply. Interesting.

CohibAA
09-07-2013, 04:07 PM
Yes, this is a ToS violation.

Thank you for the response.