GREE, please change the way Guild Quest rewards are given out

[Romel]

Hi Sirus,

Hope you take this feedback seriously. The way guild quest rewards are given out is a complete farce. Currently, they are tagged to the guild and anyone joining the guild will gain all units earned all the way back to the first GQ. This really doesn't make sense when you compare the way rewards are given out for guild wars.

As an officer of a Top 100 guild, I have seen a spate of LLP applying for top guilds just so they can get the rewards from the GQ. You are devaluing the rest of us who spend so much effort and gems to get them only to see that almost everyone now has the winter dragon and song siren..

I hope you can change it. I understand that by doing it this way, it is probably a programming limitation because unlike the guild wars, recruitment is allowed during GQ. So you have to tag the rewards to the guild and not the players.

There must be a sound reasoning on why you award the units for guild wars as such. Can you imagine if guild war rewards are given out in the same manner as GQ ? Any new LLP can just join a top guild and they earn everything back to the first guild war... Wouldn't that hurt your pockets since there is an easy way for LLP to gain stats now?

Simple solution. Change GQ rewards to same treatment as guild wars. Disallow recruitment during this period. You can even hold back all the rewards and only give them out at the end of GQ, if all this is because of a programming limitation.

Btw, no offense to those guilds that are peddling the song siren as a way to attract new recruits . Our guild has completed the GQ , but no way are we devaluing our efforts by giving it to someone else for free.

[Djjazzc]

Completely agree. We have had jumpers in our guild, (That's what we call them). Jump in, get the rewards and jump out again. You can say we should vet them first, but at the end of the day you only have their word and previous comments from their profile. Members spend Gems to get through the Guild Quests and it's a complete waste. It's even been suggested that the next Guild Quest we won't bother and do the same as low level players. We won't do this !! But until this has been corrected I don't blame people for doing what is an easy way of boosting stats.
This will be rife until it is corrected !!

[Romel]

All who support change to this please post your comments.
Can you imagine the Raid Boss event is the same as well?
And we are early into GQ, only 2 times.. What about a couple of months from now? Any new player can just get 500k stats by doing nothing.. Sure throws the game balance off.
Already the value of building level 10 BD and GL are thrown down the drain with the LTQ rewards, GREE don't make it worse with GQ rewards too.

[Shluggy]

I absolutely agree, and we have had many guild hoppers! It's really not fair on our kind of people who are very loyal to our guilds and have been right from the very start of the wars. And also guild leaders who can't be hopping around gaining those very valuable units left right and centre. As a guild leader myself it is now a policy of the PFJ to not accept ANY new requests from now on during a guild quest until this is changed.

[KingKadiyala]

I agree 100 percent with you guys. All the points mentioned in above posts are absolutely true. And what i feel surprise is how GREE team has abruptly introduced these GQs without proper testing. I think they forget day by day that they are running an online game played by some thousands of people. They just think of money and more money!! So funny GREE..you guys absolutely ruining the game. Grow up GREE kids..come on

[Alexius]

Here's a solution, don't accept anyone until the guild quest is over with.

[Valid or]

I think he is talking about after the guild quest is finished, and old rewards being given out.
If you take a new member in druing the guild quest they should be eligible for the rewards as the rewards go to all guild members.(if you have people jumping in to get wht you have then leave, maybe one should look at their interview prosess and tweek it)
Once the quest is finished no rewards should be given out let alone old rewards.

[TheQ]

I totally agree. Guild quest prizes should be given out like guild war prizes. Once they are awarded, the prize is locked. It really is unfair to those of us who actually spent gems trying to get them. It is maddening to know that people are jumping guilds and getting them for nothing. Gree, this has to be changed!

[Romel]

Thanks valid or.. My point exactly.
For those who don't know, one can't change guilds during war, so that GREE can credit all the war rewards to all the members of that guild once the war ends and not tag anything.
Because GQ units have to be collected, you have to log in to get each individual unit. The units won't appear unless you log into the game.. As such they have to tag the GQ units to the guild which is a silly idea

[LegoLass]

I agree with much of the discussion on this thread. I don't have a problem with new recruits receiving the current guild quest reward, but receiving all of them back to the beginning doesn't seem fair to those players that busted their butt (or wallet) to obtain them.

[Person]

I'm 99% certain that this is a glitch and not the way it's meant to be. Go send in a ****load of tickets! Mine is sent :)

[TheQ]

Ticket sent.

[jonny0284]

Here's the logic to the other side:

What if you have two accounts? On two devices? Why is it unfair to toss your LLP into the Guild to earn the rewards that you already paid for with your HLP? Hmm?

Again, if it was you that was benefiting, there wouldn't be this argument. It's only unfair because you're not taking advantage of the situation. It's logical. It's smart. And, it's not a horrible plan.

[Vaevictis]

I think it should work as follows.

I am in a guild when the unit is received from completion the quest/event then I keep the unit forever.

I join a guild after the units are received, I get them for as long as I am in the guild. If I leave, they are removed from my character.

This means if I earned them, I keep them. If I didn't earn them, I can use them while in the guild that did earn them, allowing me to help my guild loaning me the units.

[jonny0284]

I join a guild after the units are received, I get them for as long as I am in the guild. If I leave, they are removed from my character.

And, what if you're kicked out of the Guild? Hmmmm......?

[Rastlin]

And, what if you're kicked out of the Guild? Hmmmm......?
It is the same as losing the boosts from that guild. You put the gold in, and get kicked out you lose the boosts. Same should be for the Units.

[jonny0284]

The boosts are only gained from using Gold. While many can say they are purchasing Gold to donate, we can all safely say they are full of it.

You're only out Gold. Gold is an in-game generated source of income.

If you spend money on Gems to compete in the GQ, then you're out real money.

See the logic? There's no way GREE is going to venture down that street. Or, they could with everything we've seen these days.

[Eddard KFF]

The downside of disabling recruitment during LTQ time is you can't get rid of freeloaders. In war, you can see inactive players and they can't be cut off until war is done and they get their free units and bonuses. And recruiting during guild quests is a good idea if you pick the right guys to help out. Sorry man, I respect your opinion, but Im fine with the way it is now.

[Vaevictis]

Jonny,

holding to my original post:

If you were in the guild when they are won, i.e. spending gems to get the units, then you would keep them forever.

If you join after they are won, i.e. you didnt spend since you were not in the guild, then you would lose the units when you left or are kicked out. But if you joined another guild that has them, then you would get them back as long as you were in that guild. ect.

Basically as a guild I want to give my members every unit/benefit I can. But if they leave or are booted, then I do not want them to retain things we gave them while they were not in the guild to contribute to earning them.

[GoGoGadgetSword]

Although Jonny has some valid points, I do agree with what the majority are saying. Maybe this is Gree's way of wanting people to create a 2nd account if they haven't done so already.

[jonny0284]

If you were in the guild when they are won, i.e. spending gems to get the units, then you would keep them forever.

We agree.


If you join after they are won, i.e. you didnt spend since you were not in the guild, then you would lose the units when you left or are kicked out. But if you joined another guild that has them, then you would get them back as long as you were in that guild, etc.

You're talking about a matter of timing in the programming and connection to servers during these events. Then comes the issue of adding/dropping/re-adding units, that would be a headache for GREE support! They can't even get normal issue of units right sometimes; IMAGINE this one? Imagine how many people just creating tickets to get units that they thought they earned or should be allowed to keep, etc.

Seriously. I imagine the Support staff and Programming staff would laugh at this process, shake their heads and say "No way." Exactly like they do with the "SKILL RESET" that too many people shed tears over.


Basically as a guild I want to give my members every unit/benefit I can. But if they leave or are booted, then I do not want them to retain things we gave them while they were not in the guild to contribute to earning them. So, freeloaders you have a problem with. ;)

[KAsean]

I agree with Vaevictus, I want to benefit my new members with the units my guild has earned, BUT I don't want to give them away to new members who can join for a day, then leave and take hundreds of hours of work and gems required to gain those units.

If you are in the guild when awarded, you should get the unit forever.
If you join after the unit is awarded, it should be part of the guild bonus for as long as you stay in the guild. If you leave, you don't keep an unearned unit.

[sousas]

As previously said in another thread I don't see GREE to allow this to continue for much longer.

[Vaevictis]

Seriously. I imagine the Support staff and Programming staff would laugh at this process, shake their heads and say "No way." Exactly like they do with the "SKILL RESET" that too many people shed tears over.


No doubt, the Gree programmers would not like this idea. But I am not coming at it from their perspective. I am coming at it from an end user. I am telling their customer relationship team what I would like to have. Even if it is not something their coders would like to do, a designer usually would want to know what the end users would like. That does not mean they will design it that way. There to too many reasons to list but it might be too hard, to costly, not have time in the release cycle, or not technically possible.

[Krissy]

So a guild leader should be able to kick people out right before the final prize is alloted. Tough luck if I don't like you and you have spent a bunch of gems. My friends appreciate it. NOT!!!!!!

[valient]

I agree all the way 100%

[Lady Freya]

I speak for most of our guild members: This strange reward distribution has to change. Many of our members worked hard and sacrificed gems for these guild quest rewards, and then we had some of these jumpers join our guild and then leave. We figured out what was going on.

[Shinazueli]

I think this isn't even about technical aspects. I think it's another way of them sideways screwing campers over while saying "we don't care about campers". Before this you were still safe below level 25 ish, because you wouldn't be competing against anyone with boss units in their inventory. Now, you're competing against people with GQ units. Nobody is safe, except for the very top spenders. Just the way Gree likes it.

[MaGiX]

How about making an effort on recruitment, talking to newcomers and trying to find out what they are made of, and if they are only there to collect?

What top guild will ever allow LLP, that is not their own, to come into their guild?

Of cause there is always a risk of getting new members up to no good, we have had spies, saboteurs and free loaders in our guilds, way before the guild quests even started, so that is nothing new either.

We use this as awards for members of our training guild, to participate in their guild, work hard on their stats and be there for war time, to go up to one of our top guilds, collect a couple of great units to grow them even further, and it is a HUGE moral boost for them and for us.

And the low level requester that got nothing to offer, those we just reject at the door, easy as that...

I for one say leave it as it is, and if anyone only join and then leave again, you (hopefully) is smart enough to have noted name and level, and then that poor smock is free game, to pick on, raid and plunder on all given times, until he/she quit game or spends 50 gem on a new name... That is what we do with the few smocks that tried that one with us...

[Johnjohnb4]

I agree! I started last sept., and have since built up my army/buildings to get the most out of boss events. I even finished the Dagon quest completely, and I've moved up a tier. Before dead of winter/the other guild quest started, my only losses were from guild wars and a few from others twice my ally count. My guild only reached the dark reanimator 3600/2400 and gnome war dragon 480/180. Now I lose everyday! I tap revenge, rivals profile, and their only units are winter dragon, kato archer, kato count, the rest of the guild rewards, and a few boss event units. Their base? All level 1 buildings, maybe a lvl 2or 3 silo. All that work (well, really time) wasted building up myself, and then players are beating me in their first week of play. How is that fair? And I wonder how many guild points they have? Not nearly enough!

[Mickeytah]

Here's the logic to the other side:

What if you have two accounts? On two devices? Why is it unfair to toss your LLP into the Guild to earn the rewards that you already paid for with your HLP? Hmm?

Again, if it was you that was benefiting, there wouldn't be this argument. It's only unfair because you're not taking advantage of the situation. It's logical. It's smart. And, it's not a horrible plan.

I deal with this argument on a daily basis at work with customers who have multiple accounts and don't understand why a company as big as the one I work for can't tell that the accounts are owned by the same person. The system sees each account as a different person because how is the system supposed to know that two different accounts created on two different devices were created by the same set of fat thumbs? The only way for a computer system to know that multiple characters are run by the same person is if the system is set up so that one account can hold multiple characters like WoW or Diablo III.

While I can see your point of "But I already did the work with my HLP," I say that if you are going to create a new character, then you should be prepared to do the same work on both accounts, just like in WoW or any other game where you level your character and save your progress. Just because you made it to level 80 with your Night Elf Hunter doesn't mean if you create another account or even another character, that new character should also be level 80. You're going to have to start from scratch, and if a person is not okay with starting from scratch, then don't create a new character. Ever. In any game.

That being said, I don't mind people cycling in their LLPs after they've finished the Guild Quests (and I would do it if I had an LLP,) but I would also bet dollars to donuts that the number of people getting free units for their main (and only) account without having done anything but jump in and out of a guild is far higher than the number of people who are just cycling in their LLPs after earning the unit with their HLPs. So, I don't think it's worth it overall to allow it. Especially not for previous GLTQs.

[Romel]

Another solution.
Tag the GQ rewards to the guild bonuses section we see in our profiles. That way, if the jumpers don't measure up, they don't get to keep the units after they are booted. It doesn't have to be units rewards earned for GQ cos it's probably hard to remove a unit. The GQ rewards can be a generic bonus like the guild bonuses.
For instance, the guild bonuses would look like
+ 100k attack and defence
+ 5% health regen
+ 1 energy per minute

[sousas]

Another solution.
Tag the GQ rewards to the guild bonuses section we see in our profiles. That way, if the jumpers don't measure up, they don't get to keep the units after they are booted. It doesn't have to be units rewards earned for GQ cos it's probably hard to remove a unit. The GQ rewards can be a generic bonus like the guild bonuses.
For instance, the guild bonuses would look like
+ 100k attack and defence
+ 5% health regen
+ 1 energy per minute

That would give to much power to the guild.

If after several GLTQ you are kicked out of the guild you loose all bonus.

I prefer the no in/out during GLTQ, like with guild wars. It stops several types of abuse.

[TK275]

The only problem with the current setup is gree forgot to add the part about when the event is over stop giving out the rewards. You shouldn't win a reward after the event is over, and winning all past events is just ridiculous.

[Shinazueli]

That would give to much power to the guild.

If after several GLTQ you are kicked out of the guild you loose all bonus.

I prefer the no in/out during GLTQ, like with guild wars. It stops several types of abuse.

And opens up several others. Like not being able to boot non-participants. There is no easy answer.

[Aclark]

We have had several guild LTQ unit gatherers as well

[sousas]

And opens up several others. Like not being able to boot non-participants. There is no easy answer.

A minor problem compared with the ones created by allowing people in/out.

I agree with you, there is no easy answer and maybe there is no perfect solution, but at least lets reduce the size of the problem.

[MrsSith]

Anyone else noticed that people who leave and rejoin are reawarded their guild points? This was not supposed to be the case. I think its better that your points stick, wish the gold donations did too.

We've also had several guild quest reward hoppers - we ask new members directly but have put a minimum donation to the guild on it. Or we ask that they commit to stay through a war and score minimum points.

You can't stop people making the most of bugs in the game, but you can try and benefit from them doing so.

[Julius Wheezer]

As previously said in another thread I don't see GREE to allow this to continue for much longer.

Has anybody else actually sent a ticket to support? My assumption is that it's a fault and not a deliberate choice on the part of GREE.

[Shinazueli]

We have come up with an interesting way to somewhat diffuse our guild hopper problem.

We normally require at least 300k gold per week in donations. So we've simply changed our recruitment to now also require that the first 3 weeks donations be applied immediately upon joining, and we don't accept any requests during a guild quest event or immediately after.

While we understand that we still can have guild hoppers join for just a second, the delay after a guild quest means that these players will most likely find another guild to mooch from before we will accept their request, and a 1M gold donation prevents general free loading. If they leave after only a week we still have their 1M gold. Win win.

Also, most of these players are simply too stupid to clear their walls, so you have months worth of "welcome to our guild" and "hey please participate" posts on it; I don't even bother replying, just reject the app immediately. We haven't had a bad experience since we started this policy.

Just caveat emptor, and you'll be fine.

[LegoLass]

Until this is sorted, we are only accepting new applicants that have the guild units already.

[QueenPin]

Thank you everyone for your input. All of your thoughts and comments have been shared with the game developers to consider.

[plavine]

This is tough one.
I've had players request to be in my guild who are low level( under 100) that have better units than I have because they were in a high guild that kicked them out because they couldn't pull their weight. While I don't think it is fair to remove the units from a player when they get kicked out , how can gree determine a "guild jumper" from a player who was just cut to make room for a better player?? It does annoy me when I see lower level players with these high items , high attack score and 76 attack swords that they got so easily , when the rest of us had to spend alot of time and effort( part of the original concept of the game) hoping the right 42 attack sword would drop from one of the lands .

[Romel]

Plavine,
Which is why it would be fair to only keep what you earn--- if you were in the guild when the GQ is completed. Not when you join after.

[plavine]

Maybe you are right .

[Shwa]

Please fix this problem. Guild members should only receive the guild rewards if they were part of the guild when they were earned. We have had several jumpers from our guild. And even blatant request to let them join exchange for money. I don't believe this was the intent of the game developers when they came up with these cool Guild Quests. Please fix.

[Anonymouse]

I think the easiest/fairest thing going forward would be to limit the rewards to those who were in the guild when they were earned, i.e. have no retroactive rewards.

That doesn't fix the over abundance of owned but unearned guild rewards floating around, though.

[Shinazueli]

There is an easy fix to this. Since not letting people get the guild units after so many people already got them would be totally unfair to the players who did not get these benefits. While it is also unfair for guilds to work hard to get these rewards and be forced to give these units to new people that join without a choice.

So how to fix this?

Simply give the guild leaders/officers the power to approve new members before they get these units. This would force new members to prove themselves and contribute to the guild before they get that guild perks.

Assuming this is possible to do got Gree(d).

If it is not than they should leave it as it is now and guilds need to come up with their own screening procedures for new members to avoid the jumpers.

Guild leaders should not have this much power, sorry. Waaaaay too open to abuse. They'll never do it.

[Person]

Guild leaders should not have this much power, sorry. Waaaaay too open to abuse. They'll never do it. not to mention they'd have to code a system like that. And to be honest, their coding skills have been proven to be inadequate at times. Or they just don't know what to do with Funzios codes.

[Smexy]

Gifting of past earned units should be eliminated and then you avoid this issue. It should be on a going forward basis, for accounting purposes that should be simple, when an event ends so does the unit. I know its a wonderful bonus and makes higher ranked guilds more attractive, but it is insane when i see a decent stat player jumping from guild to guild before wars. Comment wall is scattered with, "hey why don't you speak in chat?" or "Welcome to XXXXX" but that message appears 7 times in a 24 hour time frame.

[Shinazueli]

Indeed, the ability of them being able to code such a thing would probably be the biggest downfall of the idea.

At this point I would like them to put the mouse down and step away from the computer before they hurt someone. Sirius-ly.

[gherbstman]

I think the members historical stats should be able to be reviewed before accepting someone into a guild. I think that is fair all around and the member is responsible for being a good guild member if they want to get into another guild.

The Grateful Dead Guild - 868-491-579

[l3lade2]

It's simple in my book....if you join a new guild you do not get any units won by the guild from previous guild wars...so why are guild quests any different?

These are 2 completely contrasting approaches from GREE, which suggests design flaw as opposed to intent. There is no logic to having the 2 total opposites of each other, presumably it's a coding (knowledge) limitation.

Personally I don't like that you can walk into a new guild and get the units for free, you didn't work for them, or spend money in a lot of peoples cases, so why should anyone expect them.

[Rastlin]

Personally I don't like that you can walk into a new guild and get the units for free, you didn't work for them, or spend money in a lot of peoples cases, so why should anyone expect them.
+1 I 100% agree!

[Spi]

So what's the status on this one?

[spyglassk]

Guild rewards aren't inherited any longer.

All the new joiners to our guild don't get the rewards previously earned.

[Romel]

Good job GREE on this! You make the rewards we earn become more valuable to us now and certainly more appreciated:) thumbs up!

[Johan -]

Thank you everyone for your input. All of your thoughts and comments have been shared with the game developers to consider.

Hello QueenPin and other GREE employees,

Please update us what you have done against the guild hoppers.
Guild rewards for sure shouldn't be given to anyone who joins a guild after finishing a GLTQ, this is simply unfair, many committed members spent much time & gems to finish quests. *** rewards cannot be given for free! ***

[collage]

Read previous 2 posts above before posting....


Hello QueenPin and other GREE employees,

Please update us what you have done against the guild hoppers.
Guild rewards for sure shouldn't be given to anyone who joins a guild after finishing a GLTQ, this is simply unfair, many committed members spent much time & gems to finish quests. *** rewards cannot be given for free! ***

[Johan -]

Read previous 2 posts above before posting....

Of course I have seen that, but that is still no confirmation from the GREE team.....

[Shinazueli]

You won't get one. They almost never post. That's why the forum exists. Because its cheaper to outsource their support. And because their paid support is incompetent anyway.

[Johan -]

I must agree about that.... it's like a scratch card..;), to find a reply we must be lucky...

[KAS]

We also find that it is not fair for few guild members playing very hard or spending gems for guild quest. But those members who do not play at all get the rewards as well. What I suggest is each stage has its own minimal kills for each member in order to get reward unit. For example, if stage one requires 50 kills, then each member has to contribute 5 kills at least in order to get unit; for those who do not show up, they get zero. I think this is fair to each member.

[MrsSith]

We also find that it is not fair for few guild members playing very hard or spending gems for guild quest. But those members who do not play at all get the rewards as well. What I suggest is each stage has its own minimal kills for each member in order to get reward unit. For example, if stage one requires 50 kills, then each member has to contribute 5 kills at least in order to get unit; for those who do not show up, they get zero. I think this is fair to each member.

Agreed that guilds really need everyone to contribute, but depending on when the quest starts, some members move on through the quest whilst others are sleeping. The last two quests our guild has been 6 or 7 levels in before I even knew it was on. So having to contribute to each level would not have been possible for me or our other UK based members. I think kills should count towards the guild quest regardless of whether the guild & individual are in sync. That way the guild quest would require more guild members to complete the individual LTQ without the quickest off the mark, taking on the burden of completing the entire guild quest.

[It's all a dream]

We also find that it is not fair for few guild members playing very hard or spending gems for guild quest. But those members who do not play at all get the rewards as well. What I suggest is each stage has its own minimal kills for each member in order to get reward unit. For example, if stage one requires 50 kills, then each member has to contribute 5 kills at least in order to get unit; for those who do not show up, they get zero. I think this is fair to each member.

sounds to me you need to work on your guild some more.
plus last GQ was linked to LTQ. guess you didnt notice that.

[Jerusalem]

We also find that it is not fair for few guild members playing very hard or spending gems for guild quest. But those members who do not play at all get the rewards as well. What I suggest is each stage has its own minimal kills for each member in order to get reward unit. For example, if stage one requires 50 kills, then each member has to contribute 5 kills at least in order to get unit; for those who do not show up, they get zero. I think this is fair to each member.

I understand your point, but the idea you put forth is a terrible one. If you keep going down this road, you end up diluting the purpose of being in a guild and the benefits thereof.

Rather, why don't you develop a guild environment that promotes communication among its members, especially about the guild's short and long term goals, and communicate what the guild expects of each member. If those expectations aren't met, show them the door.

[MrsSith]

I understand your point, but the idea you put forth is a terrible one. If you keep going down this road, you end up diluting the purpose of being in a guild and the benefits thereof.

Rather, why don't you develop a guild environment that promotes communication among its members, especially about the guild's short and long term goals, and communicate what the guild expects of each member. If those expectations aren't met, show them the door. well said!

[Kronous]

I understand your point, but the idea you put forth is a terrible one. If you keep going down this road, you end up diluting the purpose of being in a guild and the benefits thereof.

Rather, why don't you develop a guild environment that promotes communication among its members, especially about the guild's short and long term goals, and communicate what the guild expects of each member. If those expectations aren't met, show them the door.

I agree. i have a kingdom that was not able to participate due to her level, not her desire. I prefer her getting stronger to leveling just to reap our rewards

[KAS]

I understand your point, but the idea you put forth is a terrible one. If you keep going down this road, you end up diluting the purpose of being in a guild and the benefits thereof.

Rather, why don't you develop a guild environment that promotes communication among its members, especially about the guild's short and long term goals, and communicate what the guild expects of each member. If those expectations aren't met, show them the door.

Thanks for the suggestion and will try to do that. Bottom line, it has to be fair for every guild member.

[Kjctnorris]

We also find that it is not fair for few guild members playing very hard or spending gems for guild quest. But those members who do not play at all get the rewards as well. What I suggest is each stage has its own minimal kills for each member in order to get reward unit. For example, if stage one requires 50 kills, then each member has to contribute 5 kills at least in order to get unit; for those who do not show up, they get zero. I think this is fair to each member.
That would be terrible. Most quests start after I go to bed. When I wake up, our U.S. team knocks out about five or six stages and I get none of the action. But then I and the other Asian/ European players knock out a few and the U.S. players would miss out.

If your members aren't participating, get new ones.

[LegendaryV]

Because guild rewards are no longer inherited, it kind of shafts new players. Basically it is saying to new players, don't join established guilds because you will miss out on the old GQ rewards.

I understand about the guild hoppers and all, but now all of you have rubber-stamped NOT welcoming new players to your guild. Essentially, new players are better off in brand new guilds so they may build it together and attempt to gain the rewards together.

How is that helping or welcoming to new players trying to play such a deeply established game - basically they will not get any boosts.

EDIT: I know most of you will tell me "People spent real money" to contribute to the completion of those quests. But then all you are saying is I don't want people to piggy back of my money or efforts. To me that is still unwelcoming and kind of selfish. But to each their own. Anyways, since guild rewards are not inherited, I think the previous guild quest rewards, should be purchaseable with gold. That way at least if a new player joined a good and ESTABLISHED guild, they still have access to previously achieved Guild rewards - and they do not have to go and find a non-established guild to collect the previous ones.

[Shadows]

Because guild rewards are no longer inherited, it kind of shafts new players. Basically it is saying to new players, don't join established guilds because you will miss out on the old GQ rewards.

I understand about the guild hoppers and all, but now all of you have rubber-stamped NOT welcoming new players to your guild. Essentially, new players are better off in brand new guilds so they may build it together and attempt to gain the rewards together.

I guess I don't really understand the argument here... new players are _still_ welcomed, and thanks to the experience of the other guild members, they will earn units that they cannot earn just by their own strengths in the next coming guild quest (and those are legion LOL)... while it's true that they cannot get the units from past quests when they were not part of the guild, I don't understand how a new player could think they were entitled to something they didn't earn from a guild they were not a part of...

Also, I think that new players will do better in established guilds than in brand new guilds that are still trying to figure things out-- less coordination means doing poorer in most guild quests than established guilds, right?

Long story short, I love that people cannot get units until they earn them in a guild... and **** guild hoppers!

just my two cents...

[Kjctnorris]

But then all you are saying is I don't want people to piggy back of my money or efforts.
I'm ok with you thinking that. I'm not sure why players would think they're entitled to a Super Bowl ring when they join as a free agent the year after.

If someone thinks they should get free stuff just for joining without putting forth any effort, I'm ok with them not being on the team.

[sousas]

I only hope GREE never does the mistake of linking GQ prizes to guilds.

[gubbel]

didnt knew this, always was wondering how people got over 100k attack and defend at very low levels... to be hounest i think its a shame i didnt knew this, everyone likes free units right ;) but afterall its better this way, even you can't take them back anymore now

[Johan -]

didnt knew this, always was wondering how people got over 100k attack and defend at very low levels... to be hounest i think its a shame i didnt knew this, everyone likes free units right ;) but afterall its better this way, even you can't take them back anymore now

In many guilds some high level players, start a LLP account, when in their guild is room, why not bring in your LLP.
I, 10 days ago did the same.
With the guild box event my LLP could help our guild, so I brought him in, my LLP was lv.10 at that time. Now 10 days later, my LLP has stats of 120k att/deff, due to the boss event he is lv.38 now. The guild quest brought for my LLP a stat increase of approx. 60~70k . This is only in 10 days time! My LLP donate the min. Required gold and will be fully active during the guild wars!

[jchow69]

It would be great if during the guild LTQs, you can't leave or join a guild.

[Jerusalem]

It would be great if during the guild LTQs, you can't leave or join a guild.

Not a particularly good or thought-out idea.

[jchow69]

Not a particularly good or thought-out idea.

Why not? You can treat it like it is the guild wars.

[Shinazueli]

We just don't accept any requests during a GQ. Same difference.

[Jerusalem]

Why not? You can treat it like it is the guild wars.

It's because you're promoting another one size fits all sort of solution that only serves to hinder guilds. Notably, you're taking the decision making power away from the guilds. If guilds don't want to add new members, that's their discretion. However, there may be guilds who wish/need new members to help with their quests. and the members now will earn guild units only going forward. Because the primary issue underlying guild hopping has been dealt with satisfactorily, there is no good justification to divest guilds of their right to add and/or remove members during a guild quest.

[Shinazueli]

It's because you're promoting another one size fits all sort of solution that only serves to hinder guilds. Notably, you're taking the decision making power away from the guilds. If guilds don't want to add new members, that's their discretion. However, there may be guilds who wish/need new members to help with their quests. and the members now will earn guild units only going forward. Because the primary issue underlying guild hopping has been dealt with satisfactorily, there is no good justification to divest guilds of their right to add and/or remove members during a guild quest.

It's been "dealt with" but it's created a whole host of other problems at the lower levels. While the GQs were still being inherited they added at least several hundred thousand stats to a LLP who joined. That may not mean very much at the tippy top level of play, but it's a game breaking difference at low levels. If those players choose not to level or just camp hard and move slow they're invincible for the next 60 levels or so.

Without removing the units from people I don't see how they could resolve it, and there's no way to know who earned them and who didn't. So it's f'ed. If you were one of the lucky few who benefitted from it you've got a huge lead on the competition for as long as you choose to exploit it.

I'm not saying they should have kept the inheritance, I'm saying the fact that it existed for any length of time at all had a huge, irreversible effect on the lower levels. GG Gree.

Also, to the posters point, there is still the matter of being able to kick members who've earned the unit before they get it, which was the whole point of locking guilds down during guild wars. To remove the potential for abuse.

[Jerusalem]

It's been "dealt with" but it's created a whole host of other problems at the lower levels. While the GQs were still being inherited they added at least several hundred thousand stats to a LLP who joined. That may not mean very much at the tippy top level of play, but it's a game breaking difference at low levels. If those players choose not to level or just camp hard and move slow they're invincible for the next 60 levels or so.

Without removing the units from people I don't see how they could resolve it, and there's no way to know who earned them and who didn't. So it's f'ed. If you were one of the lucky few who benefitted from it you've got a huge lead on the competition for as long as you choose to exploit it.

I'm not saying they should have kept the inheritance, I'm saying the fact that it existed for any length of time at all had a huge, irreversible effect on the lower levels. GG Gree.

Also, to the posters point, there is still the matter of being able to kick members who've earned the unit before they get it, which was the whole point of locking guilds down during guild wars. To remove the potential for abuse.

I won't argue that there aren't any residual problems in the wake of Gree's new policy to disallow the inheritance, but the said policy wasn't instituted to correct past "wrongs" or to create a level playing field, even. It was simply to address the current guild hopping phenomenon that had some guilds very upset.

And you're right that the effects probably are irreversible, since any action, if instituted retroactively, would be a very bad precedent. Imagine a game where new rules can be conceived at any time and implemented on a retroactive basis...

[Johan -]

:cool: We should have a "blacklist" with Guildhoppers ;)

[leek]

:cool: We should have a "blacklist" with Guildhoppers ;)

Guild hopping is a choice not a crime. Let's be clear about this.

[Johan -]

Guild hopping is a choice not a crime. Let's be clear about this.

There is no crime for having an information list, so that the guilds can decide if they want to accept such players.Can be for strategy purposes ;) . You may also call it a "green list"

[Jerusalem]

There is no crime for having an information list, so that the guilds can decide if they want to accept such players.Can be for strategy purposes ;) . You may also call it a "green list"

True, it's no crime to have some sort of "blacklist" for habitual guild-hoppers, just as guild-hopping is no crime.

But here's the rub - How is anyone going to know if someone is actually an habitual guild-hopper in the worst sense if:

1) aside from the player's wall, you have no way of knowing a player's guild history, and how they performed in the guild.
The only plausible solution is for every player to be tracked by his or her current guild with a performance rating. A database then would have to be created, necessitating every guild to comply with the reporting requirements on a bi-weekly or monthly basis in order for the database to be accurate and thorough. A rough analogy would be like a credit reporting service.

2) Plus, who's to say that the reporting guild officer is providing an accurate report on each of the guild's members?
Such a database could be an exercise in libel and defamation. There are many legitimate reasons why players have joined more than 1 or more guilds and/or performed poorly at some point or other.

Conclusion:
In order to make use of the proposed list and identify those "bad, wilfully evil guild-hoppers", a database tracking the history of every player must be created. And, in order for the database to be accurate, it must be thorough and require every guild to strictly comply with reporting (and reporting truthfully). Taken to its logical end, the idea is laborious and totally ludicrous. This is just a game, after all.

[procsyzarc]

Also, to the posters point, there is still the matter of being able to kick members who've earned the unit before they get it, which was the whole point of locking guilds down during guild wars. To remove the potential for abuse.
Top guilds who actually complete these quests would not just kick someone to screw them out of prizes unless the person just using them to get the prizes without contributing to the guild.

Any top guild who kicks someone just to screw them out of prizes without good reason will not last as it will cause conflict and instability and other members will leave too hurting the guild more than the person who was kicked.

More likely when we hear cases of this it was warranted to kick the person they just like to cry and say they were kicked without reason but in reality 99% of the time (in top guilds, crap guilds run by kids may be different) there would have been a very good reason for it.

If someone is crying about being kicked they probably weren’t pulling their weight anyway and were being carried since if they were it will be very easy for them to walk straight into an equal or better guild.