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Ferr
07-24-2012, 06:36 PM
In reading the posts on this subject and my own experiences i have come to the preliminary conclusion that
1. the health of the boss is exclusively based on your level and has nothing to do with your actual attack force. They multiply your level with a fixed amount of allies (i assume 2.5 per level) and multiply this further with a fixed amount of units (i assume 4 per ally) and multyply that further with a high density number (in my rough calculations this seems to be 400 but this is definitely not accurate). So when you are level 200 this would lead to 200 x 2.5 allies x 4 units x 400 average virtual attackforce = 800.000 standard boss health. Finally, they will use a variable multiplier depending on the level of the boss. I do not know yet what this multiplier is but for level 30 it could be as high as 13.
2. To beat the boss without gold up to level 30 is possible only if you fight with the highest possible average density.

This also explains why lower levels can kill the boss a bit easier as some of them can maintain a higher density than the higher level players. E.g a level 2 player who purchases 20 units with say 400 attack force will problably have no problem in killing the boss up to level 30 without purchasing gold.

I am pretty sure the above formula is correct, we only need to determine the correct multipliers. This is however easy to establish if you guys provide some data. The only thing i need is your level, the level of any boss you have beaten and the amount of health he had at that level. Please be as accurate as possible in determining his health. This is not that easy as they do not give you the amount of his healthbar so you need to be creative ;).

Ferr
07-24-2012, 06:41 PM
And of course we start when the next boss event comes around.

Corsair
07-24-2012, 06:57 PM
You might want to refer to this thread where the conversation started a few hours ago...
http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?37692-Strategy-for-upcoming-Boss-event(s)/page2

spectra
07-24-2012, 07:04 PM
In reading the posts on this subject and my own experiences i have come to the preliminary conclusion that
1. the health of the boss is exclusively based on your level and has nothing to do with your actual attack force. They multiply your level with a fixed amount of allies (i assume 2.5 per level) and multiply this further with a fixed amount of units (i assume 4 per ally) and multyply that further with a high density number (in my rough calculations this seems to be 400 but this is definitely not accurate). So when you are level 200 this would lead to 200 x 2.5 allies x 4 units x 400 average virtual attackforce = 800.000 standard boss health. Finally, they will use a variable multiplier depending on the level of the boss. I do not know yet what this multiplier is but for level 30 it could be as high as 13.
2. To beat the boss without gold up to level 30 is possible only if you fight with the highest possible average density.

This also explains why lower levels can kill the boss a bit easier as some of them can maintain a higher density than the higher level players. E.g a level 2 player who purchases 20 units with say 400 attack force will problably have no problem in killing the boss up to level 30 without purchasing gold.

I am pretty sure the above formula is correct, we only need to determine the correct multipliers. This is however easy to establish if you guys provide some data. The only thing i need is your level, the level of any boss you have beaten and the amount of health he had at that level. Please be as accurate as possible in determining his health. This is not that easy as they do not give you the amount of his healthbar so you need to be creative ;).

I kill up to #10, look at the column TOTAL DAMAGE
I wrote down the damage and how many hits took to kill each one of them
in average I saw a 27% increase in health at each new level

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd299/spectra69/DeathElite.jpg

Ferr
07-24-2012, 07:14 PM
Spectra This all happened on level 132 right?

JMC
07-24-2012, 07:16 PM
How do you guys get exact health numbers? I saw that Q raider also had how many hits it took to kill the boss accurate to 2 decimal places.

Ferr
07-24-2012, 07:22 PM
Thx corsair, i had read that thread as well. We are going into the same direction but i need this specific info to crack it completely

JMC
07-24-2012, 07:28 PM
Boss 6 had just over 1,058,000 health at level 175
Boss 7 had just over 1,518,000 health also at level 175

spectra
07-24-2012, 07:31 PM
Spectra This all happened on level 132 right?

Sorry my bad
It happened at lv-145 (but for boss #10 at 146 - level up to kill him, that was my last boss)
with 500 allies
stats are 64,934/71,142 A/D

spectra
07-24-2012, 07:35 PM
How do you guys get exact health numbers? I saw that Q raider also had how many hits it took to kill the boss accurate to 2 decimal places.

Every time I hit the boss I wrote down the damage (and just for the last hit, I am assuming his last bit of health was the same as the hit)
for example boss #7 took 10 free hits at 34,742 damage each hit = 347,420 (of course the last hit did less than 34k damage, but just to make things easier)

I guess others look at the damage made on the last hit for a more accurate number

Q Raider
07-24-2012, 08:21 PM
How do you guys get exact health numbers? I saw that Q raider also had how many hits it took to kill the boss accurate to 2 decimal places.

You might be looking at the figure I created to try to indicate the relative difficulty increase as you level up JMC.

As for his health points, when he pops up I just hit him with five free hits. Wait till health fullly restored, go back in measure how far the bar dropped, hit him a few more times but not so you are defeated and remeasure. Average that and you get a fair indication of what his total health points are going to be and if it is worth having a go.

Just remember the health bar stays a lot fatter than his real value when it gets down near the end.

JMC
07-24-2012, 09:08 PM
Does it show the exact amount of damage done on the last hit? I actually don't think i've paid attention. Thought the number was the same as i always was doing. That's why when talk about health it's always a very general estimate.

Mcdoc
07-24-2012, 10:22 PM
So maybe is time to drop back down to 50 allies :)

Khimsoo
07-24-2012, 11:08 PM
So maybe is time to drop back down to 50 allies :)

Does it help?

manbeast
07-24-2012, 11:21 PM
i still think attack stat is factored in.

JMC
07-25-2012, 12:00 AM
Why do you guys think that attack stat plays a role in the health of your bosses? This would make no sense as the whole point is to have a powerful army to beat the bosses and to increase your attack stat to do more damage.

The reason you guys are having more difficulty as more events come out is because you guys are leveling up over time. I do not see any of the campers who are participating in the event slowing down whatsoever.

Ferr
07-25-2012, 02:02 AM
More data please ;). I only need 1 or preferably 2 bosses per experience level.

Q Raider
07-25-2012, 02:27 AM
Why do you guys think that attack stat plays a role in the health of your bosses? This would make no sense as the whole point is to have a powerful army to beat the bosses and to increase your attack stat to do more damage.

The reason you guys are having more difficulty as more events come out is because you guys are leveling up over time. I do not see any of the campers who are participating in the event slowing down whatsoever.

I believe the personal attack stat sets a base point for each player at the outset of the event. Essentially it means that everyone can beat at least one boss.

As people progress the rate at which the elite's health rises is determined by what level you are at and there is a significant skewing of the health points upwards heading into the higher levels leading me to believe that the average strength of all players is being factored in an as you head higher you get closer to the uber stat players, hence the unequal difficulty platform that we currently observe in the game.

The Campers are heavily favoured with the current setup, going to be interesting if they continue this and make no changes to the mechanics. You could end up with a lot of players in the low level 20's with a full indestructible army and a dozen or more very high stat units.

Ferr
07-25-2012, 03:54 AM
That was boss 6 spectra which took you 10 hits, not boss 7 ;)

Ferr
07-25-2012, 04:15 AM
Dropping down to less allies is no use. Depending on your level their calculations are based on a fixed amound of units multiplied with a fixed amount of density. Lowering or increasing your allies will have mo effect on their health calculations imo

Arizona
07-25-2012, 04:29 AM
I don't defeat many bosses but I did notice when I completed a map, I added the 1 skill point to my attack, and the next boss hit was higher. Nothing else had changed, just the skill point I added.

Giedrybe
07-25-2012, 06:59 AM
Saigon597, yes, it did for me. 1skill point increased attack by 4. When I was hitting him more than 5k, so it was less than 0,1% increase, not sure if it is the factor.
Q, most likely you will not end up with totally indestructable army in 20's. If remember correctly, beating first boss "cost" me level ups from 24 to 29 in one event, doing only boss event. But I need to say that I was not tracking XP gain and somewhere I saw a post that general feeling is that they reduced amount of XP awarded for boss in next events. But I just want to remind some high level players that leveling up in low levels takes only a moment or movement :)

Anyway, Ferr, I feel that this thread tries to figure out the same question as another one, Corsair dropped the link. It would be better to continue discussions in one thread. I am enthusiastic to try to find some answers.

Just one advice - don't take assumptions for granted. Your theory is still the assumption, remember that. So we DON'T KNOW IF dropping allies helps or not. It would only not make sense, IF your theory is correct or close to being correct.

Q Raider - your theory could make sense, but we still need to measure that. As I posted in other thread, I am not that sure if we will be able precisely determine starting health of boss lvl1. But we really can measure - just by taking notes - how boss health goes up with each next boss. Let's record our levels, allies, attack, density and let's see if that plays some part in increasing boss health, or it is rather fixed percentage depending on level of boss.

Jhoemel
07-25-2012, 07:31 AM
I think your best chance to beat the boss is have the max number of allies for your level to maximize your att points. I think it is based on your level and the max allies for that level

Ferr
07-25-2012, 03:21 PM
True giedrybe, i am calculating my a s s off ;). Wont stop, until its cracked...

JMC
07-25-2012, 03:36 PM
I believe the personal attack stat sets a base point for each player at the outset of the event. Essentially it means that everyone can beat at least one boss.

As people progress the rate at which the elite's health rises is determined by what level you are at and there is a significant skewing of the health points upwards heading into the higher levels leading me to believe that the average strength of all players is being factored in an as you head higher you get closer to the uber stat players, hence the unequal difficulty platform that we currently observe in the game.

The Campers are heavily favoured with the current setup, going to be interesting if they continue this and make no changes to the mechanics. You could end up with a lot of players in the low level 20's with a full indestructible army and a dozen or more very high stat units.

Well the way i see it so far is that the reason high levels have so much trouble is because the difficulty keeps on going up, but we can't take any more units to battle than a level 100 can, and so it is much more difficult for our stats to match the raise in boss health as our level increases. On top of that there seems to be some sort of exponential growth, so even heavy gold spenders cannot do too well in the events. If i remember correctly, even wdigeorge, who has around 300K attack i think, had trouble getting past like boss 12 or so without gold. Surely, being on the top end in stats compared to other players at this level, he should of at least reached the high teens without gold.

If it was based on the stats of the players around you, the heavy gold players in the top tier should have similar if not better results than the campers in the lower levels.

Q Raider
07-25-2012, 05:00 PM
Very astute point re the 2000 unit limit JMC.
Above level 100 you are effectively the wrong side of the curve. That also explains why the difficulty rises almost exponentially with our level ups.

At level 175 you are seeing almost double the strength of a player just 25 levels below you. If you consider this in light of your level 100 limit point then effectively you are a level 25 and I am a level 50 but we are both facing off against level 100 calculations. In short, they have stuffed up the maths....