What can we do to improve the Boss events?

[Thunder Child]

This thread has come about following a comment by War Priest regarding the massively skewed mechanics of the current and previous Elite Boss events, and specifically his suggestion that perhaps as Forum members we should try to organize our thoughts in a coherent way and attempt to put some pressure on the devs to make a few changes.

I think most of us would agree that as an event, the Epic Boss series is a great concept: it's obviously ensuring that non-gold spenders get a handful of indestructible units, it's undoubtedly making money for Gree, and it IS fun!

However, now that we're into the third such event, it's clear to all that the lower levels can go MUCH further than their counterparts at higher levels before they have to (if they wish) turn to gold. In large part this is due to the 'health' the Boss has at any given level seemingly being skewed in favor of lower levels.

The aim of this thread is twofold. First, to get feedback and as much hard data on your experiences of the Boss events to date. I am hoping Q Raider, in particular, will lift his post in another thread and put it here, and hope that others will then get the gist and add to the data he has been compiling. Second, there needs to be some discussion about what we can do in terms of communicating with the devs - the gold boycott did very little good, really, but that was essentially a negative protest. What we are talking about here is putting some pressure on the devs in a POSITIVE way to improve a product that is essentially good but COULD BE so much better.

So in short, data and ideas, please!

And sandpit-boys, this is not a thread for any of the usual banter or silly comments, please.

[War Priest]

We have tried creating threads here on the forums for change and they did nothing. What I suggest is that we put together a little paragraph saying how we feel. Then copy & paste it and send it in a ticket form to support. Maybe if they get bombarded with a hundred or so tickets all demanding the same thing by all forum members, a change will happen.

[SeqWins]

Just a suggestion...How about using WP's idea to be more effective..you come up with a Generic support ticket and every forum member that either agrees and has the same problem happening as far as these events sends in the very same paragraph as a ticket..maybe they will get the point.

[Thunder Child]

Not great to be the first to respond, but would be really useful if we had feedback from low, mid and higher level players. I know JMC you have been about and are mentioned in QR's post, so your expereince would be especially useful from up on top.

[Thunder Child]

@ WP & Seq

While I agree that is a great way forward, we need to generate content. If we can get enough good information, then condense it into a ticket that won't be dismissed too easily AND mobilize enough support for a mass send, then we have a chance of improving the Boss event series, I think.

But we DO need good content!

[Poopenshire]

I want loot units I actually send to battle. This goes foe the entire game. PVP loot especially.

[War Priest]

What pisses me off is the splash screen says the more bosses you defeat, greater chances at winning rarer and more powerful units. What total bullsh*t!

I am on boss 19 and have not got a singe rare, and only won 3 uncommons.

This should be fixed also!

[JMC]

Well the first kill takes me 2 cash hits. I assume that the level 1 boss for me has about 135000 HP or so. First hit does around 60% of the damage or a bit less.

Level 6 boss, i waited too long as i was preoccupied and was unable to kill him with 12 hits doing 89000 damage everytime. So that's a minimum of 1,068,000 health.

Also last event i was doing 105000 damage per money hit, so it seems they have made it even harder. Last event i could not kill the 7th boss either.

They need to decrease the health, especially for high level players. They should also show us how much health you have as well as how much the boss has. Defence scores should also be factored in to either how much health you have, or how much damage the boss does.

[Thunder Child]

@ Poop

Noted, and agree. But in the first instance what we are trying to do is track how many hits it is taking you to dispatch the Boss at each level so that we can try to pressure the devs to make the progression from Boss 1 to 30 more equitable for players of all levels.

If players at levels 75, 95, 115, 135, 155 etc. have the same possibility of reaching Boss 20, for instance, before turning to gold if they wish (or can afford) to, then we have a much fairer event.

At the same time, since so many of us are stalling so early (around Boss 10 for me this time) chances are we're only going to get crappy commons, but if the whole thing were overhauled, more people would go further (though not necessarily to the end) and get into uncommon and rare territory.... which would sort out your wish, Poop.

[JMC]

Here's an idea. If the bosses are gonna be this difficult to defeat. Take away the 2 hour time limit that makes the boss run away. In item events, a free player can luckily get 10 items and win the grand prize. In the PvP/IPH tourneys a free player can win if he puts a lot of work into it. For this boss event, especially for the high levels, there is absolutely no way a free player can win. Take away the run away time and it might take me all day to kill the 30th boss, but at least it's possible.

Gold players obviously have the advantage as they always do, but it still makes it possible for a hardworking free player with high stats to get by.

[Poopenshire]

My attack on the recent boss is in that thread including hit values and numbers. Its on page 2.

[War Priest]

Great idea JMC.

[Thunder Child]

My attack on the recent boss is in that thread including hit values and numbers. Its on page 2.
I think what we need to do next time is to set up a 'hit' tracker thread. McDoc has done a great job on getting the loot tracking going, but it's really the hits or the health of the Bosses that needs tracking so we can see the differentials between players' levels in black and white...

[Thunder Child]

@ WP

I will come back to this in a few hours time. Once there is sufficient feedback, comment, data, etc. I will try put together a suggestion for a ticket for a bulk send by Forum members, who can then comment on and modify the text before it is used.

[CAPT.GIN]

Not trying to get nobody mad, but I like the boss event the way it is... There will never ever be away to get powerful units for free...

[War Priest]

@ WP

I will come back to this in a few hours time. Once there is sufficient feedback, comment, data, etc. I will try put together a suggestion for a ticket for a bulk send by Forum members, who can then comment on and modify the text before it is used.

Alright. Make sure to mention something along the lines of the forum members coming together and demanding a change and all. It needs to be clear that it is a forum group movement instead of an individual movement.

[War Priest]

Not trying to get nobody mad, but I like the boss event the way it is... There will never ever be away to get powerful units for free...

Were not saying stop them. Were wanting things like make it so there isn't a time limit and increase the chances at rare units.

[CAPT.GIN]

Yea I agree on the rare units! That really needs to change... There not gonna do noting about the time though...

[Q Raider]

Not trying to get nobody mad, but I like the boss event the way it is... There will never ever be away to get powerful units for free...

I will answer this one separately to the post which TC requested.

The idea is fine in principle Capt Gin, however when a major Gold player such as Wdigeorge with an unboosted attack stat of 550,000 PLUS is only able to get to level 14 (info posted from previous event) without having to use Gold you must agree that there is a fatal flaw in the current setup with respect to the boss health versus player level.

Add in that he probably wouldn't even have a use for anything other than the top item in his inventory and frankly, I would challenge his sanity at throwing Gold into this event in it's current format. Much better value selecting units, or if he was in a "gambling" mood then having a go at a couple of the LE sets and maybe pick up the high stat rare from there.

[bigflan]

I hate everything about it and my luck is **** I think I should be able to beat 15 bosses instead of 8 so weak

[Fazhang]

Here's an idea. If the bosses are gonna be this difficult to defeat. Take away the 2 hour time limit that makes the boss run away. In item events, a free player can luckily get 10 items and win the grand prize. In the PvP/IPH tourneys a free player can win if he puts a lot of work into it. For this boss event, especially for the high levels, there is absolutely no way a free player can win. Take away the run away time and it might take me all day to kill the 30th boss, but at least it's possible.

Gold players obviously have the advantage as they always do, but it still makes it possible for a hardworking free player with high stats to get by.
I totally agree with you, if they just take the two hour limit away that would great because that doesn't guarentee a free player from getting the grand prize but it makes people work.

[SeqWins]

Here's an idea. If the bosses are gonna be this difficult to defeat. Take away the 2 hour time limit that makes the boss run away. In item events, a free player can luckily get 10 items and win the grand prize. In the PvP/IPH tourneys a free player can win if he puts a lot of work into it. For this boss event, especially for the high levels, there is absolutely no way a free player can win. Take away the run away time and it might take me all day to kill the 30th boss, but at least it's possible.

Gold players obviously have the advantage as they always do, but it still makes it possible for a hardworking free player with high stats to get by.

+100...............

[bigflan]

I like JMC idea it rewards try hards like me who never win but give it everything they got

[CAPT.GIN]

Seqqqqqq!!! Whats up bro where you been at

[el_gringo]

Maybe the higher level players on here are finding it more difficult because the players lower down on here are mainly people who've been camped for a long time and have stats way ahead of the average.

I'd also like to know what difference allies make. I'm very strong at my level/ally count but I can still only get up to 8 or so without gold.

[Kudu22]

Gin... The Devil Dog has been at work doing what those soldiers do getting prepped from their deployment to the sand box. Wish he would be around on the the 29th at Camp Pendleton so I could meet him at range 103.

[War Priest]

Kudu, don't call him a soldier. He don't like it! :eek:

[CAPT.GIN]

Haha seq is a trooper...

[Kudu22]

WP he is a one. I know for a fact he is because that is the way the USMC makes them. He doesn't know this but I just took another group of Scout Snipers thru a tour at work and told them when they see a big mother ****er in a dozer to tell him I said Hi and Gods speed.

[Kudu22]

Really Gin...take a good look at the mans signature.

[Arizona]

Here's an idea. If the bosses are gonna be this difficult to defeat. Take away the 2 hour time limit that makes the boss run away. In item events, a free player can luckily get 10 items and win the grand prize. In the PvP/IPH tourneys a free player can win if he puts a lot of work into it. For this boss event, especially for the high levels, there is absolutely no way a free player can win. Take away the run away time and it might take me all day to kill the 30th boss, but at least it's possible.

Gold players obviously have the advantage as they always do, but it still makes it possible for a hardworking free player with high stats to get by.

I don't have any ideas to improve it yet. I only just saw this thread, but I'll think about it and get back to you...
...just a thought, but if they took away the timer wouldn't that make it a certainty to get the 30th boss? People would just have to keep plugging away and they'd win in the end. Or are you suggesting extending the timer? I agree there's no way a free player has even a remote chance of winning the top prize. It's out of our reach and only accessible to the top spenders, in the process making them stronger.

[War Priest]

WP he is a one. I know for a fact he is because that is the way the USMC makes them. He doesn't know this but I just took another group of Scout Snipers thru a tour at work and told them when they see a big mother ****er in a dozer to tell him I said Hi and Gods speed.

I know, by the way I was kidding. But Soldiers are in the Army, Marines are in the Marine Corps.

[spectra]

Ok guys, I am not happy at all with the event

last event I got stuck on lv-11, for this event is even worse, I am stuck at lv-9 unless I use gold or levelup
I did a quick table of my personal experience with each boss
I took this into consideration
I am lv-144
Stats 62k/72k A/D
I am assuming that the boss HP will stop increasing at 3.3 Million (otherwise it would get really ridiculous the HP)
I highlighted lv-9 to show that with only cash option (doing 52k damage, I will not beat him)
numbers are close estimates since is based on My damage hits when I attack him
his HP estimate is based on the diff of HP of for example lv1 boss, vs lv-2 boss, how much damaged I did to kill him, then see diff between them and figure the % of the increase (seem 25%-27%, again my personal experience)

For me personally I have estimated I need 289 GOLD hits (probably less is use Medkits instead to do 250k damage instead of only 200k)
289 gold hits = 5,780 gold bars = 3.85 vaults of gold = over $431 REAL CASH

conclusion..................IT IS NOT WORTH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!

I got 8 free common units, and now I am back to camping (might just level up to get another unit, but not using gold, too much for my wallet)

Has anyone else kept track of damage done to each boss

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd299/spectra69/DeathElite.jpg


AGAIN, THIS IS MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE WITH THE EVENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Miner]

I have a low level game (32) going and a mid level game (81). My unboosted attack on the low level game I sabot 3k (with 35 allies) and about 29.5k with 230 allies. I'm stuck on boss 8 or 9 on my low game and 15-16'on my high level game. I feel like flan on the low level!

[spectra]

GREE has made a very STUPID mistake......by making 90% of player get stuck at lv 11-15

they should arrange the event so that the mayority reached at least lv-24, with some ease, then pretty much every player would be willing to purchase/use GOLD to pass the remaining 6 levels

this event is just an example of BAD MARKETING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bigflan]

GREE has made a very STUPID mistake......by making 90% of player get stuck at lv 11-15

they should arrange the event so that the mayority reached at least lv-24, with some ease, then pretty much every player would be willing to purchase/use GOLD to pass the remaining 6 levels

this event is just an example of BAD MARKETING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I completely disagree

[Miner]

GREE has made a very STUPID mistake......by making 90% of player get stuck at lv 11-15

they should arrange the event so that the mayority reached at least lv-24, with some ease, then pretty much every player would be willing to purchase/use GOLD to pass the remaining 6 levels

this event is just an example of BAD MARKETING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree. It's better to get 1,000 people spending $10 that 10 people spending $1,000. I market and sell for a living.

[bigflan]

a
I agree. It's better to get 1,000 people spending $10 that 10 people spending $1,000. I market and sell for a living.No way bro if othe rpeople get it and I can't I don't want to happen so people gain a edge I'm serious

[Scabbyfeet]

GREE has made a very STUPID mistake......by making 90% of player get stuck at lv 11-15

they should arrange the event so that the mayority reached at least lv-24, with some ease, then pretty much every player would be willing to purchase/use GOLD to pass the remaining 6 levels

this event is just an example of BAD MARKETING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Well said spec. ! I completely understand they are not going to just give these " top prizes" away to everyone for free . They are in it to make money which is fine to an extent . I would have no problem spending 200 or so gold to get it ( I spent 160 on the 1st one ) . Last event I had to stop at boss # 21 and gave up . This one is going good for now , but I'm not spending any gold unless I reach at least level 25 .

[Agent Orange]

The events seem to be skewed towards helping the lower level players so guys like me are SOL which is fine I suppose. It seems that they have pretty much abandoned us high level players, guess once they got their money they just want us to get bored and leave.

These boss events are good for the low level players because they can get free indestructible units which will help them out in these levels but as others have said the odds of getting a rare unit seem to be somewhere between totally impossible and highly unlikely.

What ticks me off the most about these events is that they make me loose loot units and cash that I am trying to get from missions when the event suddenly loads. I know there is another thread about this but this is starting to really tick me off. I sent in a ticket this morning because I lost cash and this afternoon I lost a really decent loot unit.

At the very least it would be great to be able to opt out of these events by having the option in the settings panel.

On the bright side it isn't the same type of event that is currently running in Kingdom Age. I think if they ran one of those I would probably cloak my base and delete the app.

But to make it better, I understand that it is really a way for Gree to generate money, problem is it seems that these events are darn near impossible to actually win or perhaps they are attainable if you wind up spending hundreds or thousands of dollars. But then it means that the game is really all about rewarding those with the deepest pockets, or the hackers that have been able to take advantage of vulnerabilities in the app once jailbroken. So these high ticket units only really benefit those who really don't need them in the first place and I think that is where the major disconnect is for me.

This game could be an amazing strategy game and with the right financial model it could make lots of cash for Gree and yet provide an satisfying experience for the players. In other words lets get some strategy back into the game.

[JMC]

I don't have any ideas to improve it yet. I only just saw this thread, but I'll think about it and get back to you...
...just a thought, but if they took away the timer wouldn't that make it a certainty to get the 30th boss? People would just have to keep plugging away and they'd win in the end. Or are you suggesting extending the timer? I agree there's no way a free player has even a remote chance of winning the top prize. It's out of our reach and only accessible to the top spenders, in the process making them stronger.

Well looking at the boss strength right now, boss 30 might be almost 100 money hits for me. That means it would take me something like 21 hours straight to kill the last boss alone. Seeing as the entire event has it's own timer if usually around 5 days. I still likely would not make it to 30, but at least i'd be able to get some more kills in.

The idea is to make it possible, not easy. For a free player to get to 30, he's gonna have to be hitting bosses as much as possible for the entire event, and have good stats to go along with it. This is talking about the high levels though, if they don't rebalance the bosses, this would make it extremely easy for the low levels to get the prize.

[Q Raider]

Here is what I have been doing to try to get a perspective on things.
Given that this game is played across 200 levels, 1 to 500 useable allies, and an almost infinite array of variables and possibilities in unit makeups then there had to be a single simple point of reference to work from.

My take thus far is that your initial opponent is based on your personal raw attack strength.
After this the gradation in the Elite's health is calculated based on a grouping of other players, don't know if it is level, ally or whatever but there is a relationship.

This value becomes increasingly skewed upwards as you progress in levels.

I have mentioned previously about actually measuring the amount of damage a hit did (ie get a ruler and physically check) to work out if you were going to defeat him within the timeframe and what strategy would be required.

There was a secondary purpose for me in that I wanted to try to prove that the mechanics of the event are badly flawed.

Previous event:
Level 1: Measured Health was 43k, took 2 free hits, my base Cash attack was 51k. This gave me a level 1 Elite rated at 0.84 of my Raw Cash Attack.

I repeated the measuring action for each level elite encountered, though I increased my attack each time, by measuring and calculating, then referring to the strength in terms of my original base attack I was setting a standard to work from.

At level 140 the strength of the elite Vs my initial Raw Cash attack was
1. 0.84
2. 1.44
3. 2.14
4. 3.21
5. 4.71
6. 7.64
7. 8.81
8. 12.21
9. 14.3
10. 16.2
11. 20.75
12. 19.76
13. 23.14
14. 25.6
15. 26.72
16. 30.2
I gave up at this point even though I had increased my Raw attack by over 4k, the rate of increase was well in excess of this.

Now for this event I was at Level 141. Using the same concept of calculating the Elite strength against my initial Raw attack (now 55k) on the level one Elite here are the numbers.
1. 0.85
2. 1.36
3. 2.09
4. 3.14
5. 4.55
6. 6.48
7. 8.40
8. 13.2 (NOTE big jump, same as previously)
9. 14.14
10. (Measured, not yet attempted, indication is it will be 16.2)

Quick comaprisons:
Previous event:
Level 71 (Hello Kitty) Elite Level 1 health was less than 0.67 of her Raw attack Stat.
Level 97 (Manbeast) Elite Level 1 health was less than0.67 of his Raw attack Stat.
Level 140 (Q Raider) Elite Level 1 health was measured at 0.84 of his Raw attack stat.

Current event
Level 141 (Q Raider) Elite level 1 health measured at 0.84 of his Raw attack strength
Level 175 (JMC) Elite Level 1 health at 1.5 based on 60% damage with initial Free attack.

Level 141 (Q Raider) Elite level 6 rated 6.48 as against my initial Raw attack strength.
Level 175 (JMC) Elite Level 6 rated AT LEAST 12 as against his initial Raw attack strength.

With respect to players who got to Level 30 and I was able to make some calculations using their data.
Level 71 (Hello Kitty) had an Elite 27 times stronger than her starting Raw attack strength.
Level 97 (Manbeast) had an Elite 37 times stronger than his starting Raw attack strength.
Level 126 (TC) had an Elite 67 times stronger than his starting Raw attack strength.

I extrapolated the likely strength of the level 30 elite using the data I had up to level 16 and came up with an Elite strength of around 77 times my Raw attack strength as a Level 140.

[bigflan]

I like the events the way are

There is nothing wrong here not everyone can win

[JMC]

QR im pretty sure that the boss strength is not related to your stats. Otherwise what would be the point of even increasing your attack?

I believe it is entirely based on level. Nothing else matters.

[manbeast]

I don't have any ideas to improve it yet. I only just saw this thread, but I'll think about it and get back to you...
...just a thought, but if they took away the timer wouldn't that make it a certainty to get the 30th boss? People would just have to keep plugging away and they'd win in the end. Or are you suggesting extending the timer? I agree there's no way a free player has even a remote chance of winning the top prize. It's out of our reach and only accessible to the top spenders, in the process making them stronger.

30th boss would not be guaranteed. there would still be the 4 day time limit. it would impossible for people to make it to 30 within 4 days without buying med-packs. for instance, if the 30th boss takes 33 hits, like mine did last time, that would be almost a 12 hr boss battle without med packs.


GREE has made a very STUPID mistake......by making 90% of player get stuck at lv 11-15

they should arrange the event so that the mayority reached at least lv-24, with some ease, then pretty much every player would be willing to purchase/use GOLD to pass the remaining 6 levels

this event is just an example of BAD MARKETING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

couldnt agree more


I agree. It's better to get 1,000 people spending $10 that 10 people spending $1,000. I market and sell for a living.

very good point. plus with 10 people spending, is actually less real money in gree's hands. those people are likely buying vaults of gold with the 50% extra. If they got the 1000 people to spend, they'd likely be buying smaller amounts, less "extra/free" gold, aka more real money for gree.


aNo way bro if othe rpeople get it and I can't I don't want to happen so people gain a edge I'm serious

you're still playing!? lol jk.

flan u need to be more open to ideas that benefit everyone. seems like you are really biased against free players and light gold spenders. you want only heavy gold spenders to have the advantages. you dont want anything to be affordable for the average person. why?!

[bigflan]

QR im pretty sure that the boss strength is not related to your stats. Otherwise what would be the point of even increasing your attack?

I believe it is entirely based on level. Nothing else matters.

I will agree with you there is someone exact same level as me but he is 170 allies more than me yet my attack is only 2000 less than his yet he has a easier time than me considerably grhhhhhhh add me to help me win 769 888 463

[manbeast]

QR im pretty sure that the boss strength is not related to your stats. Otherwise what would be the point of even increasing your attack?

I believe it is entirely based on level. Nothing else matters.

from everything I've seen, it is absolutely based on your stats. I asked mark this exact question in his AMA and he replied with "i cant answer that".

This is very troubling/frustrating. because it does make it seem pointless to increase your attack.

I believe the bosses health is based on your level and attack stat at the beginning of the event. increasing your attack during the event does help. that is how i was able to get to 25 for free the first event. raised my attack stat 40%. the second event only raised it 15%, got to boss 20. this boss didnt raise it at all and i'm going to top out around 16.

could be totally wrong. i dont understand why they cant be more transparent and just tell us this kind of info

[CAPT.GIN]

Really Gin...take a good look at the mans signature.




I know what he is...

[War Priest]

Wow, a lot of replies in just a few minutes.

AO, you are totally right. Ever since GREE took over, the only way you can win events now is by using gold.

[bigflan]

Wow, a lot of replies in just a few minutes.

AO, you are totally right. Ever since GREE took over, the only way you can win events now are buy using gold.I'm angry flan

[Poopenshire]

Not just using gold. A lot of gold.

[War Priest]

They surely aren't thinking long term. They may be getting a lot of money at first, that's how things always start, but long term they won't.

I take back everything I said about Funzio. Right now, I wish Funzio was back in charge. I could deal with their problems over GREE's.

[Q Raider]

QR im pretty sure that the boss strength is not related to your stats. Otherwise what would be the point of even increasing your attack?

I believe it is entirely based on level. Nothing else matters.

To clarify:
There is definitely a relationship to your STARTING POINT RAW ATTACK.
There is definitely a relationship to the Level One Elite Strength and your Game level.
There is a definite skewing upwards of the relative strength of the elite as compared to your Starting Point Raw Attack as your player level increases.

Case in point: Spectra has just posted some good data, he is Level 144, therefore what I should see (if I am correct) is that he will have experienced a greater rate of increase for his Elite's health against his INITIAL Raw attack score than I will have at level 141 (because I believe that the skewing goes seriously North from around level 138).

Level: Q Raider (141) SPECTRA (144)
1. 0.85 1.34
2. 1.36 1.88
3. 2.09 2.61
4. 3.14 3.51
5. 4.55 4.96
6. 6.48 6.78
7. 8.40 9.23
8. 13.20 11.72

edit: (Dammit, looks fine but won't post the spacing correctly)

The Level 8 is an oddity, however I realised on both events I levelled up at this point, not sure if that affected anything or not.

Interesting to note that you JMC, at Level 175 were facing an Elite with 12 times your starting Raw Attacks strength at your Level 6 elite, that is nearly double the value we had.

The Level obviously does have a drastic effect. This has all the hallmarks of being designed by a committee, with a "one size fits all" policy. Some muppet decided that to get to the top of the tree (Level 30) someone should increase their attack strength by (eg 30%) over the 30 elites.

[Crazy Canuck]

I believe the bosses health is based on your level and attack stat at the beginning of the event. increasing your attack during the event does help. that is how i was able to get to 25 for free the first event. raised my attack stat 40%. the second event only raised it 15%, got to boss 20. this boss didnt raise it at all and i'm going to top out around 16.

could be totally wrong. i dont understand why they cant be more transparent and just tell us this kind of info
If that is the case then wouldn't it be best to drop your allies down as low as you can after the boss event is over and then when it starts up again quickly add 300+

That way you att score would be low going in and could be quickly increased

[Ryans67]

I don't think the boss strength is primarily based on your stats, but it must play some role. Maybe its a factor, but the primary factor has to be level IMHO. My LLP has just about maxed out at boss 17, using 13 hits. My HLP gets to 6 or 7, and his stats are pretty good. Both had the same allies 200, and my HLP had a density that was 40% higher then the LLP. If it was within a few levels, thats fine. But were talking 10. I've went to full allies, which dropped my density, but raised my attack. Yes it did more damage, but not a huge difference. I think the only way it would be useful is if I could go to full allies, while maintaining my current density. That's very expensive, and unrealistic.

As for the drop rate, and the splash screen saying defeat more bosses to increase chances of getting a rare. Well, that's true, it's just deceptive. If the drop rate is 10%, you will have better chances with 10 defeats rather then 3. The drop rate is static. I also think they have decreased these rates with each successive event.

[Crazy Canuck]

They surely aren't thinking long term. They may be getting a lot of money at first, that's how things always start, but long term they won't.

I take back everything I said about Funzio. Right now, I wish Funzio was back in charge. I could deal with their problems over GREE's.
You never realize how good things are till there gone

[Agent Orange]

QR im pretty sure that the boss strength is not related to your stats. Otherwise what would be the point of even increasing your attack?

I believe it is entirely based on level. Nothing else matters.

From what I can see with my LLP's it is entirely based on level. I'm almost at L10 with my new Android player so I will camp at that point and see if these dreadful things turn up there too. If so I will be able to see how skewed these things really are because my other LLP's are now in the 80's or higher.

[Agent Orange]

They surely aren't thinking long term. They may be getting a lot of money at first, that's how things always start, but long term they won't.

I take back everything I said about Funzio. Right now, I wish Funzio was back in charge. I could deal with their problems over GREE's.

I have a bad feeling this is out of the hands of our original friends at Funzio. This feels a lot like what happened when the software company my wife worked for was swallowed up by a large company. They soldiered along for a while but slowly they were being whittled away loosing projects, and having quotas placed on them. Finally when all the good code was sucked out of the company they discarded the empty shell and folded that division.

Gree being a Japanese company, my guess is they are going to be even more cut throat.

[Crazy Canuck]

So far this is looking to be my best event for Rares. I got 2 in 1st event, 4 in 2nd and I'm already at 2 in 3rd and only threw 12 bosses but things could go south from here on in

[bigflan]

I have a bad feeling this is out of the hands of our original friends at Funzio. This feels a lot like what happened when the software company my wife worked for was swallowed up by a large company. They soldiered along for a while but slowly they were being whittled away loosing projects, and having quotas placed on them. Finally when all the good code was sucked out of the company they discarded the empty shell and folded that division.

Gree being a Japanese company, my guess is they are going to be even more cut throat.

Gree's other games suck and I would never spend any money n them so this is where all the money comes form there they need money Becuase there other apps are **** and they need money so eventually when this money runs out Gree will get swallowed by a larger company

[Ryans67]

A second thing we need to keep in mind is that they could have tweaked things between the events. Primarily, making it more difficult. It could be level, but I also think they made it a few percent tougher. Hence, first event I got to around 24ish for free, then 20ish, and now 17.

[CAPT.GIN]

I have a bad feeling this is out of the hands of our original friends at Funzio. This feels a lot like what happened when the software company my wife worked for was swallowed up by a large company. They soldiered along for a while but slowly they were being whittled away loosing projects, and having quotas placed on them. Finally when all the good code was sucked out of the company they discarded the empty shell and folded that division.

Gree being a Japanese company, my guess is they are going to be even more cut throat.





An so the death of the game has begun....

[War Priest]

I have a bad feeling this is out of the hands of our original friends at Funzio. This feels a lot like what happened when the software company my wife worked for was swallowed up by a large company. They soldiered along for a while but slowly they were being whittled away loosing projects, and having quotas placed on them. Finally when all the good code was sucked out of the company they discarded the empty shell and folded that division.

Gree being a Japanese company, my guess is they are going to be even more cut throat.

I was thinking that same thing. GREE has bought out a lot of games. My guess is that they buy it, suck as much money as possible out of it, then once it dires up, they move on.

GREE is like a damn leach!

[manbeast]

If that is the case then wouldn't it be best to drop your allies down as low as you can after the boss event is over and then when it starts up again quickly add 300+

That way you att score would be low going in and could be quickly increased

yes. the first boss event i was about 200 allies under max. started the event with 30k attack. added 200 allies (had them all pending), and got a bunch of units. my atk stat instantly went up to around 45k and I was able to make it to boss 25 for free. many other people used a similar strategy.

I believe if you could double your atk stat during an event, you have a chance to make it to 30 for free


A second thing we need to keep in mind is that they could have tweaked things between the events. Primarily, making it more difficult. It could be level, but I also think they made it a few percent tougher. Hence, first event I got to around 24ish for free, then 20ish, and now 17.

I think you are correct. I doubt the devs even thought about the 13 hit strategy. they probably never figured so many people would be using it. so i'm sure they tweaked some things after the first boss and they saw everyone was getting 13 cash hits in.

[JMC]

To clarify:
There is definitely a relationship to your STARTING POINT RAW ATTACK.
There is definitely a relationship to the Level One Elite Strength and your Game level.
There is a definite skewing upwards of the relative strength of the elite as compared to your Starting Point Raw Attack as your player level increases.

Case in point: Spectra has just posted some good data, he is Level 144, therefore what I should see (if I am correct) is that he will have experienced a greater rate of increase for his Elite's health against his INITIAL Raw attack score than I will have at level 141 (because I believe that the skewing goes seriously North from around level 138).

Level: Q Raider (141) SPECTRA (144)
1. 0.85 1.34
2. 1.36 1.88
3. 2.09 2.61
4. 3.14 3.51
5. 4.55 4.96
6. 6.48 6.78
7. 8.40 9.23
8. 13.20 11.72

edit: (Dammit, looks fine but won't post the spacing correctly)

The Level 8 is an oddity, however I realised on both events I levelled up at this point, not sure if that affected anything or not.

Interesting to note that you JMC, at Level 175 were facing an Elite with 12 times your starting Raw Attacks strength at your Level 6 elite, that is nearly double the value we had.

The Level obviously does have a drastic effect. This has all the hallmarks of being designed by a committee, with a "one size fits all" policy. Some muppet decided that to get to the top of the tree (Level 30) someone should increase their attack strength by (eg 30%) over the 30 elites.

Have you tested results between any two players of the same level? If you haven't you cannot be sure that intial stats have any effect whatsoever.

[bigflan]

JMC I have proof

That level is the only factor

[Tctiger]

I added about 100 allies and about 8k to attack and still got to boss 17 same as first event so that didn't work , this event is more like something to play while you buy the winning unit to me it is not a real event as I can't win only buy the unit . Also would be nice if my 30% ground boost attack was used but it's not.

[Letsgoravens]

It would be cool if CCMark responded to this thread with some feedback.
The easy fix for the boss event to make it fair for everyone is to reward those who have bought or fought or both to earn high stats, while also throwing in the element of chance to give everyone a shot at winning.

1. Your own player strength should be based on your stats compared to others at your level, funzio should randomly look at a large group of players at each level and determine the mean, if I'm 10 percent above the mean I get 10 percent more strength than those at my group level.

2. Boss strength should be set by level (or a range of levels) and be totally random, one event I might get unlucky and face a strong boss while next event maybe I get to face a weaker one, the boss should be set like a lottery and I would look forward to each event with a chance to face a boss i can actually beat.

If a free player gets a weak boss he might spend money, if a gold player gets a weak boss most will spend money. The way it's set now no way in hell I'm spending gold from boss 10 on up. If I could get to a higher boss level with cash hits, I would spend gold to win the level 30 prize (I know they say to increase your stats but that's also not fair, I would have to spend crazy money in the thousands of dollars to make a noticeable improvement)
I was once a free player now im a gold spender, i know free players at levels above 100 will never turn into gold spenders on boss events the way it set up now with the boss so stacked against them

By making it fair and changing up the chances of beating the boss up to level 30
Gree also will increase the opportunity to make more money.

It's a win win for all CCMark

[Agent Orange]

Or is this a failed attempt at trying to level the playing field? The original attempt was probably to give non gold players a chance to get indestructible units but when it was realized they could milk this for more money the rejigged the event. I would have said gold buyers now have a big advantage but that could be wrong based on some comments.

[Arizona]

Well I've given up on hitting any more bosses. I managed 7 this time compared to 5 last time out, and 12 for the first event. My boss hit went up thanks to the 20% health boost and a levelling up to 78 and adding 52 allies that I'll be in the process of removing now.

I did notice that skill points make a difference to the damage inflicted on the boss. I was doing 11,161 damage to a boss repeatedly, then on the next hit, I completed a map level and got my one skill point that I put into attack. The next boss hit then went up to 11,169. Not much but it proves it does affect your damage to a small extent. No one has mentioned how many attack points they're using when it clearly has an effect.
Ask the low level players or in fact anyone with high success rates, what their attack skill points are. Maybe if there's a hige attack bias it gives you that extra success.
I know this isn't a solution to the problem, but just some input that someone might find useful.

[What?]

I can't get passed boss #5. I got all common loot that I don't even bring to attack. I'm assuming I do take some for defense, but who knows because we can't even see what units we take in defense. Some great ideas going around and I think the best on is to get rid of the timer completely. All the other events players at least have a chance without using gold. This event it is impossible. This boss event has gotten harder I went from 23 to 7 to 5 and this time my hits seem to be getting less and less in damage as I progress. I hope this is a trial and error experiment, but if this doesn't improve I might just sit out next boss event.