Where's All the Balance now?

[Hank]

Not too long ago a fabulous gun called the M4A1 became extinct. Followed by a little british bus. Marky Mark fed us a line about how it was all done in order to maintain balance inside the game. There was a major point made that in order for this game to be enjoyable there had to be a balance or equilibrium in place. Where where the hell is the balance now after all of these events? The game is becoming flooded with offense and all sorts of crazy overpowered weapons that help attack. There are 2 weapons that add 100+ attack skill and now there is another event that will increase attack by an even greater amount. Defense buildings already dont work like they should.

All im saying is we need events that feature defesive items like 100+ defense skill or an increased in the defense of all guns or something to balance the effect of all of these new offensive weapons in the game. The way the game is headed we will reach a point, where just about everyone is able to successfully attack or rob every anyone they want and the game will be essentially broken.

Where is all the balance now...

[Nudie]

Good point Hank, I totally agree. The way I see it, the game is already broken. Perhaps it has always been broken. Balance may not be necessary as the game is essentially still playable. Not balance, definitely not fair, but nothing in life is really balanced or fair.

[ruffy]

U raised an interesting point. Hopefully the developers care enough to factor that in, and not just profit, profit and more profit.

[SevenO9]

Seriously guys. Why should anyone running a business care for anything else than profit?

As long as Funzios revenue and profit go up, the game is not broken in their view.

Assuming they want to create a "balanced" game so everyone feels cozy is just romantic ....

[Dr Girlfriend]

In this case, I think Funzio is looking at the player experience, and doing it right. Players can see the difference in attack when they actively attack people - and that's when they're playing the game. Defense occurs when they're not playing, and is something that shows just up in their newsfeed. And another 100 defense skill points isn't really going to help anyone, anyway. There's always going to be someone out there who can rob you. The best defense will always be collecting on time - and that also involves playing the game, which is what Funzio wants.

Meanwhile, people winning more attack ability will feel like they're getting more "balance" with big gold spenders because it helps them successfully rob stronger players.

[nazgul]

Seriously guys. Why should anyone running a business care for anything else than profit?

As long as Funzios revenue and profit go up, the game is not broken in their view.

Assuming they want to create a "balanced" game so everyone feels cozy is just romantic ....
A friend of mine in the marketing business once quizzed a group of entrepreneurs as to what the purpose of a business was. The most common answer was "profit" (of course). He said that this was incorrect; the purpose of a business is to build and retain a customer base. Because without customers, you can't have profit.

Of course, this is coming from a marketing guy, so you have to consider the source. But if held as true, one would hope that Funzio has the foresight to realize this, and make sure to focus on the "retain" part. In other words, they already have a loyal customer base that enjoys the game, some of whom spend money on it. I would think that keeping those people engaged would be of paramount importance to them.

I, for one, am encouraged by the fact that at least two of their employees monitor these boards on a regular basis. Having owned my own business, I can tell you that keeping your finger on the pulse of your customer base is extremely challenging. Active forums like this and thoughtful posts like Hank's are like having an arsenal of M4A1s. I just hope that Funzio has the wisdom to use them.

[Hank]

And another 100 defense skill points isn't really going to help anyone

I think it would help me...



The best defense will always be collecting on time - and that also involves playing the game, which is what Funzio wants.

This is very true. But my problem is that if things progress too far the way they are going then collecting on time will not be the best defense, it will be the ONLY DEFENSE.

EDIT: If the game becomes too lopsided on the offensive part of the game, I think it would discourage some from building strong economies if they were unable to defend it, which would hurt everyone who plays the game because there would be less people to rob. And lets face it, i feel there is already a shortage of good hoods to rob

[Dr Girlfriend]

I think it would help me...



This is very true. But my problem is that if things progress too far the way they are going then collecting on time will not be the best defense, it will be the ONLY DEFENSE.

EDIT: if the game gave any less emphasis to defense then I think it would discourage some from building strong economies, which would hurt everyone who plays the game because there would be less people to rob. And lets face it, i feel there is already a shortage of good hoods to rob

Did you win the Black Widow? You you notice any huge difference? I have it, and I really don't. Although, having the gun makes me more confident to go out on the attack, and as a result I play more.

Prizes that make people more confident to camp will result in more people playing less. I have a second camper account on my iPad that's a beast. I need it to be because I leave it at home while I work shifts. But if everyone played like that, the game wouldn't be as much fun.

You're 30 levels below me but could crush me with your stats. That sort of thing just keeps me active. I need to rob to keep up with the robberies committed against me. And people playing is much better for the game (and the business) than people people building large economies and hiding behind a wall of defense.

[doinkent]

lol @ believing him with the m4a1s about trying to balance the game

[Trendsetter811]

That's depends what business your running their buddy!! With millions and millions of customers they don't need a reliable customer foundation - its not like they care if a couple people stop playing - a million more just downloaded the game and stocked up on gold - why on earth would they change that. Bet if u owned Funzio you could care less about people whining about this and that your rolling in $$$ - and if the game is so backwards people would get rid of it - and your buddy who did the survey - I'm in advertising/business admin. you said it yourself a group of entrepreneurs who probably own small businesses in local markets who without a "pleased" customer base they therefore have none. Funzio is a gigantic corp. - **** they just sold the game for millions to Gree- another point why would Gree invest in a game that is going to fail - don't get me wrong I don't agree with everything in the game but be realistic - it is what it is.... Dont like it:delete it. Simple

[Johnny70]

interesting.. im hl player, gold player, hit all the time by the same people over and over every day... think about this how come they dont fix it so when you get robbed you get robbed? I think I can tell you because the only reason my hood isnt a vacant lot is because I dont lose money to being robbed because my game is on.. if you leave your device at home and the game on you never lose to being robbed so I dont get your comments about your camper account needing to be strong.... I get beat up and robbed constantly and only lose money if the game crashes before I collect or get beat up while collecting it has ALWAYS been that way so I dont get it when people talk about losing money from being robbed either they are stupid or they are stupid?

[ratpack499]

@trendsetter811
assume u like 20% increase
ur inventory
28 monster trucks = 28 mil
31 bulldozers = 140 mil
35 armored limo = 245 mil
4 yachts = 64 mil
36 hummers = 100 mil

on 165,499 iph

[cookie monster]

Not too long ago a fabulous gun called the M4A1 became extinct. Followed by a little british bus. Marky Mark fed us a line about how it was all done in order to maintain balance inside the game. There was a major point made that in order for this game to be enjoyable there had to be a balance or equilibrium in place. Where where the hell is the balance now after all of these events? The game is becoming flooded with offense and all sorts of crazy overpowered weapons that help attack. There are 2 weapons that add 100+ attack skill and now there is another event that will increase attack by an even greater amount. Defense buildings already dont work like they should.

All im saying is we need events that feature defesive items like 100+ defense skill or an increased in the defense of all guns or something to balance the effect of all of these new offensive weapons in the game. The way the game is headed we will reach a point, where just about everyone is able to successfully attack or rob every anyone they want and the game will be essentially broken.

Where is all the balance now...

The people who play the most often are always going to accelerate through the game at a faster pace. If this doesn't happen, they will lose interest and quit playing. Funzio is a business, and their business is producing games and getting people to keep playing them. The events are a great way to keep the hardcore players focused on the game and spending money. I totally see where if you don't play that often it would alienate you, though.

[Hank]

Did you win the Black Widow? You you notice any huge difference? I have it, and I really don't. Although, having the gun makes me more confident to go out on the attack, and as a result I play more.

Prizes that make people more confident to camp will result in more people playing less. I have a second camper account on my iPad that's a beast. I need it to be because I leave it at home while I work shifts. But if everyone played like that, the game wouldn't be as much fun.

You're 30 levels below me but could crush me with your stats. That sort of thing just keeps me active. I need to rob to keep up with the robberies committed against me. And people playing is much better for the game (and the business) than people people building large economies and hiding behind a wall of defense.


I won the black widow, and no i don't feel it made me super powerful. I think skill points are worthless, but thats a whole nother topic entirely. Im only reacting based on the trends of the first 10 or so events and how they seem to all favor one side of the game. Every tit should have a tat so to speak. I assure you the impact of this latest event WILL be felt. Right now the game is not out of balance, but if there are four more events each giving a boost to the attack of a different category of weapon, then we will have a huge problem if there is no defensive perk to balance it out.

Also, I'm not promoting camping. I don't camp, it hinders economic growth and would be boring for me. while its not my favorite strategy, I think there is a place in the game for them. I use them and no-bankers as ATMs. They're good for a quick score and don't usually dont try to fight back. I don't oppose strong offensive weapons and perks, but i'd like to see some balance for the defensive side in the upcoming events...

[Max Power]

A friend of mine in the marketing business once quizzed a group of entrepreneurs as to what the purpose of a business was. The most common answer was "profit" (of course). He said that this was incorrect; the purpose of a business is to build and retain a customer base. Because without customers, you can't have profit.



Sounds like a marketing guy playing with semantics, as many do. What good is a customer base if you lose a little on every sale? It's like the present Facebook trend, where businesses are killing themselves over "likes". Well, when the rent comes due, your landlord wont accept "likes' as payment. Many things like "likes" and of course customers lead to profit, but at the end of the day, it's profit and nothing else. Businesses without profit cease to exist.


lol @ believing him with the m4a1s about trying to balance the game

Yeah, kind of a flimsy excuse, but maybe our interpretation is different than theirs. We see balance as a way for all players to be able to compete with each other, while Funzio sees balance as a way to ensure gold buyers get their maximum advantage. We can't have all these farmers de-valueing gold now, can we?

[Swifty]

The game is severely unbalanced, and Funzio does not care about balance, only about pulling in gold buyers.

If removing the M4A1 caused some people to buy gold to get better guns, then that move was a success from their perspective.

[upsman_17]

Sounds like a marketing guy playing with semantics, as many do. What good is a customer base if you lose a little on every sale? It's like the present Facebook trend, where businesses are killing themselves over "likes". Well, when the rent comes due, your landlord wont accept "likes' as payment. Many things like "likes" and of course customers lead to profit, but at the end of the day, it's profit and nothing else. Businesses without profit cease to exist.


I was attempting to school a customer in this the other day. Woman in the store asking my store manager to do all kinds of things above and beyond what is normally done without paying any extra. When my manager refused, the woman threw a fit about customer retention and keeping the customer happy, and of course the ever so antiquated (and wrong) The customer is always right. So I get called and my manager puts the customer on the phone and this woman could not understand that if we did everything she wanted us to do without her paying extra we would (at best) break even, but most likely lose a little. Her only response was "Well, you would have a happy customer though and I'd be back" Yeah b itch, you'll be back, but eventually my doors will be closed. And she herself was a local businesss owner too, with absolutely zero business sense. I am predicting a liquidation sale in her future.

[Luciferianism]

Lol what was she asking for?

[Max Power]

I was attempting to school a customer in this the other day. Woman in the store asking my store manager to do all kinds of things above and beyond what is normally done without paying any extra. When my manager refused, the woman threw a fit about customer retention and keeping the customer happy, and of course the ever so antiquated (and wrong) The customer is always right. So I get called and my manager puts the customer on the phone and this woman could not understand that if we did everything she wanted us to do without her paying extra we would (at best) break even, but most likely lose a little. Her only response was "Well, you would have a happy customer though and I'd be back" Yeah b itch, you'll be back, but eventually my doors will be closed. And she herself was a local businesss owner too, with absolutely zero business sense. I am predicting a liquidation sale in her future.

It's amazing how many small business owners survive on luck.

That being said, most businesses pay for advertising. If you look at the ROI on every individual sale, you did the right thing. But if what she was asking was an exception, and not likely to happen often, you may get more out of word of mouth advertising than what you would lose on that sale. Her being a business owner, especially local, I would have appealed to her business sense, telling her that what she is asking for will cost more money and result in a net loss, but I will do it if she puts my coupons on her checkout counter, or endorses me on her Facebook page, etc etc.

Make some lemonade, my friend.

[Dreno33]

Of course, this is coming from a marketing guy, so you have to consider the source.

as if a man with a business marketing major should be held less credible?? YOUR the source we have to consider.

[Max Power]

as if a man with a business marketing major should be held less credible?? YOUR the source we have to consider.

You seem very sensitive to the choices you have made for your freshman curriculum. Many people have been listening to marketing hype for more than twice as long as you have been alive.

Something you should keep in mind every once in a while.

[upsman_17]

Lol what was she asking for?

She was shipping out a $25,000 40X50" Peter Max framed painting and only wanted to pay for packaging and shipping as if it were a painting half the size. But if we hooked her up she would bring us more work to lose money on. She told me right before I hung up on her that, "This was no way to do business".

[upsman_17]

It's amazing how many small business owners survive on luck.

That being said, most businesses pay for advertising. If you look at the ROI on every individual sale, you did the right thing. But if what she was asking was an exception, and not likely to happen often, you may get more out of word of mouth advertising than what you would lose on that sale. Her being a business owner, especially local, I would have appealed to her business sense, telling her that what she is asking for will cost more money and result in a net loss, but I will do it if she puts my coupons on her checkout counter, or endorses me on her Facebook page, etc etc.

Make some lemonade, my friend.


Oh, I definately make concessions in some cases. For instance, if a school comes in and wants us to print/design a poster(s) for some event at the school. I give them the price to do it. Then I give them the option of me donating the services as long as I can add a conspicuous footer saying "Donated by _____________". I have gotten many new print customers from those leads.
As for this woman with the painting. She was just a b itch. If I hooked her up now she is the type that would have expected it everytime. I have dealt with her before a few years back. She owns an online auction house so all her customers are out of state, coupons and word of mouth would not have applied with her. All the other local auction houses that I have contracts with hate her guts too.

[madawgg]

special events dont break the balance. Only very very very very few people can get that 10th item. What screwed people up is the box sale...

[nazgul]

Wow. I didn't think my post would evoke such a strong reaction. I thought I was simply relating some past experiences and expressing my hope that Funzio would keep the existing user base in mind.

Good luck to all of you. This forum is clearly not for me.

[doinkent]

The game is severely unbalanced, and Funzio does not care about balance, only about pulling in gold buyers.

If removing the M4A1 caused some people to buy gold to get better guns, then that move was a success from their perspective.

this is exactly what i meant with my comment. the decision to nerf the m4a1 wasnt to balance the game it was because it was a free gun giving people excellent stat boosts. this was probably causing people not to buy gold. now you cant get any real quick stat boosts without gold so its all business from funzio. its 12.30am here and i dont think i worded this well but i think you get what im trying to say

[Dreno33]

You seem very sensitive to the choices you have made for your freshman curriculum. Many people have been listening to marketing hype for more than twice as long as you have been alive.

Something you should keep in mind every once in a while.

not sensitive. even if i were a kinseology major, I would still think that comment was out of line. The type of major has nothing to do with credibility (unless you are speaking for a different field, like rocket science, haha).

and btw, my first year is done, I'm now half way through my sophomore year (in credits), thank'ya very much(:

[Dipstik]

She was shipping out a $25,000 40X50" Peter Max framed painting and only wanted to pay for packaging and shipping as if it were a painting half the size. But if we hooked her up she would bring us more work to lose money on. She told me right before I hung up on her that, "This was no way to do business".

Let me guess... something gaudy with the statute of liberty and lots of red, white, and blue?

[Swifty]

+1 doink

I get what you are trying to say.

[Illuminati]

There IS no balance in this game and there never will be. At the end of the day, this game is nothing more than a variation of Sim City. The idea of PVP is misleading because there's absolutely no skill involved. The idea of "combat" is based solely on stats, which people can attain through time and/or money (gold). Even then, the game's random number algorithms determine the outcome of a fight or robbery with no input needed whatsoever from the player other than pressing a button.

At least in real RPGs like World of Warcraft or Starcraft, a player's skill can overcome whatever deficiencies in stats they may have against their opponent. This provides even newer players with the chance to "win".

[Dravak]

Sorry when you enter a Free to Play game the only balance is money , that is the truth how ever you want to deny it.

Cause that is why majority of the people play it Hank , you can talk about balance in a subsription game .
Cause then everybody is equel , in a free to play nobody is equel to one and other ever .
Some people pay still have rotten luck , others play for free have the most marvelous luck or strategy .
To rival stupid goldspenders , it is the way free to play is setup .

All events will make everybody play a different game , was worst if those events item was just easily purchased .
Now in the end there is simply no balance anymore in the game , and that isn't the big deal at all .
Since a majority of the players want to play solo and have fun .

[Ramshutu]

Only someone with a dubious level of intelligence will honestly look at customer base who, at the last report were paying $5m every month and think 'these guys do not matter' rather than 'how can me make them spend another 5m'.