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View Full Version : Raiding/Attack Haul Tracking and info gathering thread



JohnnyR
04-15-2012, 07:43 PM
I know there's a "Biggest Raid/Attack" haul thread somewhere, but I've started this thread as a way to record and detect patterns in normal raiding and attacking. Hopefully this will shed light on casualty rates.

Recent haul:

My stats: lvl 93, A: 18,220, Allies: 176, Units Used: 704

Unit Breakdown: 300 Super Hornets, 100 Strike Eagles, 85 Spectre Gunships, 25 VTOLs, 29 minisubs, rest random...

His stats: lvl 92:, D: 2,289 , Allies: 28, Units Used: 112

Buildings Attacked:
lvl 1 Oil Rig
lvl 6 Munitions
lvl 3 Recycling

Total Haul:
105,000
79,200
75,600
_______
$259,800 <Grand Total>

Total Lost:
2 minisubs
1 A10 Warthog ($24,000)

Net gain:

$235,800

*******************************************

My general observations:

I find it's easier to raid in the middle of the day for some reason.
My attack skill points are 109 versus my defense at 25. I suspect this plays a part in casualties.
Not this raiding run, but in a previous, I've ran into massive casualty loss for no explicable reason. Going through units turned no huge amount of anti-air, and defense buildings do not seem to work alone based on previous success. Perhaps in conjunction with higher amounts of skill points/and or overall defensive score these things work though-as I have had major casualty loss on a Nanotech protected by a single rail gun recently, every single attack took a valor unit, Super Hornet, Strike Eagle, and Avenger. Not sure if this is the building defense built into Nanotech, or the defense building of the rail gun.

*******************************************

Unfortunately it's difficult to find a base with three or more buildings to raid to go along with my other general requirements of having super low ally count and pitiful defense score, but I'll post up more runs as I can get a chance. I'd appreciate others to as well, particularly the low ally guys. The bigger the sample, the better, try putting in multi building raids so it's easier to collect data. I'm nearing the end of my "protected" zone and will be sharkfood soon, however I hope this does create some sort of progress in other's tactics.

JohnnyR
04-15-2012, 08:36 PM
Next Raiding Haul:

Buildings Attacked:
lvl 3 Ore Mine
lvl 1 Oil Refinery
lvl 5 Munitions


Total Haul:
117,600
60,000
57,600
_______
$235,200 <Grand Total>

Total Lost:
1 Chinook (45,000) <--First in forever since using minisubs

Net gain:

$190,200

My stats: lvl 93, A: 18,208, Allies: 176, Units Used: 704

Unit Breakdown: 300 Super Hornets, 100 Strike Eagles, 85 Spectre Gunships, 25 VTOLs, 29 minisubs, rest random...

His stats: lvl 92:, D: 2,543 , Allies: 31, Units Used: 124

JohnnyR
04-15-2012, 11:46 PM
Haul #3:

My stats: lvl 93, A: 18,242, Allies: 176, Units Used: 704

Unit Breakdown: 300 Super Hornets, 100 Strike Eagles, 85 Spectre Gunships, 25 VTOLs, 29 minisubs, rest random...

His stats: lvl 92:, D: 249 , Allies: 1, Units Used: 4

Buildings Attacked:
lvl 7 Munitions
lvl 3 Recycling

Total Haul:
104,400
79,200
_______
$183,600 <Grand Total>

Total Lost:
None

Net gain:

$183,600

JohnnyR
04-16-2012, 01:27 AM
Haul #4

My stats: lvl 93, A: 18,237, Allies: 176, Units Used: 704

Unit Breakdown: 300 Super Hornets, 100 Strike Eagles, 85 Spectre Gunships, 25 VTOLs, 29 minisubs, rest random...

His stats: lvl 92:, D: 3,538 , Allies: 44, Units Used: 176

Buildings Attacked:
Attacked person

Total Haul/Loss:

196,000 / avenger (100 valor)
173,000 / spectre gunship (160,000)
155,000 / none
140,000 / defensive cannon (loot)
126,000 / none
110,000 / spectre gunship (160,000)
102,000 / none
92,000 / A10 Warthog (24,000)
82,000 / minisub (loot)
74,500 / none
________
1.25 mil <Grand total> (not exact total, rounded)

Total lost:

$384,000


Net gain:

$866,500

************************************************** *****

I'm reporting every major attack/raid I go on here. This has added up to about 1.5 mil so far today. The last attack run was a bit of an anomaly, never find guys with that much hanging out of the vault anymore, but I can see casually pulling in b/w 500k and 750k profit a day just on raids and attacks alone by picking off rivals simply by exercising patience and tenacity in attacking low allied rivals. This is like having an extra level 3 nanotech laying around on your base-except more fun than waiting around for the money! I'm sure I'm not the best at this either, and there are even better ways to go about this. Anybody have anything to say or share about this? What are you guys up to, what's your experiences? I've learned this low ally stuff from the forumites here, never see it discussed though!

Mcdoc
04-16-2012, 01:48 AM
I think with people saving up for the Nanotech, Space Center, and expensive expansion / upgrades, more and more people will poke their head out from the turtle shell to try and risk saving up for these expensive elements of the game. In my opinion, this is a smart move by Funzio to keep PvP alive. Seems like the casualty rates aren't quite as painful as they used to be.

Thanks for the stats!

Tate
04-16-2012, 01:49 AM
Definitely some interesting numbers here JR, I will track what happens next round of my attacks/raids and post the results for you.

My only problem is the crashing :-( still) so it may take a few assaults to get some good data for you.

JohnnyR
04-16-2012, 01:56 AM
Just had a good 4 building run dashed after first hit....argh!!! Wasn't crashing on me for a few days, I'm guessing Funzio's throwing all the guys hanging on for the event out. :(

And thanks for the feedback guys!

McDoc, not sure what's going on with casualties so far this is my (and other's ways around it), but I hope something happens soon, or the shark waters get moved out a few more levels...won't be able to keep up much longer if casualties are gonna be crap like earlier. Once I'm 95, full ally for me, and I'll probably have terrible density AND have a hard time finding targets. :(

Mcdoc
04-16-2012, 02:24 AM
Yeah, I hear you Johnny, I went from 89 to 93 1/4 in this last event. I'm finally resigned to the idea that I'm stronger than 95% of the players at my level, so perhaps there will be enough chum crossing over with me that my meat won't be as tasty as some of those less prepared for the sharks :)

Besides, if you keep your cash vaulted and your buildings collected, how much damage can anyone do to you anyway?

JohnnyR
04-16-2012, 02:42 AM
Haul #5:

My stats: lvl 93, A: 18,228, Allies: 176, Units Used: 704

Unit Breakdown: 300 Super Hornets, 100 Strike Eagles, 85 Spectre Gunships, 25 VTOLs, 29 minisubs, rest random...

His stats: lvl 93:, D: 2,050 , Allies: 23, Units Used: 112 [edit: this number is a mistake. :-/]

Buildings Attacked/Gained:
lvl 1 Oil Rig 105,000
lvl 1 Oil Rig 105,000
lvl 7 Munitions 104,400
lvl 3 Recycling 75,600
_______
$390,000 <Grand Total>

Total Lost:
2 minisub
1 leopard tank (150,000)

Net gain:
$240,000

JohnnyR
04-16-2012, 03:04 AM
Haul #6:

My stats: lvl 93, A: 18,228, Allies: 176, Units Used: 704

Unit Breakdown: 300 Super Hornets, 100 Strike Eagles, 85 Spectre Gunships, 25 VTOLs, 29 minisubs, rest random...

His stats: lvl 92:, D: 4,880 , Allies: 59, Units Used: 236

Buildings Attacked/Gain/Loss:
lvl 3 Oil Refinery / 210,000 / spectre gunship, A10 Warthog (184,000)
lvl 1 Space Center / 51,000 / Minisub, Super Hornet
lvl 1 Space Center / 51,000 / leopard tank (150,000)
lvl 3 Satellite Array / 33,600 / Minisub
_______
$345,600 <Grand Total>

Total Lost:
2 minisub
1 spectre gunship
1 A10 Warthog
1 leopard tank (Believe this was because of a railgun next to the Space Center)
1 Super Hornet (also believe this was because of a railgun next to the Space Center)

Net gain:
$11,000, also 350 valor loss with Super Hornet. :(

This is the worst set I've come across all day today, however in terms of research this is a good result to work with. I think rail guns are very affective, the only thing that did not give me major loss was the satellite center which was situated away from the rail guns. Also to consider was the higher than normal defense score than I usually decide to attack. Conclusion-possible combination of higher defense, railguns, and possible defensive skill points contribute to casualty rate that makes attack unprofitable.

Side note-I hope the slightly different reporting format isn't bugging anyone. I'm playing around with different ways to present the info in the fastest, easiest, and most readable way possible.

ShawnBB
04-16-2012, 03:13 AM
My space center was protected by 4 railguns, 5 mine fields and 5 SAMs, and raid never stops.
:(
People would rather lost a **** load of units for my space center which only pays 85000...

JohnnyR
04-16-2012, 03:20 AM
That's crazy, I can't imagine your stats being thought of as easy pickings either! I would like to know what goes on there, what casualty rates they're experiencing when they pick off these buildings. I've sent many messages out on various rival walls where I've lost big units trying to get a good grip on how skill points work by finding out how they've distributed theirs. The ones I've had bad casualty rates for no apparent reason I'm assuming put all SPs into defense, but I can't rule out simple chance, as I lose a spectre quite often regardless it seems. I wish someone would reply. :(

Oh, by the way-rivals can only take 40% of your building's money, leaving you 40% Funzio takes the rest in their "tax" lol. So that space center? They only took home $51,000! Totally not worth it at the level we are right now! "Normal" raids have to bring in lvl 1 oil rig money for me to consider it worthwhile.

Chiefer
04-16-2012, 03:58 AM
I think, casualties are random no matter what. The system doesn't seem to serve it's purpose well enough. I'm opposite. I have as much defense as you do attack pretty much. And, it's still bad. It would be highly beneficial to know one thing, that for sure. Helped. Would help tremendously to know one thing that would lower the casualty rate for sure. I'm very far in the route of dropping points in defense which is permanent. To try to alleviate casualty loss and it doesn't work. (aside from the obvious, buying units for defense and upgrading boost buildings). I want to play the game as a peaceful Nation that protects it's people and focus's on defense and economy. That just doesn't happen. My wall would be red from someone whose 1/8th my stats in all areas. It seem's to just get worse. My economy expands, and everything else does. But the army I have to maintain just gets more expensive to maintain when I wake up to play from a 6-8hr break. despite all efforts. it seem's 100% random.

This is the reason MW gets no money from me and, Crime City does. I'm a guaranteed potential customer. But I want to be able to play the game to match my play style within reason. I cannot believe investing money would do anything to help my play style. When an all out defense/economist get's beat free player to free player and the attacker is 3000 + atk/def less than the defender at the same level. It seems obvious his attack and defense skill points are not the deciding factor. ( I don't even put points in stamina or energy all but 560, it's all defense and some attack).... I'm talking, someone with like 400 attack and 1200 defense to my 4.5/5k can put some major damage to my army. It's just obvious.

It's got to be random or not coming to proper values.

Freekizh
04-16-2012, 09:32 AM
Haul #6:
This is the worst set I've come across all day today, however in terms of research this is a good result to work with. I think rail guns are very affective, the only thing that did not give me major loss was the satellite center which was situated away from the rail guns.

Are you sure this is not coincidence? Did you see if they had any "strong against air" units as you are mainly air. I believe that this affects the actual casualty rate, whereas I am not so sure the defensive units do this...

JohnnyR
04-16-2012, 12:43 PM
Are you sure this is not coincidence? Did you see if they had any "strong against air" units as you are mainly air. I believe that this affects the actual casualty rate, whereas I am not so sure the defensive units do this...


Totally forgot a out strong against units. :- ( Dammit.

JohnnyR
04-16-2012, 08:14 PM
Alrighty guys, if this isn't proof that there is a way around casualties, I don't know what is:

Haul #7:

My stats: lvl 93, A: 18,203, Allies: 176, Units Used: 704

Unit Breakdown: 300 Super Hornets, 100 Strike Eagles, 85 Spectre Gunships, 25 VTOLs, 29 minisubs, rest random...

His stats: lvl 92:, D: 641 , Allies: 6, Units Used: 24

Buildings Attacked/Gain/Loss:

Attacked Person

256,000 / none lost
207,500 / none lost
186,750 / none lost
168,075 / none lost
151,267 / none lost
136,141 / none lost
122,527 / none lost
110,274 / none lost


$1.34 mil <Grand Total>

Total Lost:
NOTHING

Net gain:
$1.34 mil

************************************************** ***

This is the best set I've ever come across in terms of reward/loss. I actually was afraid I'd end up screwed and lose a few ospreys in the middle or something-but nothing was lost. I probably could have collected 200k more, however I think he might have spent his money as I was attacking him, as I could only fire off 8 attacks before ending. My last major haul on a guy I thought was an anomaly, and I still believe that, but Dreno recently made the observation that a guy's base usually is a good indicator of his vault-both times I noticed unusually small bases and both times I was rewarded for throwing the hook. In the past, I would hit about every other guy with more than 7/8 mil on them, usually getting nothing, and ignore anyone with anything less.

The payoff isn't a lot more than decent most times, the clicking of the refresh button over and over can get tiring, but the results speak for themselves. If you want to PVP, drop your allies, jack up your unit density, and kick azz.

Side note, I went on a bit of an attacking spree trying to hustle some cash for my second space center, and in doing so lost a few units I otherwise wouldn't have trying to get the 11.4 mil pulled together before I got attacked for it all (vault's only 7.5 mil ATM). However, I also noticed attacking slightly lower level buildings than I usually attack brought even fewer casualties, lvl 1 Oil refineries, lvl 5 munitions, lvl 7 military markets, etc. Unfortunately no notes as I was b/w class and work, however no outlandish loss except for an osprey... :(

Aidan
04-17-2012, 01:49 AM
Thanks Johnny fr the stat. From what we've seen so far tht u'll start to lose unit whenever u attckd below 1k def. more thn tht, u'll start to lose a unit or two. Are there a lot of targets under 1k def tho?.

U hv a quite similar army composition as mine; valor unit consists more thn 60% of army brought to battle altho mine is a bit heavier on hornet. What is ur lowest attck unit n how mny of them? How many hornets hv u lose since u gone low allied?

Agent Orange
04-17-2012, 04:47 AM
Johnny, I hope you have a defense stat over 35-40,000 and an ally count at 498 or lower or you are about to get massacred when you level up because everyone in the highest tire is valor hunting and with the change it 's going to be worse.

High unit density is not a passing fancy now but the only way to survive.

RedLabit
04-17-2012, 08:24 AM
Here's my 1 cent contribution.

From my limited experience... raiding a building with plenty of overlapping defense buildings will cause the more precious units to die...

My meat shields are snipers and just now I lost a cruiser and other expensive units in a recent raid to someone with published defense score half of my attacks. He had plenty of defensive buildings covering that lousy lvl6 munition.

Freekizh
04-17-2012, 02:30 PM
This is a good thread. Please also add any strong against units and when losses occur (first attack, 3rd attck, etc).

I am noticing that beyond the third continuous attack, I am losing serious units. Anyone else notice this?

Please post data only.