Unbelievable

[StuN]

Just had a gander at a rivals base. They had quite good def 23k @ lvl 84. The thing that caught my eye though, was his def buildings. He had 5 minefields, 5 holding cells & 5 sams, all good so far right? Wrong, he had them all in one corner of his base & all his high lvl money buildings totally unguarded on the other side. Aha, a honey trap I thought & checked his units. Not a single gold unit in his inventory! Has he/she lost the plot or am I missing something?

[JohnnyR]

Selling them later for a nanotech or upgrade? I spent a good amount of time moving buildings around to achieve max efficiency, for me defense buildings are a useless afterthought to be sold later, really don't want to integrate them with the money/unit buidings.

[Mcdoc]

He or she does not have the benefit of ever reading this Forum :)

EDIT: JohnnyR was posting same moment as me. I guess this is where the unknown value of defense building has not been definitively been confirmed. From my own experience, my Oil Rigs were being raided every single day - then when I moved them closer to shore and added 4 Mine fields and 3 Sam's within Reach of them, they have not since been successfully raided . . . however, I do get LOTS of money left on my account every time I am away from unsuccessful attempts :)

[Mcdoc]

By the way, here are some screen shots of what happens when you employ a good defense strategy of High defense buildings and adding 80 Skill points to your defense. I can't say WHICH of those two is working out the best or if it is a combination of those two strategies, but I love seeing money left behind by failed raids:

http://img546.imageshack.us/img546/6379/120409mwraids2.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/546/120409mwraids2.png/)

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/1304/120409mwraids.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/407/120409mwraids.png/)


BTW: 3 of the 4 attackers shown in these two screen shots are in both pictures at various times - so I can totally relate to those of you who complain that the same people come and attack you over and over and over again. The difference is, I don't have a reason to complain and actually hope the come back EVERY single day :)

Also, I thought $30k was the most you could win in a battle where someone attacked you . . . but as you can see . . . 2 of those results are higher than $30k.

[EnjoyLife]

Also, I thought $30k was the most you could win in a battle where someone attacked you . . . but as you can see . . . 2 of those results are higher than $30k.

$30k is the most per attack. They were just dumb enough to attack you more than once ;p

[Mcdoc]

Good point! I did not consider that dumb act of repeating an attack when you just lost! It is dumb enough that they came back and attacked me a few hours later . . . just funny enough that out of theses 2 screen shots, 3 of the 4 attackers were the same people. Oh and ANOTHER dumb thing - to attack with un-vaulted cash - because the REST of the story that you don't see is that I immediately went back and attacked the ones who left me cash and got like another $200k from each of them . . . BOTH times!

[JMC]

The defense stat is insignificant at higher levels to the point where it doesnt reslly matter where they are in your base. Especially since attacker has the advantage during a raid. I buy them just to have them and for some indestructible defense stat, but i dont really care where i place them anymore because it barely helps at all. Maybe when you upgrade them some of them might be decent defense but many of them are too expensive to be worth wasting upgrade time on for a few defense.

[Mcdoc]

Thanks JMC . . . I keep forgetting that some of those incredible stats in the Big Boy Field are over the top.

BTW . . . sure wish I could entice you with a super cool Avatar for a super cool Guy like yourself!

[Maverick50727]

Thanks JMC . . . I keep forgetting that some of those incredible stats in the Big Boy Field are over the top.

BTW . . . sure wish I could entice you with a super cool Avatar for a super cool Guy like yourself!
I think JMC is right. I don't see gains anymore. But then again once I hit L90 the people raiding me have 2-5X my stats. I have heard that L10 EMPs don't even keep the big boys out. I know I have hit a few buildings of a person that were covered by 5 EMPs (2 L3, 2L2, 1 L1), won and lost no units. I even went back and raided their EMP for good measure. Didn't seem to slow me down an I don't consider myself a big boy yet.

At lower levels or against people of equal strength they can still make a difference. I see many hit me multiple times win some lose others, but I get $0 probably becuase more people at upper levels have the max vault or don't leave loose cash.

[StuN]

I remember reading in another thread that someone in the low 100's was having some trouble with a high end player constantly raiding them & they way they stopped them was by deploying def buildings. It seems you hear one thing from one person & the total opposite from another. Very confusing lol

[Aidan]

Def buildings wont do shiite if the raider r much much stronger. IMO however, they make the attcker bleed a bit by increasing the casualties. Usually when i raided a plyr who hv lots if sam n minefield, i tend to lose high priced unit or hornet more thn compared to plyr tht dont hv def guarded the money buildings

[Dreno33]

Def buildings wont do shiite if the raider r much much stronger. IMO however, they make the attcker bleed a bit by increasing the casualties. Usually when i raided a plyr who hv lots if sam n minefield, i tend to lose high priced unit or hornet more thn compared to plyr tht dont hv def guarded the money buildings

I'm going to include this into one of the guides, Aidan. It is very much possible. just need some others to confirm this a bit

[Chiefer]

I'm going to include this into one of the guides, Aidan. It is very much possible. just need some others to confirm this a bit

I don't want to read your guides. Your wrong, And you should play more and stop posting yourself out there for people to say. No you don't know what your talking about.... Dreno, Admit it, Your beating a dead horse. You don't know TS, TS left cause you can't plan this game. Your trying to plan it and put it into guides. If you were here you would know this. You can't plan against my 100 something defense points at level 40 something. You just can't. Deal with it. A guide is only as good as the person and the day it was made. Please play the game some dude.

It amazes me the lack of understanding the new generation has of EVERYTHING. And, you talk about it anyway.

[Dreno33]

I don't want to read your guides. Your wrong, And you should play more and stop posting yourself out there for people to say. No you don't know what your talking about.... Dreno, Admit it, Your beating a dead horse. You don't know TS, TS left cause you can't plan this game. Your trying to plan it and put it into guides. If you were here you would know this. You can't plan against my 100 something defense points at level 40 something. You just can't. Deal with it. A guide is only as good as the person and the day it was made. Please play the game some dude.

It amazes me the lack of understanding the new generation has of EVERYTHING. And, you talk about it anyway.

I'm sorry, I typed that wrong and I apologize chiefer. I meant to say I may post it into one of the redone threads (not as fact, but as a hypothesis).

Besides, that is NOT why TS left. Apparently I've talked to him more than you have. He just started to get bored with both games and clearly posted that the only reason he continued to play as long as he did was b/c of the forum.

Thirdly, I have never heard the saying beating a dead horse, maybe we don't live close enough for that saying around here but, it sounds very irrelevant to the topic (even as a metaphor).

Next, since Aidan was clearly stating it as an observation and not a fact, that will be taken into consideration. Since you are posting YOUR observations and "theories" as fact, I will disregard it entirely for this is a question only devs know the exact answer to (unless digital walker finds the correct information in the data files, haha)

NOW, stop being so unnecessarily aggressive inside a video game forum. it's not very mature (no matter the age)

P.S. in response to your last sentence, I'm actually on CC right now but will SOON be clicking over to MW(:
Ciao(:

[Tctiger]

I was around 7k def and people with 20k plus couldn't get anything from me but that was maybe as I didn't have money in buildings and had cash in safe protected , they was winning but no cash won , I have good def of my buildings with SAMs ect but guess if you try to collect on time you won't lose it but that's not always pos at night

[Mcdoc]

I'm telling you guys, the Defense skill points are your secret weapon. At level 90, I have 80 points stacked up ready for whale territory, and already I get more and more $$$ left behind by attackers who see my low Allie count as being weak :)

[Dreno33]

I'm telling you guys, the Defense skill points are your secret weapon. At level 90, I have 80 points stacked up ready for whale territory, and already I get more and more $$$ left behind by attackers who see my low Allie count as being weak :)

I've been stocking on those too. have 160 energy and the rest as def SP. they help!

[Speed ump]

Actually guys 300 k , not 30 is the max you can win or track and being attacked, I have won that much both ways, not at higher levels, most know better by then, but at lower levels.also defense buildings for most of my allies, have No meaning at all. I laugh when I see them arraigned so carefully around money or boost buildings. Then I do see the ones where they're on the other end of he base.

[Mcdoc]

Hey Speed, take a look at that Avatar I put up for you. Sent you a PM about it.

[Agent Orange]

Like skill points it's hard to say. If you have a rival with overwealming stats then they should beat you. I get the feeling the devs never figured there would be some players that would build all gold armies that had stats out of this world.

As I've been looking at how the rivals list in the lower levels works it is grouping players with similar stats so that bit of boost to defence does make a difference but once in the highest levels where opponents have far superior forces no.

Skill points though, they do make a difference and with high amounts can make a big difference. I have over 150 just on defence and almost 100 on attack.

[Chiefer]

lol, That's cool. I get paid more often than not when people attempt to attack me. I get anywhere from 8-250k from winning defenses. So why not. Obviously it is a honey trap like you said ha ha.

[Poopenshire]

I've been stocking on those too. have 160 energy and the rest as def SP. they help!

If you look at Hello Kitties math, the points don't add up to much, overall. Her math shows each point is just that "1 point" that adds to your score. I have a very distinct feeling she is right. now if you consider it differently as per say a unit, its like getting 160Def unit. its good on its own, but compared to an overall score of 20,000 per say, and your looking at less than 1% difference.

[cheiz]

I'm @ lvl 67 and I have the impression that raiding buildings close to high def buildings increase the chance of losing valuable units like Super Hornets

[Dreno33]

If you look at Hello Kitties math, the points don't add up to much, overall. Her math shows each point is just that "1 point" that adds to your score. I have a very distinct feeling she is right. now if you consider it differently as per say a unit, its like getting 160Def unit. its good on its own, but compared to an overall score of 20,000 per say, and your looking at less than 1% difference.

i HIGHLY doubt that SP on att/def are incorporated this way. it seems almost stupid of a developer to do this. everyone seems to have their own hypothesis. I personally think they help the random variable's probability

[Poopenshire]

i HIGHLY doubt that SP on att/def are incorporated this way. it seems almost stupid of a developer to do this. everyone seems to have their own hypothesis. I personally think they help the random variable's probability

I believe you 100% and its wierd but when you look at HK math, i think it works out.


Below is HK post:


According to my analysis, yes, the Attack and Defense scores are separate values based on strongest allowed attacking units for attack and strongest allowed defense units for defense. The Defense is calculated a little differently because of the available variables. Here are the formulas for both should anyone want to analyze their Units allowed into battle and know how your lowest unit into battle is being displaced:

Allowable # Units Available to Battle:

Max Allies to battle = Level x 5,
Allowable # units available to battle = Max Allies to battle x 4 Units/Ally

If Actual Allies < Max Allies,
Allowable # units available to battle = Actual Allies to battle x 4 Units/Ally

Attack Score =

Truncated([Sum of attack values from available Air units] x [% Boost from Airship Hangar] x [10% Boost, if Russia])
+
Truncated([Sum of attack values from available Sea units] x [% Boost from Naval Research Center] x [10% Boost, if UK])
+
Truncated([Sum of attack values from available Ground units] x [% Boost from Electronics Factory] x [10% Boost, if Germany])
+
Truncated([Sum of attack values from available Infantry units] x [% Boost from Genetics Lab] x [10% Boost, if China]
+
Attack Skills points


Defense Score =

Truncated([Sum of defense values from available Air units] x [% Boost Composites Factory])
+
Truncated([Sum of defense values from available Sea units] x [% Boost Composites Factory])
+
Truncated([Sum of defense values from available Ground units] x [% Boost Composites Factory])
+
Truncated([Sum of defense values from available Infantry units] x [% Boost Composites Factory])
+
Defense Skills points
+
[Sum of defense values of all Defense Buildings]
+
2 x [Count of all Non-Defense Buildings]
+
1 x [Count of all Defense Buildings]

[Dreno33]

damm i dont wanna do all the math. did she make an example? lol

[overkill 280]

damm i dont wanna do all the math. did she make an example? lol Yeah I hear yah D reno :p

[cheiz]

Attack Score =

Truncated([Sum of attack values from available Air units] x [% Boost from Airship Hangar] x [10% Boost, if Russia])


Hey Poopenshire, do you know, or do you think the value is incremental? (i.e. because I'm Russia my attack value would 1,1 x % Boost from Airship Hangar x Sum of attack values from available Air units)

In other words would have 1,1 times the advantage of the airship hanger and UK have 1,1 times the advantage of the Naval Research, etc. ???

I just thought that the nation advantage and the boost advantage might both separately add to the total attack/defense values and not multiplied with eachother.

[Poopenshire]

Hey Poopenshire, do you know, or do you think the value is incremental? (i.e. because I'm Russia my attack value would 1,1 x % Boost from Airship Hangar x Sum of attack values from available Air units)

In other words would have 1,1 times the advantage of the airship hanger and UK have 1,1 times the advantage of the Naval Research, etc. ???

I just thought that the nation advantage and the boost advantage might both separately add to the total attack/defense values and not multiplied with eachother.

You would have to talk to HelloKittie, I am still trying to see if it works for my units. So far it does, but then again I have alot of units to go through and figure out which ones are being sent to battle vs which ones are not.

[Mcdoc]

Man - I know there are guys like Speed up in the Big Leagues who say that defense buildings and defense skill points won't matter when the Super Armies come at you - but aren't those Super Golden Armies the exception and NOT the rule?

I mean, the bet we can do is prepare for war the way the game was meant to be played, so I gotta think that 90% or more people are going to have strong Armies, but not the Über stats that we have been drilled to be scared of.

.

There are 365 days in a year, and if I want to go outside and fly a kite, I can't just hide under my bed worried about the 6 days that there was a Tornado warning in my town? Even if it was 60 days, there are still over 300 days that I can have fun. Ultimately this is a game - it is meant to be fun and played with strategy - and while there are always gonna be players that are bugger and stronger, that doesn't mean we can't plan for the best and just deal with the worst if it happens I which the ort that can happen is that we
Owe any unvaulted money or uncollected buildings. Is that really so bad?

Sorry, I just feel like hiding your head in the sand isn't as much fun as building a mine field and feeling like you're actually playing a War Strategy game.

[Dreno33]

Sorry, I just feel like hiding your head in the sand isn't as much fun as building a mine field and feeling like you're actually playing a War Strategy game.

Exactly!

...*gets 20k+ stares*...
Oh. yeah... Put's head back in sand :D

[Bronson]

I'm with McDoc on this one and to be honest I wouldn't mind a one touch love tap from one of the big boys just to see the army that they bring!

Still in no rush to get there yet tho lol

[Dreno33]

I'm with McDoc on this one and to be honest I wouldn't mind a one touch love tap from one of the big boys just to see the army that they bring!

Still in no rush to get there yet tho lol

I'm allies with Stephen... His love tap would be like King Kong out for a jog in the Local petting zoo. Not a pretty outcome lol

[cheiz]

...I wouldn't mind a one touch love tap from one of the big boys just to see the army that they bring!

Agree! I got pummeled by uneverknow on her way up at some point (I think I was at around lvl 55) and now I have the pleasure of being her ally which allows me to have the occasional peek in what's going on up there. Made me change my strategy a little!

[Sugarymama]

Sorry, I just feel like hiding your head in the sand isn't as much fun as building a mine field and feeling like you're actually playing a War Strategy game.[/QUOTE]

I agree whole-heartedly. It's called Modern War. I thought we were supposed to fight at least some of the time, and not sit around collecting $$$.

[Dreno33]

I agree whole-heartedly. It's called Modern War. I thought we were supposed to fight at least some of the time, and not sit around collecting $$$.

well you know my strategy already and know eventually i will enter war. but for the lurkers reading this thread. MY opinion is kind of like overkill's avatar. I want to come in with the best of the best units and be able to maintain/replace those units at all times. so, "It's not overkill, it's preparation."

[overkill 280]

well you know my strategy already and know eventually i will enter war. but for the lurkers reading this thread. MY opinion is kind of like overkill's avatar. I want to come in with the best of the best units and be able to maintain/replace those units at all times. so, "It's not overkill, it's preparation." Thanks Dreno :o I'll take that as a compliment :p

[Ezschmidt]

In my experience, def buildings don't prevent a successful raid from happening. I have moved stuff around to get max efficiency but it doesn't seem to help. If somebody's overall offense is greater than yours and that of your defenses, they will win.

[Poopenshire]

In my experience, def buildings don't prevent a successful raid from happening. I have moved stuff around to get max efficiency but it doesn't seem to help. If somebody's overall offense is greater than yours and that of your defenses, they will win.

The goal of any good defense is to make it not cost effective for the attacker. If it costs more to win than you actually win, that will deter attacks. I know it stopped me. I got tired of losing hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of units each fight to get a few lousy valor, no money, and maybe some mission valor after upto 21 consecutive fights of losing hundreds of thousands. And this is even against people with Att score one quarter of mine and lower.

[Hellstorm]

Def buildings are pointless... It's a waist of money. And mcdog... They do not add to attack defense only raid defense. I have raided over 7000 times many with alot of defense buildings and higher stats yet, unable to fend me off. Especially with higher stats they just don't play a role anymore. However, I can emagine that it can serve as psychological demoralization and change somebody's mind. They are also useful for fast cash... Sell them to buy a nanotech.

[Hello Kitty]

@Poop and Draino. Reminder that my calculations are unofficial and just a reverse engineer based on my own data set. I have since made several changes to my data set to re-validate my guess:

1) purchased several units that created a shift ranking my units and dumped the Strike Eagle for Attack and I forget which for Defense
2) leveled up 1 (from 38 to 29)
3) dumped 2 allies (from 37 to 35)
4) built another building (+1)
5) in process of upgrading composites, so will re-check once that's done

With all of the changes above (except #5), I'm still getting pretty close accuracy with my "guess" of a formula. I'll fill in my values so you can see how the formula works (simplified the stating of the formula).

My Actual Values:

Level = 39
Allies = 35
Attack Skill Points = 4
Defense Skill Points = 33
Country = USA (0 boost)


Unit Type
Att Units
Att Total
Def Units
Def Total


Air
16
1204
32
1667


Ground
33
1713
71
2275


Infantry
75
2538
24
1190


Sea
16
857
13
878


Totals
140
6312
140
6010



Building Stats:
Airship Hangar L1 = 2% (air boost)
Electronics Factory L1 = 2% (ground boost)
Genetics Lab L2 = 4% (infantry boost)
Naval Research Center L1 = 2% (sea boost)
Composites Factory L4 = 8% (defense boost)

# Non-defense buildings = 17
# Defense buildings = 49
Sum of defense from defense buildings = 274

Attack Score:

Attack = trunc(total Air attack values x Air boost x 10% boost, if Russia)
+ trunc(total Ground attack values x Ground boost x 10% boost, if Germany)
+ trunc(total Infantry attack values x Infantry boost x 10% boost, China)
+ trunc(total Sea attack values x Sea boost x 10% boost, if UK)
+ Attack Skill Points

Attack = trunc(1204 x 1.02) + trunc(1713 x 1.02) + trunc(2538 x 1.02) + trunc(857 x 1.02) + 4 = 6492

My Actual Attack Score = 6489 (off by 2)

Defense Score:
Defense = trunc(total Air defense values x Unit boost)
+ trunc(total Ground defense values x Unit boost)
+ trunc(total Infantry defense values x Unit boost)
+ trunc(total Sea defense values x Unit boost)
+ Defense Skill Points
+ Sum of Defense Building scores
+ (2 x count of non-defense buildings)
+ (2 x count of defense buildings) <-- I increased this to a factor of 2 to make my formula work

Defense = trunc(1667 x 1.08) + trunc(2275 x 1.08) + trunc(1190 x 1.08) + trunc(878 x 1.08) + 33 + 274 + (2 x 49) + (2 x 17) = 6929

My Actual Defense Score = 6929

[Agent Orange]

I don't want to read your guides. Your wrong, And you should play more and stop posting yourself out there for people to say. No you don't know what your talking about.... Dreno, Admit it, Your beating a dead horse. You don't know TS, TS left cause you can't plan this game. Your trying to plan it and put it into guides. If you were here you would know this. You can't plan against my 100 something defense points at level 40 something. You just can't. Deal with it. A guide is only as good as the person and the day it was made. Please play the game some dude.

It amazes me the lack of understanding the new generation has of EVERYTHING. And, you talk about it anyway.

I would have to agree, I was a bit curious so I waded through my ally list and found Dreno33's base. The first thing I realized is is that he's really wasting his time with this strategy since he cannot build anything since the level he is at prevents him from doing so. Yes he has over 10 million in or outside of his vault but I can generate several million in a day from my meager buildings which are more plentiful than the handful of basic money buildings on his base. He has no army so I'm not really too sure what he's spending his income on which is only $103,258 per hour. Mine isn't a lot higher ($163,369) but for some reason I have more than the three level 1 unit buildings he has on his base.

His highest level money building is a Level 7 supply depot. From what I see he is in no way qualified to give any sort of advice on this game because he has no experience how can he he has not done anything yet.

[Poopenshire]

Kitty, your equations work very well for me. Every now and then I have guess because I lose units or buy more and forget to update my spreadsheet to check it out.

[Hello Kitty]

Kitty, your equations work very well for me. Every now and then I have guess because I lose units or buy more and forget to update my spreadsheet to check it out.That's good. It was an exercise in fun for me with the intent to help demystify the values on my profile and:

determine if the attack and defense were separated by respective top units (yes - meaning differnt units are used when either attacking or defending, the top scoring in each category go to battle),
understand how the calculation begins to retire the lowest valued unit that goes into battle as stronger units in either attack or defense, or both, are added, and
see how the peripheral skills and defense buildings were used.
Still just a guess, but seems to fit.

[overkill 280]

K Kitty I don't know what your talking about :confused: So I think you should go visit me, and tell me what I have to do with my unit situation :p

[StuN]

So I'm better off buying 5 Sentry Aircraft rather than an Emp Cannon, because the Emp does diddly squat?

[Dreno33]

I would have to agree, I was a bit curious so I waded through my ally list and found Dreno33's base. The first thing I realized is is that he's really wasting his time with this strategy since he cannot build anything since the level he is at prevents him from doing so. Yes he has over 10 million in or outside of his vault but I can generate several million in a day from my meager buildings which are more plentiful than the handful of basic money buildings on his base. He has no army so I'm not really too sure what he's spending his income on which is only $103,258 per hour. Mine isn't a lot higher ($163,369) but for some reason I have more than the three level 1 unit buildings he has on his base.

His highest level money building is a Level 7 supply depot. From what I see he is in no way qualified to give any sort of advice on this game because he has no experience how can he he has not done anything yet.

Are you done Agent Orange? You're a grown man talking down to another player over an iPhone game b/c you feel he is not "qualified" to give advice about the game. I do not need to defend myself. I don't talk out of my azz and I don't speak lies or give "wrong" advice. Jut enjoy the forum and try not to judge another player for purposely being a LLP. Strategies differ. Talk to you later man...

[StuN]

Had rethink about this. I think def buildings are worth it, if you're prepared to put the time in to upgrade them. Remember, the buildings don't replace units, they add to your def score. For instance if I removed my SAMs, minefields, railgun & cannon, I would lose 300+ from my def score.

If my lowest defensive unit had a score of 8 & I added say an AC I would only gain 38, not 46 but for the same price I could add a RailGun & add 75 to my def score

[digitalwalker]

@Hello kitty

U r very creative! And I like ur post, very neat and beautiful! Keep the great work.

Just a few notes on ur formula:

1) Skill points do not visiblely add to ones stats

2) number of buildings doesn't affect ones stats

3) unit boost buildings boost both attack and defence

[Hello Kitty]

@Hello kitty

U r very creative! And I like ur post, very neat and beautiful! Keep the great work.

Just a few notes on ur formula:

1) Skill points do not visiblely add to ones stats

2) number of buildings doesn't affect ones stats

3) unit boost buildings boost both attack and defenceHi digitalwalker, appreciate the feedback. Can you tell me how you've confirmed your above points, i.e. do you have access to the actual formula? Would be great to see the actual calculation, since I just reverse engineered my findings. Also, from the older posts and TS spreadsheet:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgEHrvnoijXudG1NaFdaQUp5QlowT0RqS1Z2bll6Z UE&hl=en_US&pli=1#gid=4

the Composites Building is specifically described as increasing unit defense (see Boost Buildings tab) and the other boost buildings are tied specifically to unit type (air, ground, infantry, sea) and increases that unit type's power (attack) respectively.

I've used 3 very different data sets to validate my formula, and granted after the calculations for the unit values and applying the boosts (country and building), it's fuzzy on the remainder, but it consistently works.

Thanks for any insight you could provide.

[Everson25]

I tell what is unbelievable! I was going through my rival list to pick one to attack when one got my attention. His incoming per hour was 383 at lvl 82. He had just the commander Center and adv air base plus some defence. I thought myself: 'what is he doing?', is it strategies? I don't think so but who am I to say something. It looks we meet all kind of players with all kind of wierd ideas. Well, good lucky for him and for me as well as I left the visit with two more boxes, lol.

[digitalwalker]

Hi digitalwalker, appreciate the feedback. Can you tell me how you've confirmed your above points, i.e. do you have access to the actual formula? Would be great to see the actual calculation, since I just reverse engineered my findings. Also, from the older posts and TS spreadsheet:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgEHrvnoijXudG1NaFdaQUp5QlowT0RqS1Z2bll6Z UE&hl=en_US&pli=1#gid=4

the Composites Building is specifically described as increasing unit defense (see Boost Buildings tab) and the other boost buildings are tied specifically to unit type (air, ground, infantry, sea) and increases that unit type's power (attack) respectively.

I've used 3 very different data sets to validate my formula, and granted after the calculations for the unit values and applying the boosts (country and building), it's fuzzy on the remainder, but it consistently works.

Thanks for any insight you could provide.

Hello:)Hk, I didn't check the data, my last comment was just an very rough and quick replay.

Yes,the composite factory only boost defense, but the units boost building also boost defense, Everytime my airhunger finish upgrades, I always see an boost on both attack and defense.

I just bought an supply dept, and observes no defense stat changes, and also I spent my banked sp on both attack and defense, and observes no changes on my stats

The missing parameter in ur formula is that, the invisible defense score of each money buildings which u can only find it in the XML file.

[Hello Kitty]

Hello:)Hk, I didn't check the data, my last comment was just an very rough and quick replay.Yes,the composite factory only boost defense, but the units boost building also boost defense, Everytime my airhunger finish upgrades, I always see an boost on both attack and defense. I just bought an supply dept, and observes no defense stat changes, and also I spent my banked sp on both attack and defense, and observes no changes on my statsThe missing parameter in ur formula is that, the invisible defense score of each money buildings which u can only find it in the XML file.Ah, OK, you're guessing as well. I modified the equations to test your theory that specific unit boost adds to both defense and attack values and it doesn't hold on my data sets. Perhaps you are changing other variables as well? I've used discrete data sets and am controlling changes in certain variables to see where the formula breaks. I have not tested the boost country gives since I'm USA.

I've read about the invisible defense score, that why I added a straight-line calculation based on building count. In your example above, by adding a supply depot and seeing no change in score, then neither you or I are correct, since I add a constant value for that factor and you reference an invisible defense score for money buildings.

I'm still confident on the core attack and defense calculations using my formulas, but remain unsure of the other factors. Until we see the real formula, then it's a guess. As mentioned before, I was most curious on seeing the effect of adding new units that displace my lowest valued A/D unit. Most are citing that it's simple math subtracting the value of the lowest from the value of the newly added higher stat unit, but are not taking into account what unit gets added and the multipliers that boost buildings and country add. For now, my formulas are directionally acceptable for my purposes :)

[Poopenshire]

Ok I broke down and did some PVP this morning, just 5 and here are my losses against a person with ~6800 Def againts my ~20,000 Att

Losses by me
Attack 1: Cruiser, Flamethrower Soldier, Mini-Sub -~$300,000
Attack 2: KC-135, 2 x Sniper - ~$170,000
Attack 3: KC-135, Mini-sub, Sniper - ~$160,000
Attack 4: Stealth Frigate, 2 x Sniper, Eagle Fighter - ~$140,000 and 275 Valor
Attack 5: Seahawk Helicoptor, Submarine, Sniper, Avenger - ~150 Valor and ~$76,000

grand total 425 valor and ~$846000

all i got in return? - ~38 Valor

REALLY???????

[Thunder Child]

@ Poop!
Ouch!

[Poopenshire]

@ Poop!
Ouch!

Yeah no kidding. I might as well just flush my troops and money away!

[Thunder Child]

Yeah no kidding. I might as well just flush my troops and money away!
Why not stick to PvE for the event?

[Poopenshire]

OH I am, after some posts yesterday I did some probing attacks to see if losses rates had gotten worse. I probed again today. I just didn't expect this..... this is worse than any i had before in succession. Mods and L Fizzle read this, this is exactly why people are mad, and why they are stopping play, and keeping good people from investing money in this game.

[Aidan]

Yeah no kidding. I might as well just flush my troops and money away!

I wonder if u leave a big pile of shiit whenever u attcked people. If u did, it's only fair tht u lose thr much. Lol. Pooping in front of someone's door is nvr nice. Only cartman wud do such thing 

[Thunder Child]

How to lower the tone two gentlemen of the game had taken great care to set....

[Poopenshire]

are you talking about Bigflan?

[Thunder Child]

BigFlan, a gentleman? He's barely out of diapers!

[Aidan]

Yeah, who r u on about TC? No gentleman here in this forum except fr me of coz

[Thunder Child]

Do I have to start posting in farmer-speak?

[Aidan]

Do I have to start posting in farmer-speak?

Lol. Plz do. Us farmers cant understand shiit

[digitalwalker]

@HK

Yes, u r correct, the invisible defense of supply dept is 1 , which didnt reflect to an addition of 1 nor 2*1 .

Because of I m full allied, so I can't easily check my total units and hence my stats.

Also. I think, without working out how does fight works, exzact calculations of stats r not so important, because a slightly weaker opponent can also beat a slightly stronger one. So, don't worry too much about those reminders, as long as the dominant terms r correct which ur calculations have.

[Agent Orange]

How to lower the tone two gentlemen of the game had taken great care to set....

Yeah I know, I'll post my rebuttal to Dreno and then wait for his reply. Then leave it at that.

[Agent Orange]

Are you done Agent Orange? You're a grown man talking down to another player over an iPhone game b/c you feel he is not "qualified" to give advice about the game. I do not need to defend myself. I don't talk out of my azz and I don't speak lies or give "wrong" advice. Jut enjoy the forum and try not to judge another player for purposely being a LLP. Strategies differ. Talk to you later man...

No I am seriously questioning your credentials based on my investigation of your base. In the real world folks will question someone's experience when they present themselves in a certain manner and if you had applied for a job in my company the first thing we would look at is your experience. Yes I started to wonder when you started to regurgitate the work of other far more experienced players and you were both coy and disrespectful when I asked you to stop both in public and in private.

Upon further investigation I find that your in game experience is somewhat lacking and therefore I now seriously question the validity of the posts you make. It's great to have the level of enthusiasm that you have towards this game however your lack of respect and experience greatly undermines your credibility.

In terms of differing strategies of course there are going to be a lot of them and the fun part of this game for some is that the game is quite fluid in terms of it's programming such that you need to be very flexible in terms of your strategy. But again based on what I saw I don't see a very viable long term strategy evolving on your base since one of the big things due to the many golden players is to have an army with strong unit density and I can't see how that can be achieved if you only have the basic of basic unit buildings all stuck at level 1.

Yeah see you later.....

[Poopenshire]

How bad was the base? got a photo or something to share?

[Agent Orange]

Yup got that, just running out the door to pick up a few tubs of ice cream. It's on sale cheap and we go through lots.... :)

[Thunder Child]

Yup got that, just running out the door to pick up a few tubs of ice cream. It's on sale cheap and we go through lots.... :)
Drooling.... Fedex me some, pleeeeeeaaaassssseee!

[Agent Orange]

Drooling.... Fedex me some, pleeeeeeaaaassssseee!

LOL, sure it might be a bit molten by the time it arrives though. Mmmmmm chocholaty chip and cookies and cream....

Do you have Movenpicks in Korea? If so try the Tete-a-tete.... 10 scoops of their swiss home made ice cream covered in lots of whipped cream and other yummy toppings, couldn't find a photo online though but good for at least two..

[Thunder Child]

LOL, sure it might be a bit molten by the time it arrives though. Mmmmmm chocholaty chip and cookies and cream....

Do you have Movenpicks in Korea? If so try the Tete-a-tete.... 10 scoops of their swiss home made ice cream covered in lots of whipped cream and other yummy toppings, couldn't find a photo online though but good for at least two..
We could fall out really quickly! The 'Ice Cream Incident' will not soon be forgotten!
No, but we have BRs.... It was more the popping out for ice cream that got me! Guess I need a care package from home!

[Agent Orange]

Ok here's the grab. That's it, that's all.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7237/6921789842_91ae5b4fb7_z.jpg

An ok economy but without the unit buildings actually being able to produce anything other then junk it's going to be a real tough slog once you come out in the open. Someone else mentioned a fatal flaw of this type of strategy is the amount of time wasted vs building economy and density. Economy seems to be coming along but unit desity is going to be a real issue.

I dunno maybe I'm missing something but this looks like a case of all hat and no cattle.....

[Aidan]

Name a bit weird, tete tete but the way u described it, sure does sounds delicious!

Main thing tht TC eats- bibimbap, bulgogi, sun tofu, kimchi n pepero as snack

[Thunder Child]

Name a bit weird, tete tete but the way u described it, sure does sounds delicious!

Main thing tht TC eats- bibimbap, bulgogi, sun tofu, kimchi n pepero as snack
I see you have some experience yourself, Aidan?

[Aidan]

I see you have some experience yourself, Aidan?

Had a korean girl colleague before, well 2 actlly. They tought me lots bout korea, the food, language(a bit) n i actlly like the food. Spicy as hell. The language, urmm not so much

Bck to topic, Dreno's choice of strat.
I recently tookover my wife's ac (she played fr like a week n quit) lvl 26 now. I tookover at lvl 8 i think. I emphasised on upgrading airfield as compared to money buildings. My strat was to equip myself with much better army with 100% focus on pvp. Skills points: 22 stamina, 30 attcks. IMO, in the low levels, pvp is defo the way to go. Lots of noobs dnt know wht r they doing, lots of unvaulted cash, u cn make much2 more frm pvp thn collecting frm ur buildings.

Wht i'm saying is i wudnt choose dreno's strat coz IMO, it's the wrong approach, wrong level (too early). Level 40 shud be the choice where all unit buildings r unlocked. But i understand why he choosed tht way n i dnt blame him

[JohnnyR]

Ok here's the grab. That's it, that's all.



An ok economy but without the unit buildings actually being able to produce anything other then junk it's going to be a real tough slog once you come out in the open. Someone else mentioned a fatal flaw of this type of strategy is the amount of time wasted vs building economy and density. Economy seems to be coming along but unit desity is going to be a real issue.

I dunno maybe I'm missing something but this looks like a case of all hat and no cattle.....

At level 1, what and how many units are needed though? It seems he is building enough economy so that when he does feel the need to get out and fight, he'll have the funds to replace lost units. By concentrating on economy at low levels, he is setting himself up to kick azz later.

[Dreno33]

Ok here's the grab. That's it, that's all.

An ok economy but without the unit buildings actually being able to produce anything other then junk it's going to be a real tough slog once you come out in the open. Someone else mentioned a fatal flaw of this type of strategy is the amount of time wasted vs building economy and density. Economy seems to be coming along but unit desity is going to be a real issue.

I dunno maybe I'm missing something but this looks like a case of all hat and no cattle.....


Don't mean to hop on but if that is his whole base , AO is right what he is saying.And if his military is weaker ,, geez probably stop giving advice:cool:

idk about you but my strategy seems to be working quite well for me.

http://i42.tinypic.com/1424xoy.png

so, shut your trash talk AO. Just b/c I don't play the game the way you think is appropriate doesn't mean I don't read the forums enough to know about topics beyond my level. I know HL tactics through CC with my old account. MW and CC have many game mechanics in common. Quit with the attacking, you're being ignorant to post such things about me

P.S. The average rival in my list has 200-250 attack.
Not to mention every single SP earned thus far have been added to defense

[bigflan]

Dreno calm down your Lv 7 that's the easier part you don't know until you experience it

[Dreno33]

Dreno calm down your Lv 7 that's the easier part you don't know until you experience it

of course, i know that. Hints why I'm preparing with my economy. but his unnecessary rudeness and ignorance on who i am and what I know has got to stop

[StuN]

of course, i know that. Hints why I'm preparing with my economy. but his unnecessary rudeness and ignorance on who i am and what I know has got to stopIn a way, you do set yourself up for it. It's difficult for people to take advise from someone who is only lvl 7. And you seem to dish the advise out right, left & centre. At least that's the impression I get. I'm not being rude, just making an observation

[Marc]

of course, i know that. Hints why I'm preparing with my economy. but his unnecessary rudeness and ignorance on who i am and what I know has got to stop

If this news to consolidate you from the haters of your MEGA turtling strategy, since seeing your stats. At my current lvl 46 i see rival with similar stats as you with my 25 allies. Your in for a treat once you rise up the rank with Better unit. Won't be touching me though :D gold units ftw.

[Chimera]

http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u476/Chimera-gene/MyProfile-1.png
I'm using a similar strategy.

[vball]

When I first discovered the forums, I felt that my strategy was the correct one. Upon seeing some bases, thank you Agent Orange and others, along with some questions, it became apparent that my strategy could use some serious overhaul.

At that level (around 35) I made some significant changes. Now find myself making yet more tweaks to those changes too. My guess is that over time there will be more tweaking that will occur.

Personally started farming, then found it somewhat boring and frankly much more effective to go and attack pvp rather than save up for eons trying to save the money for upgrades. I love unvaulted cash, as I appreciate them saving money for me. Now there are certain players like War Priest who have such high numbers that a vault is irrelevant, but eventually it will become important. For the first time in a long time have actually seen players on my rival list who have numbers similar to mine. Until now, was able to pretty attack without any fear of loss.

I started a thread asking higher level players their opinions and thoughts for one simple reason. They are battle tested and have made some stupid mistakes like I have. I did not solicit players at lower levels than myself. Why? Well frankly they have not faced those battles that eventually I would face.

For me, I continue to appreciate and ally myself with those strong players as I learn a great deal from them. In my business, I often have people who just have bought their first DSLR, a consumer version at that, tell me how to shoot and how to do great photography. I smile, ask to see their work, compare it mine and then their suggestions telling me how to take photographs seem to stop. I do not seek advice from GWC's (guys with cameras), but will always listen as there is so much to learn. My advice comes from fellow professionals in my job.

In the game, I choose to get advice from those such as Agent Orange and others who have always been respectful, kind and helpful. They have been there and know what they are talking about.

[Dreno33]

http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u476/Chimera-gene/MyProfile-1.png
I'm using a similar strategy.

how the heck has no one attacked you yet? i have over 200! :( lucky