How many mafia should you have

[Sasha54]

What are the benefits of having a large mafia?

I am at level 48 and have around 140 or so but I see most people at my level have more. I could easily increase but that's not where I have been concentrating and just wondered whether it will benefit me or will go against me in that I then have to equip them.

Thanks

[Swifty]

This another one of those complicated subjects. I recommend you search and find the numerous previous threads that deal with this issue.

If you cannot equip your mafia with very good gear, then there is no advantage to a big mafia, and it will actually be a disadvantage.

When you get to high enough level that you can be seen by people 15+ levels above you, having a small mafia may well shield you against some or even all of those attacks.

[Nicholost]

This another one of those complicated subjects. I recommend you search and find the numerous previous threads that deal with this issue.
While I'm not opposed to this advice, Swifty, I do want to point out that the search feature is pretty freaking crappy. I have known what I am searching for and still not been able to find it. That's compounded when a new poster doesn't really know what they are looking for. Maybe we can link them to one of the previous threads in addition to recommending for them to search?

Sasha54, I would say do not have more mafia than you are able to equip. If you only have 250 guns, 240 melee, 220 armor, and 190 vehicles, you may not want to have a mob much greater than 190 and definitely not larger than 250. In that example, anything between 190 and 250 kind of depends on how much gain you see when adding a new member, knowing they won't be fully equipped. This is the somewhat complicated part that Swifty was referring to. A simple rule to follow is no do not have more mafia than the number in your most well stocked weapon category. Personally, I would recommend not having more mafia than your lowest category, 190 in my example.

[Caleb]

+1 to Swifty. There are many prior threads on this topic that will be your best source of info.

At level 83, my rivals range still seems to be about + or - 1 level so I haven't had to worry yet about monsters many levels higher. My strategy so far is to bring as many gang members to a fight as possible (5 x the current level, up to 500 max) because even the weak guys are adding something to my attack or defense total.

At level 48 and 140 mafia, if you are seeing rivals with the level max of 240, then I don't see any reason not to expand your mafia as long as you have some type of weapon and armor that they can carry, even if that means buying some low stat equipment.

On the other hand, if you are not seeing and not being attacked by the 240 mafia players, then staying at 140 and increasing numbers as you acquire good equipment may be the best bet. Also, if you already have a good win/loss ratio, then you don't really need the extra few points that adding weak mafia might bring you.

[Swifty]

+1 Nicholost

It would be very helpful if they would substantially improve the search.

[Nicholost]

At level 48 and 140 mafia, if you are seeing rivals with the level max of 240, then I don't see any reason not to expand your mafia as long as you have some type of weapon and armor that they can carry, even if that means buying some low stat equipment.
Keep in mind that just because you can see a rival, it does not mean that they can see you. The bracketing may keep you off their radar, even though they show up on yours. This is especially true when comparing rivals with significant mafia size differences (e.g. 140 vs 240 at lvl 48). Adding mafia and low-end weapons just to match their mafia size will get you on their radar and you will be comparatively weaker than you would be if you had stayed with 140 mafia and better weapons. If you have to buy low level weapons to outfit your mafia, you have too many mafia.

[Swifty]

Nicholost's first post in this thread also reminds me to remind beginners:

RTFM

Heh, sorry, just kidding. What I really mean is try to take some time and read the stickied "best of best" series of guides. Even the ones that are out of date have useful nuggets. Well worth reading. Well worth reading more than once.

[Caleb]

True Nicholost, but I don't believe I've reached the level yet where I am seen by players many levels higher - that starts somewhere past level 100 now, doesn't it? At least I can say that I haven't been attacked by anyone that is more than +/- 1 of my level.

So, if worrying about the many-level higher monster is off the table, you're back to are you already at 140 mafia seeing and being attacked by rivals of 240. If so, then I don't think raising your mafia level will hurt you because it shouldn't push you into a new group of rivals.

But like Swifty and Nicholost both said, it's a complicated issue. You could try experimenting with adding mafia, seeing how it affects your attack/defense, and if you run into trouble just drop back down to 140.

My weakest mafia are only adding a few points to my total, but my overall stats are decent, and I don't think (although could be wrong) that if I dropped say 100 mafia, it would change my set of rivals.

[Nicholost]

So, if worrying about the many-level higher monster is off the table, you're back to are you already at 140 mafia seeing and being attacked by rivals of 240. If so, then I don't think raising your mafia level will hurt you because it shouldn't push you into a new group of rivals.
If you are seen, being attacked by, and losing to rivals of the same level (+/- 1 level), it will be faster and cheaper to scale back your mafia so that you are both off their radar and relatively more powerful for your bracket (mafia range) than scale up and try to equip them with cheap weapons. Scaling up and compensating with cheap weapons will make you even weaker and could expose you to higher and stronger brackets.

[Sasha54]

Thanks for all replies

I have read most of the stickies and I do search whenever possible - sometimes just easier to post a question KWIM

I have 480 or so weapons and 183 armour so I understand that I should stay under the 183 for now in mafia count

I see rivals in the 240 range but I don't seem to have too many problems with attacks or robberies against me - a few but I collect pretty regularly and so far have not lost any large amounts

On the other hand my own robberies are getting quite good and I have taken some substantial amounts - well not by your accounts but for my level I think they are good

I am farming at the junkyard for my favorite item and I think that is helping my defense - and offense
Will open up boardwalk soon - and then I can concentrate on that for a while

So I will just add members slowly I guess

Thanks again

[xclusiv]

i dont know but i think your best bet would be 500.

[Swifty]

If xclusiv is correct, I have been over thinking the whole problem.

[Dorian Gray]

I've always used full mafia for my level.

[G Wiz]

I always say have atleast 5 mafia over your recommended max, that way when you level up you become stronger. At higher levels i dont know if the whole "more mafia than needed thing means more rivals can see you" still exists, but is a reason why i dont stray to far above my max mafia.

[Caleb]

I'm with G Wiz...generally have around 5 or so mafia beyond the current level max.

[Nicholost]

At higher levels i dont know if the whole "more mafia than needed thing means more rivals can see you" still exists...
It may not exist on higher levels, but I'm sure it does on lower levels. One strategy for staying off the radar of players with a larger mafia that you is to have a mafia that only consists of only henchmen. I would assume that bracketing is performed by the software based on how many players are available to build a rivals list from. At level 48 and my level, 86, there are enough players that bracketing is narrow. With 277 mafia, I only see players with between 240 and 410 mafia, even though 430 is the max for my level and I know many players have that many or more. In addition, I can only see opponents at level 85 and 86. I'm sure bracketing becomes quite broad or nonexistent in the higher levels (120+???) as the herd thins and there are fewer players for the software to build a rivals list from.

With that said, regardless of your level, it never makes sense to have more mafia than you have equipment, and I would argue that you shouldn't have more mafia than you have at least decent equipment for. The maximum number of mafia that you can have should not dictate the number of mafia you do have, unless you have enough items of each category to equip them all. For higher level players, you have probably accumulated enough equipment that you can outfit your maximum mafia and do so with decent stuff, but at the lower and mid levels, players either have significant equipment shortages in certain categories (i.e. vehicles) or are dependent on very poor equipment (1-3 att & def), so the advice that they should use close to their maximum is incorrect.

[Ghost818]

With all due respect, nose picker is correct.

[Nicholost]

...nose picker is correct.
Do we know each other in real life? Because that's also my nickname outside the forums. :p

[jobadass]

At level 48, I would think you would what to maximize your Attck/defense and bring your mafia up to 240. You will see a significant increase in stats. I would try to balance out weapon/melee/armor/vehicle, so can equip all of your members. Don't waste cash on low level equipment and don't spend all respect on tommy guns and combat boots. The Yamahas and NV Binos are a solid place to invest respect points.

[G Wiz]

With all due respect, nose picker is correct.I see you rhyming ghost lol.

[Ghost818]

I think I know someone, but I can't recall from where. :cool:

[Caleb]

With 277 mafia, I only see players with between 240 and 410 mafia, even though 430 is the max for my level and I know many players have that many or more.

That's interesting that you are definitely avoiding the max mafia at your level. I had tried dropping some mafia a while back, but it wasn't enough to change my rival list, and I had thought from some old threads that the bracketing had changed. If you aren't seeing the level max mafia players, then I totally agree with you. If you are in the mix with those max players, then every additional point from an extra mafia can only help.

A side effect though is that you can't complete any Thug Life goals that require 500 mafia, right?

[Ghost818]

I see you rhyming ghost lol.
haha it was unintended :D

[jobadass]

i dont know but i think your best bet would be 500.
I'm sticking with 499

[Nicholost]

I think I know someone, but I can't recall from where. :cool:
If they were picking their nose, it was definitely me.


That's interesting that you are definitely avoiding the max mafia at your level.
Not avoiding it, just not equipped for it. I'm currently short ~70 vehicles and am using items with 3, 2, and sometimes 1 att/def! I need many more and much better equipment before I can increase my mob size.


If you aren't seeing the level max mafia players, then I totally agree with you. If you are in the mix with those max players, then every additional point from an extra mafia can only help.
I definitely do not see players with 430 mafia, nor do I get attacked by them, so I know they can't see me. (I'm carrying more than $1 mill in the open, so I attract some attention.) I know this to be true because I need 15 fights against 420 or more for a Thug Life goal, but I can't see anyone with more than 410.

I assume the mass of players at my level is sitting at or close to the maximum mafia size for two reasons: 1) the bracket is biased in that direction indicating that there are more options with higher mafia counts, and 2) people assume that increasing your mafia to the maximum makes you stronger. It does... as long as you can equip them.


A side effect though is that you can't complete any Thug Life goals that require 500 mafia, right?
Correct, but I'm not losing sleep over that. If having the right number of mafia for my equipment means that I can no-bank and not lose a fight/robbery in more than three weeks, I'll gladly put Thug Lifes on hold.

[Vile Lynn]

...regardless of your level, it never makes sense to have more mafia than you have equipment, and I would argue that you shouldn't have more mafia than you have at least decent equipment for.

Even the crappy equipment adds points to your stats & you're always adding loot, so it makes sense to me. Keeping a mafia size down to the number of M4s makes no sense to me... not saying you do, but many have & it keeps them weaker than if they added more to their mafia size.


The maximum number of mafia that you can have should not dictate the number of mafia you do have, unless you have enough items of each category to equip them all. Just stating another opinion...
I think max mafia should be the goal: equip the max, even with crap because your gonna have to buy it anyway... I'm still buying gas masks at lvl128 for maps but haven't needed them in months... check out maps to buy extras before you need them. Nevermind all of this if you don't do the maps, heh-heh.


...have enough items of each category to equip them all.
Including explosives :)

[Nicholost]

Even the crappy equipment adds points to your stats & you're always adding loot, so it makes sense to me. Keeping a mafia size down to the number of M4s makes no sense to me... not saying you do, but many have & it keeps them weaker than if they added more to their mafia size.
I never said equip mafia based on the number of M4s you have. I said equip down to your decent weapons, and left that definition open so you can make the judgment call on what "decent" means based on your inventory. My point is why deliberately increase your mafia and expose yourself to stronger players with higher mafia counts just to equip a gun with 2/2, a melee with 1/1, an armor with 1/3, and no vehicle? You gained 4 attack and 6 defense. That's a pathetically small gain to both stats. You'd be better off camping for a few days and buying better items with the saved cash to ensure your gains/mafia member are higher than that. So while numerically stronger, if you moved your bracket up by increasing your mafia size, you are now weaker relative to your opponents, and are therefore going to get beat more frequently. Does that make sense? Say "yes."

[Vile Lynn]

Yes, yes, yes!
:D

[Nicholost]

Yes, yes, yes!
:D

Rad.


+6 characters.

[Caleb]

Not avoiding it, just not equipped for it.

Probably bad word choice, by "avoiding" I just meant that they couldn't see you.

And since that is the case, I agree with your points.

What is your per mafia attack/defense?

[Dorian Gray]

I never said equip mafia based on the number of M4s you have. I said equip down to your decent weapons, and left that definition open so you can make the judgment call on what "decent" means based on your inventory. My point is why deliberately increase your mafia and expose yourself to stronger players with higher mafia counts just to equip a gun with 2/2, a melee with 1/1, an armor with 1/3, and no vehicle? You gained 4 attack and 6 defense. That's a pathetically small gain to both stats. You'd be better off camping for a few days and buying better items with the saved cash to ensure your gains/mafia member are higher than that. So while numerically stronger, if you moved your bracket up by increasing your mafia size, you are now weaker relative to your opponents, and are therefore going to get beat more frequently. Does that make sense? Say "yes."

In theory yes. In practice a majority of players with full mafias for their level are miserably under equipped. Which means that even 1/1 for your bottom mafia member is going to help, not hurt you. This has been my experience at every level always having had max mafia myself. Maybe times have changed though and a majority of players are equipping smarter these days?

FW-14567
FL-414

[Nicholost]

What is your per mafia attack/defense?
Att: 46.5/mafia
Def: 52.2/mafia
I have no idea if that is good or bad for lvl 86, but I haven't lost a fight or been robbed in three weeks, so I'd say I'm doing pretty well. I do know that I am short 69 vehicles as of right now. Following my own advice, I am not increasing my mafia size until I can add 69+ decent vehicles to my inventory. If I choose to increase my mafia right now, my stats would increase, but I run the risk of moving to a higher bracket and exposing myself to stronger players knowing that I am coming into battle short 69 vehicles, not to mention whatever other crappy items I'm using just to equip the additional mob.


In practice a majority of players with full mafias for their level are miserably under equipped.
I completely agree.


Which means that even 1/1 for your bottom mafia member is going to help, not hurt you.
If adding the additional mafia member does not change your bracket, then yes, it will help you and not hurt you. Since the brackets aren't clear, and IMO, are defined by the software to ensure a minimum number of rivals exist in your pool, there's no way of knowing whether adding an additional mafia member to milk just one more att/def point is going to help or hurt. Adding one member could do one of three things: have no effect on your bracket, offset the bracket upward by one, or perform a significant jump, like how federal taxes behave. We don't know. That's why I emphasize maintaining a mob size that uses up to your decent items.

[Dorian Gray]

Yeah, I guess every player has to find their own niche depending on their equipment.

[Swifty]

I reduced my mafia from 500+ to 440.

I now see rivals with as few as 38 mafia.

No, that is not a typo. 38, not 380.

[Caleb]

I reduced my mafia from 500+ to 440.

I now see rivals with as few as 38 mafia.

How high up do you see and what's your current level?

[whocareswhatmynameis]

How many mafia should you have?

as many as your equipment allows.

ideal is 500 for lvl 100+, 5 times level for lower levels.

[Swifty]

I am level 131, and I see 126 to 135.

I have 440 mafia, and I see 38 to 500.

[Caleb]

OK, so you're still seeing the max-level mafia players, but now you can also see players much lower. Did you happen to notice before you started reducing mafia what the smallest size mafia you were seeing was at that point?

[Swifty]

When I was at 500+, I was seeing down to 470.

I reduced my mafia 10 at a time, and it had a gradual decrease until I hit 440, then a huge decrease.

[Thinks]

Word on the street is that, only the cool kids have over 1,000 members in their mafia. I also heard that this Sunday at 3:17 PM, anyone with over 1,000 mafia members will have a little green leprechaun dance across their screen in playful manner.... Could just be a rumor though. ;)

[Alice]

When you get to high enough level that you can be seen by people 15+ levels above you, having a small mafia may well shield you against some or even all of those attacks.

and exactly which level is that? I'm 97 and still +-1

[Swifty]

There is no exact level, it depends on group dynamics. It changes as people level up.

But just to give you a specific example, when I was level 123, I was attacked by a 138.

[Alice]

There is no exact level, it depends on group dynamics. It changes as people level up.

But just to give you a specific example, when I was level 123, I was attacked by a 138.

Thanks, I'm aiming for 115