Baiting

[G Wiz]

What do you guys think about the baiting tactic which is when you leave a sum of money on hand to lure in rivals to attack you in hopes of charlie sheening (winning)? I kno you get exp from background fights won, but what other gains are there?
Thanks.

[Anubis]

I leave upto 30k on hand (level 89) to clock up wins but mainly to save the 10% loss, the money usually finds a good cause via upgrading or buying weapons for the next map mission im on. I also rather ppl use their stamina on attacking me and losing over robbing my buildings as some of them are quite high income, and ofcourse its much easier to rob then it is to attack. Even with high defence im having robs get through which annoys me.

[2Legit]

I sometimes leave $1 buck and ppl still get lured and attack me. I guess money is in desperation need. But most of the time, instead of taking that 1 dollar I end up winning with much higher stats than me. Must be luck, i guess pennies aren't the only considered the lucky ones :D

[Popeye The Sailor Man]

Yeah I keep cash on me partly to save on the 10% normally get up to 500k and then bank or spend it... Dont want to tempt fate but I early ever lose but when I reach 80 - 85 I won't keep money on me since higher levels will begin to boss me around

[whocareswhatmynameis]

being risk averse, i rarely leave cash on hand. my motto is: "in bank we trust!".

[Mb Tnk]

being risk averse, i rarely leave cash on hand. my motto is: "in bank we trust!".

Ditto, I think I'm strong, but I know someone else out there is stronger, always best to bank, all the time.

[procsyzarc]

I love it when people do this it seems a lot of gold buyers do it but I still usally beat them and make a fortune.

Do people actually inspect people before attacking through? Personally i find it just takes to long and just attack every person on the rival list then refresh and do the next list if one has a lot of money then I attack them the 8 times or what ever it is

[Royal Flush]

One benefit is people that attack with cash on hand. Had one guy attack & I got $3,500. I net about a grand or two each day from leaving cash on hand ... They must be thinking "That 1 million just looks too tasty, so what if he has three times my attack in defence maybe I'll get lucky" lol.

[Cooz]

One benefit is people that attack with cash on hand. Had one guy attack & I got $3,500. I net about a grand or two each day from leaving cash on hand ... They must be thinking "That 1 million just looks too tasty, so what if he has three times my attack in defence maybe I'll get lucky" lol.

Agree completely...this is a two-way street though. There are certain buildings at certain levels that I rob regardless of stats. There is such a heavy weighting on the attacker, and I have enough stamina that I can take those risks. If I see someone who has a million dollars on their person, I think: A.) It seems absolutely no worse than a 2/5 chance, and that would bank me one round of 8 hour buildings, all for just two losses. B.) He obviously makes a bleep ton of money, so even if he revenges the hell out of me, I'm still going to come out way ahead. C.) Since I'm very likely not the only person with that kind of a mentality, I may not even get hit back at all.

It's well-worth the risk. Because of that, I bank my money. It only takes one attack to lose out on what you would lose if you banked it, and you have the potential of losing 40 percent of it by leaving it there.

What does it mean to me to lose? Nothing. It means a helluva lot (about 190k) if I win 2/5.

[khung003]

being risk averse, i rarely leave cash on hand. my motto is: "in bank we trust!".

I sometimes got 2M on hand, I thought about that, it's ok to lose 200k for bank, but if someone got 10M on hand, should think again.

Currently the max loot for pvp is 30k, 10 times max 300k, and after 10 attacks, you are untouchable for hours. If you send 10M to bank, you lose 1M immediately.

Currently there are few guys attack me, and it's only 50/50 win, because of that I would never deposit 10M on hand (if I could collect that money) to the bank.

Just see one guy have 29M on hand in my rival list, if he deposit -> lose 2.9M, keep it,lose about 1M/day.

[G Wiz]

Interesting ideas guys

[Anubis]

So is there no way you can have enough defence to stop people winning or robbing at all? I know there will always be people with attack high enough, but I always presumed if you raised your mafia and building defence high enough (I know when and how each is used too) it limits the amount of ppl that can touch you.



Yeah I keep cash on me partly to save on the 10% normally get up to 500k and then bank or spend it... Dont want to tempt fate but I early ever lose but when I reach 80 - 85 I won't keep money on me since higher levels will begin to boss me around

I'm currently lvl90, keep meaning to stop and buff up but plowing through jobs is quite addictive and my att/mafia with 450 at 90 is 29.32 so its not all that bad, but i'm yet to see levels higher than me or come and rob me. Not sure when thats going to start.

[Cooz]

So is there no way you can have enough defence to stop people winning or robbing at all? I know there will always be people with attack high enough, but I always presumed if you raised your mafia and building defence high enough (I know when and how each is used too) it limits the amount of ppl that can touch you.

I'm currently lvl90, keep meaning to stop and buff up but plowing through jobs is quite addictive and my att/mafia with 450 at 90 is 29.32 so its not all that bad, but i'm yet to see levels higher than me or come and rob me. Not sure when thats going to start.

I'm kind of in the same boat as you, like I said earlier, and I've heard all the same horror stories about how guys beat the tar out of you on an hourly basis at the higher levels. What I've found (20 or so levels below you) is there are more guys who are stronger than me than there were 15 or so levels ago, but there are still plenty of 4000 def guys around. If guys are going for fight streaks and whatever, I'm not a real logical target for them.

I see a direct correlation between how strong they are and the income they produce. If they're that strong, they're not really bothering to rob me. If they need to rob, they aren't that strong, and I'll kick their asses.

[Anubis]

After the streak missions are completed, the game just becomes a robbing free-for-all. All the decent respect buildings are targeted and if you have some high money buildings in your hood you just become a major target. That kinda motivates you to push your building defence to high levels. I havn't upgraded a money building in over 10 levels now. If its all in vain though I guess i'll stop buffing my building defence.

[Cooz]

After the streak missions are completed, the game just becomes a robbing free-for-all. All the decent respect buildings are targeted and if you have some high money buildings in your hood you just become a major target. That kinda motivates you to push your building defence to high levels. I havn't upgraded a money building in over 10 levels now. If its all in vain though I guess i'll stop buffing my building defence.

I'm almost done with the streaks, and I've got an expansion underway with one more money building upgrade and creation in progress. When that's done, it's all defense buildings and upgrades. I like where I am now, but I came across this one dude who had over 19k defense, and decided that's what I want to do next. Eh, why not?

[whocareswhatmynameis]

I sometimes got 2M on hand, I thought about that, it's ok to lose 200k for bank, but if someone got 10M on hand, should think again.

Currently the max loot for pvp is 30k, 10 times max 300k, and after 10 attacks, you are untouchable for hours. If you send 10M to bank, you lose 1M immediately.

Currently there are few guys attack me, and it's only 50/50 win, because of that I would never deposit 10M on hand (if I could collect that money) to the bank.

Just see one guy have 29M on hand in my rival list, if he deposit -> lose 2.9M, keep it,lose about 1M/day.

that's an interesting observation. i never thought of that. unfortunately, i'm months away (if i keep playing) from collecting tens of millions of dollars. so for now, i'm stuck with using the bank. :)

[Mb Tnk]

From what I have seen of the actual cycle refresh (from when you can attack a player again) is closer to 30-40mins, not hours, and with this refresh, by the time your woke up from sleep, you would be robbed blind, best to always bank.

[G Wiz]

I had 15k on hand for over 24 hours and no one attacked me. Had 15200+ defense tho

[Anubis]

Most the people don't know the difference between attacking a rival in their hood and attackinga rival from your hood. If they did I reackon I would lose a fair amount of cash from fights.

[Cooz]

that's an interesting observation. i never thought of that. unfortunately, i'm months away (if i keep playing) from collecting tens of millions of dollars. so for now, i'm stuck with using the bank. :)

Yeah, I agree. There is definitely a point where it's not economical to use the bank - I'm sure the higher the average level in this game gets, they'll adjust downward the amount of time until you can be robbed again - but you have to bring in sick income to get to that point.

I think this post is more intended for the "average" player. It would take me three days of perfect collection to get $1 million, and I couldn't afford to keep that much cash on me. That 10 percent is a price I have to pay in the long run.

[Cooz]

Most the people don't know the difference between attacking a rival in their hood and attackinga rival from your hood.

What do you mean? Attacking someone vs. defending from someone else's attack?

[Certes]

Anubis is apparently under the mistaken impression that defense buildings only count when you attack an opponent in their own hood, and that they are defending with only their mafia defense if you attack them from your own hood (aka the Rivals screen).

This is incorrect. Their stats are the same regardless of where you attack them from.

Building defense counts during ALL attacks. DISREGARD THIS STATEMENT

[Mb Tnk]

....
This is incorrect. Building defense counts during ALL attacks.

Can you tell us how they count in PvP fights, and please do not quote what CC Mark posted, that info has already been made false with the PvP screen stats.

[Certes]

Crap. I was going to have a good answer, then I went and "checked my work".

I just attacked someone with 20-25 Missle Turrets and they apparently didn't add into his score whatsoever. His profile defense shows about 3500 more than the fight screen defense did.

So.....scratch the quote "Building defense counts during ALL attacks". Unless this ONE guy is somehow the exception to the rule (doubtful), I honestly don't know how they add.

However, his stats were identical when attacking him from both my hood and his hood, so I at least know that part of what I was trying to say is correct....

Back to the drawing board...

[whocareswhatmynameis]

Can you tell us how they count in PvP fights, and please do not quote what CC Mark posted, that info has already been made false with the PvP screen stats.

i don't see why CC Mark would go to great lengths to mislead us. just because defense building stats are not displayed on PvP screen doesn't mean they are not used in fights. it would be great to get some feedback from CC Mark. he's been frequenting the forums less and less (at least he's not posting as much as he did before).

[Mb Tnk]

I "think" he is not here as often due to the "Modern War" beta. I do not think he is misleading us, I do think he is leaving out lots of information.

For example, if you spreadsheet out ALL of your info, including def buildings, etc, and add in rules to add up def values for PvP and robbings (i.e. Half the players items, plus full static defense values). You will see that your attack total is absolutly correct, BUT the def values (for both) is all over the place. To see what they calculate as your actual def value for PvP fights you have 2 sources of info, the PvP stats screen and the player defense goals (those 2 seem to always be equal). In my case I have 1600 point difference from my spreadsheet and the 2 values I mention above.... now where the hell is that coming from. I don`t see it change when I upgrade my building defense so... why the huge difference.....

[khung003]

have you guys seen a thread in Technical, asking why 240 atk beat 720 def every time. Try to answer that question yourselves.

AND 1 important point you should note, those people with 240 atk points, surely at low levels and don't have many skill points to add to his stats.

[Mb Tnk]

Ever since the server update, I do not understand any of the fights anymore, and explosives have been nerfed to death... When ya think about it, the server update came a day or so just before the gold sale... hmmmm, So players who used to think they were strong are now getting hit by players much weaker than them. Who knows, we just might see another server update next week.

[jlhy]

From my experience so far defense buildings are factored in. My defense without defense buildings factored in is a little over 19k and I successfully defend against attackers who have 22-28k attack. I wouldn't be able to defend against players with that kind of attack stats if my defense buildings weren't factored in.

[khung003]

Ever since the server update, I do not understand any of the fights anymore, and explosives have been nerfed to death... When ya think about it, the server update came a day or so just before the gold sale... hmmmm, So players who used to think they were strong are now getting hit by players much weaker than them. Who knows, we just might see another server update next week.

Actually I did that since low levels, attack stronger people to earn more respect points & loot items (I used to think I can get more & stronger loot items when attack stronger people, but it's not true)

It's just simple, defense buildings don't count. - why? because at that time there were no explosives and my skill points only 1. the only explanation is defense buildings don't count.

... and yeah, many people in this forum will object that, but who cares ??? I did that before and I think low levels people can still doing that. no matter whatever they blah blah blah, things just happen.

However at higher level I can't do like that anymore, don't know what's different ?

[Mb Tnk]

Thanks Khung, "maybe" that level modfier CC Mark has always talked about starts to have more of an effect at higher levels/stats..

[procsyzarc]

I'm starting to think defence buildings don't make any diffrence too, attacked some people who have terrible stats and then go to their hood and see they have more defence in buildings than my attack yet it doesn't show when i attack them and I never lose to them

[Duke.0]

Ever since the server update, I do not understand any of the fights anymore, and explosives have been nerfed to death... When ya think about it, the server update came a day or so just before the gold sale... hmmmm, So players who used to think they were strong are now getting hit by players much weaker than them. Who knows, we just might see another server update next week.

Three days ago, i got attacked by a weaker player and lost. I was so confused as to why. I have 42 Skill Points in defense, a defense over 8,000 too.
The person that attacked me was 5000 attack.
How does 5000 attack defeat 8000 defense?
There is about 600-1000 building defense that i have, which means i have 7000 mafia defense roughly.

Still..

How does 5000 attack beat my 7000 mafia defense?

The new fight numbers make me scratch my head in confusion.

[Mb Tnk]

How does a player with an attack of 9200 rob a player with 20K total defense (13k actual rob defense).... this is what has been happening to me since the update. When I go attack a player (PvP) that has 10K pvp defense, with about 100 more mafia than me (seen on the stat screen) and loose explosives every second attack, it just does not make any bloody sense (and this is all after the server update).

[Duke.0]

How does a player with an attack of 9200 rob a player with 20K total defense (13k actual rob defense).... this is what has been happening to me since the update. When I go attack a player (PvP) that has 10K pvp defense, with about 100 more mafia than me (seen on the stat screen) and loose explosives ever second attack, it just does not make any bloody sense (and this is all after the server update).

Yes i know what you mean, i can't figure it out either.

CC Mark said :

Defense buildings > Mafia size (up to cap) > Defense items / defense skill

Source:
http://www.funzio.com/forum/showthread.php?12108-How-defense-works&p=54641&viewfull=1#post54641

Which would lead me to believe defense buildings are perhaps more important in stopping robberies then we think. In fact its the most important thing.