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Rob2
07-20-2016, 08:27 AM
Just got some interesting information. Can someone at Gree confirm or deny this?

When you end up at the same boss is your place really determined on a syn id?

An Email with this info is shown on a lot of info rooms

DjSyla
07-20-2016, 09:11 AM
Raid boss leaderboard is a joke anyway.. say we all have 50 killed from rank 1 to 10.. although its reward for Boss Level killed .. thats not right.. because all 10 teams with boss 50 bosses down.. dont get awarded for 1st... its completely UNFAIR for 1 team to get 1st prize and another to get 10th prize when they have killed EXACTLY the SAME boss.........

That needs to be fixed

Silent Assssins have NOT taken part in this event this time because the everything about it is poor... and the health insane

I hope more teams opt OUT of future events that are the same

Gungho
07-20-2016, 12:59 PM
The event is terrible, we just use free energy as it's hardly bring any value at all. Done it since the second RB. Same with HnR since last time.

MISTERFTW
07-20-2016, 01:33 PM
Just got some interesting information. Can someone at Gree confirm or deny this?

When you end up at the same boss is your place really determined on a syn id?

An Email with this info is shown on a lot of info rooms

Its very true, they wont admit to it because thats a MAJOR ToS violation with Google and iOS and that wont look too good for Gree.

Watch how quick they delete this thread

Gr3g
07-20-2016, 06:11 PM
Its very true, they wont admit to it because thats a MAJOR ToS violation with Google and iOS and that wont look too good for Gree.

Watch how quick they delete this thread
How? You should probably Read This (http://product.gree.net/us/en/terms/). How Apple and Google work is the developer adds or leaves a link to their Terms of Service which you agree to when you download the app and those terms say


Notwithstanding the foregoing, GREE reserves the right in its sole discretion to review, monitor, prohibit, edit, delete, disable access to or otherwise make unavailable any User Content (including without limitation Your Content) without notice for any reason or for no reason at any time.

and furthermore


You hereby grant to GREE an irrevocable, perpetual, transferable, fully paid-up, royalty-free, worldwide license (including the right to sublicense and assign to third party) and right to copy, reproduce, fix, adapt, modify, create derivative works from, manufacture, commercialize, publish, distribute, sell, license, sublicense, transfer, lease, transmit, publicly display, publicly perform, or provide access to electronically, broadcast, communicate to the public by telecommunication, display, perform, enter into computer memory, and use and practice, in any way, your User Content

and the ToS says it about 100 more times. You are the one buying gold, Gree dose not "force" or "trick" you to buy it therefore; there is nothing wrong with their sorting method that goes against any ToS.

So this thread won't get removed as nothing wrong happened on Gree's end.

Sandukan
07-20-2016, 07:10 PM
Raid boss leaderboard is a joke anyway.. say we all have 50 killed from rank 1 to 10.. although its reward for Boss Level killed .. thats not right.. because all 10 teams with boss 50 bosses down.. dont get awarded for 1st... its completely UNFAIR for 1 team to get 1st prize and another to get 10th prize when they have killed EXACTLY the SAME boss.........

That needs to be fixed

Silent Assssins have NOT taken part in this event this time because the everything about it is poor... and the health insane

I hope more teams opt OUT of future events that are the same
So you sitting out one event accomplishes what exactly?

Vile Lynn
07-20-2016, 07:58 PM
This is just a rumor to incite & promote somebody's agenda. That "email" is fabricated.

Ties are handled by time-stamps. First one to the top, gets 1st, etc...
For example, if the top 10 syndicates all kill 52 RBs, whichever syn killed #52 RB first, gets 1st place, and so on.
If the 11th syn kills #52, they won't bounce up in rank. They'll stay in 11th place since their kill was time-stamped after the 10th ranking syn. Make sense?

Rankings are not "predetermined" by a special syn ID.

DjSyla
07-20-2016, 11:33 PM
This is just a rumor to incite & promote somebody's agenda. That "email" is fabricated.

Ties are handled by time-stamps. First one to the top, gets 1st, etc...
For example, if the top 10 syndicates all kill 52 RBs, whichever syn killed #52 RB first, gets 1st place, and so on.
If the 11th syn kills #52, they won't bounce up in rank. They'll stay in 11th place since their kill was time-stamped after the 10th ranking syn. Make sense?

Rankings are not "predetermined" by a special syn ID.

Thats not how it works either.. we were first to 56.. then 1 team went ahead of us on 56 and 3 behind us n 56.. so... timestamp is definately not the way it works.. or we would be in 3rd place right now and we are not.. been knocked down by teams o the same kill

A TIE should be awarded for exctly that... same award for same boss killed...regardless of position on leaderboard...

DjSyla
07-20-2016, 11:33 PM
So you sitting out one event accomplishes what exactly?

Im not in sas1.. havent sat out the event

DjSyla
07-21-2016, 12:00 AM
We got to 56 first.. double negative got to 56 second.. all the rest came after.. Double negative stayed in 3rd.. we dropped to 7th... so its most definately not first come first ranked7808

We SHOULD be awarded the same prize as Double Negative... instead we get Top 10... even tho we were the first team aside from carnage... to achieve 56

DjSyla
07-21-2016, 12:17 AM
Haha... we dropped 2 more spots in last 2 minutes

Rob2
07-21-2016, 01:32 AM
I understand you want to help. But please don't say things that are not true.
People might think you speak on behave on Gree, which I know isn't true.
Your statement, as we experienced isn't true. If we kill a boss and right after that we're half way all the teams that killed the same boss it isn't the time stamp. We are above some teams who killed this boss earlier and we get behind some teams who killed it later then us.

I would like a real answer from Gree. So does the whole community.



This is just a rumor to incite & promote somebody's agenda. That "email" is fabricated.

Ties are handled by time-stamps. First one to the top, gets 1st, etc...
For example, if the top 10 syndicates all kill 52 RBs, whichever syn killed #52 RB first, gets 1st place, and so on.
If the 11th syn kills #52, they won't bounce up in rank. They'll stay in 11th place since their kill was time-stamped after the 10th ranking syn. Make sense?

Rankings are not "predetermined" by a special syn ID.

Spunk
07-21-2016, 01:43 AM
This is just a rumor to incite & promote somebody's agenda. That "email" is fabricated.

Ties are handled by time-stamps. First one to the top, gets 1st, etc...
For example, if the top 10 syndicates all kill 52 RBs, whichever syn killed #52 RB first, gets 1st place, and so on.
If the 11th syn kills #52, they won't bounce up in rank. They'll stay in 11th place since their kill was time-stamped after the 10th ranking syn. Make sense?

Rankings are not "predetermined" by a special syn ID.

Lol, you can't be serious. Do you actually think that's how it works?

MISTERFTW
07-21-2016, 04:58 AM
Once again, I sure noticed the exact order teams tied with us were in, and it matched the exact same order as team ID# list ranks

Timala
07-21-2016, 05:39 AM
This is imo one of the most boring events ever. To much xp for prizes that does nothing for my stats. My syndicate have stopped doing it for a couple of cycles and it's a nice break.

Now I don't know anything about any email but there's something wrong with the ranking and it does not have anything to do with timestamps that I know.

In the end it's just another broken event and it's up to people if they want to spend gold or not. I certainly won't :D

DjSyla
07-21-2016, 08:43 AM
Welll well well... The email i have now read.. and also has a list of tbe TOP 150 teams and ther "Unique ID" numbers... it seems to be 100% accurate what has been said in this thread... every syndicate name on the raidboss leaderboard for boss 56 killed is in the EXACT SAME order as on the syndicate ID list....

ITS TRUE

I have tried to post these pictures for you to see for yourself... for some reason... i cannot upload those 2 specific pics... and i even tried to rename them.. still will not upload to the forum

7812
7813

Timala
07-21-2016, 09:49 AM
We have sent numerous tickets about this to Gree and we have been told that the Raid Boss event works just as it's supposed to..... so yes the leaderboard is set after syndicate id and same team gets cheated for their rightfull placement event after event. And guess what nobody cares. Gree doesn't care obviously and the players keep pushing gold lol.

Rob2
07-21-2016, 11:39 AM
So now we have to use our syn ID in our recruitment adds. Look we have a better number then most of our opponents so we get a bigger prize then them! Lol. Yeah. That would make a great impression ��

jmeijer
07-21-2016, 04:13 PM
This is just a rumor to incite & promote somebody's agenda. That "email" is fabricated.

Ties are handled by time-stamps. First one to the top, gets 1st, etc...
For example, if the top 10 syndicates all kill 52 RBs, whichever syn killed #52 RB first, gets 1st place, and so on.
If the 11th syn kills #52, they won't bounce up in rank. They'll stay in 11th place since their kill was time-stamped after the 10th ranking syn. Make sense?

Rankings are not "predetermined" by a special syn ID.Have you just made this up? Or are you trying to be funny?

MISTERFTW
07-21-2016, 09:31 PM
How? You should probably Read This (http://product.gree.net/us/en/terms/). How Apple and Google work is the developer adds or leaves a link to their Terms of Service which you agree to when you download the app and those terms say



and furthermore



and the ToS says it about 100 more times. You are the one buying gold, Gree dose not "force" or "trick" you to buy it therefore; there is nothing wrong with their sorting method that goes against any ToS.

So this thread won't get removed as nothing wrong happened on Gree's end.

They dont force you to buy gold, correct, but you cant falsely lead players into believing that they can achieve the deciding factor of a tie breaker by spending more money to drop higher level bosses faster, or by dropping a higher amount of total bosses killed, when it has already been predetermined by the developer as to who will ALWAYS rank higher in a tie. That's Fraud. No matter how quick, how many, or simply how much gold you waste in this RB event, there is no way to change the outcome when its determined by syndicate ID# as the deciding factor. It will always be determined who wins the tie, simply by a teams ID #, that has already been a proven fact, and again, thats Fraud.

Gr3g
07-21-2016, 11:45 PM
They dont force you to buy gold, correct, but you cant falsely lead players into believing that they can achieve the deciding factor of a tie breaker by spending more money to drop higher level bosses faster, or by dropping a higher amount of total bosses killed, when it has already been predetermined by the developer as to who will ALWAYS rank higher in a tie. That's Fraud. No matter how quick, how many, or simply how much gold you waste in this RB event, there is no way to change the outcome when its determined by syndicate ID# as the deciding factor. It will always be determined who wins the tie, simply by a teams ID #, that has already been a proven fact, and again, thats Fraud.

No it's not, Gree can do whatever they please and change what they said or did at anytime for any reason without telling players, It says so in the ToS that you agreed to and you don't have a say other wise. It's not fraud when you signed all your rights away. Again you are the one responsible for your money, you spend it, you buy gold, you use it when you want to, so when you spend that gold on a health refill you know for 100% that it's going to refill your health "fraud" would be like, having that not do what it says it does. So more to my point, spending "real money" on this game is no way connected to the ranking system. The gold used is for health refills not ranking and yes, in the end using health refills would help you kill higher bosses but isn't fraud.

I would like you to read this (http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/195806/chasing_the_whale_examining_the_.php?print=1) it's a good article on freemium games it basically shows and tells how people lost money and things developers did to take it. What I'm saying is you (The Player) have nothing to say or complain about because everything Gree is doing is legal and fine you gave them that right so no matter what goes down, Gree is 100% free from any and everything considered wrong doing. There is no fraud, no breaking of the Google or Apple ToS, nothing, nada, YOU ARE DEAD TO RIGHTS. Companies have been doing it for years and get away with it and there isn't one thing you can do either.


believing that they can achieve the deciding factor of a tie breaker by spending more money to drop higher level bosses faster, or by dropping a higher amount of total bosses killed, when it has already been predetermined by the developer as to who will ALWAYS rank higher in a tie.
Its simple, don't tie. Gree left you that option therefore; it's not "fraud" and definitely not falsely leading players into believing that they can achieve the deciding factor of a tie breaker by spending more money because there is a way to always rank higher than other syndicates so even if this was to get "official" it is considered "fair" by all parties. (And that doesn't mean the players of Crime City) I know all this because I was once there and thought people couldn't do that either but you have to read the fine print it's all there.

On a side note the only reason for posting is when you said "MAJOR ToS violation with Google and iOS" as a fellow developer (Not working for Gree) I dislike comments like that, they only cause panic and stir the pot when that isn't or shouldn't even be the case. It's a low blow, like people with the whole PEWDIEPIE "SCANDAL"!! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JqJDRkKlt8) To quote him "it's right there, right there" the rules and evidence were always available on Gree's rights and they never stepped out of them. I don't care that the rankings are unfair or unjust to some people, life is unfair but you learn to deal with it and or move on. If you want to accuse Gree of something don't use words like "fraud" or "violation" that just isn't the case. If I remember correctly raid boss has been "unfair" for months now (since the change in January) and what if Gree said "Hey! the older your syndicate is the lower you'll rank in the case of a tie. We think this is a good idea because the underdog never gets a chance. Here's 100 gold or a refund of health packs for your trouble." like they basically did for the whole Epic Boss health glitch not too long ago, which by the way they did what they wanted and never changed it back. You'd most likely be jumping or making new syndicates to rank higher in a tie for every Raid Boss. You got your crappy reward, then what? huh? what would you all do? you all would be complaining about something else like too many IP mods and how people spent so much money on those...oh wait...that already happened, was that fraud too? Those are my views like them or not I won't get offended but it's dirty pool when stuff like that is being said when the main purpose is to hurt a company or developer. I'm sorry but that is something you don't ever want to be on the receiving end of.

DjSyla
07-22-2016, 12:41 AM
No it's not, Gree can do whatever they please and change what they said or did at anytime for any reason without telling players, It says so in the ToS that you agreed to and you don't have a say other wise. It's not fraud when you signed all your rights away. Again you are the one responsible for your money, you spend it, you buy gold, you use it when you want to, so when you spend that gold on a health refill you know for 100% that it's going to refill your health "fraud" would be like, having that not do what it says it does. So more to my point, spending "real money" on this game is no way connected to the ranking system. The gold used is for health refills not ranking and yes, in the end using health refills would help you kill higher bosses but isn't fraud.

I would like you to read this (http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/195806/chasing_the_whale_examining_the_.php?print=1) it's a good article on freemium games it basically shows and tells how people lost money and things developers did to take it. What I'm saying is you (The Player) have nothing to say or complain about because everything Gree is doing is legal and fine you gave them that right so no matter what goes down, Gree is 100% free from any and everything considered wrong doing. There is no fraud, no breaking of the Google or Apple ToS, nothing, nada, YOU ARE DEAD TO RIGHTS. Companies have been doing it for years and get away with it and there isn't one thing you can do either.


Its simple, don't tie. Gree left you that option therefore; it's not "fraud" and definitely not falsely leading players into believing that they can achieve the deciding factor of a tie breaker by spending more money because there is a way to always rank higher than other syndicates so even if this was to get "official" it is considered "fair" by all parties. (And that doesn't mean the players of Crime City) I know all this because I was once there and thought people couldn't do that either but you have to read the fine print it's all there.

On a side note the only reason for posting is when you said "MAJOR ToS violation with Google and iOS" as a fellow developer (Not working for Gree) I dislike comments like that, they only cause panic and stir the pot when that isn't or shouldn't even be the case. It's a low blow, like people with the whole PEWDIEPIE "SCANDAL"!! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JqJDRkKlt8) To quote him "it's right there, right there" the rules and evidence were always available on Gree's rights and they never stepped out of them. I don't care that the rankings are unfair or unjust to some people, life is unfair but you learn to deal with it and or move on. If you want to accuse Gree of something don't use words like "fraud" or "violation" that just isn't the case. If I remember correctly raid boss has been "unfair" for months now (since the change in January) and what if Gree said "Hey! the older your syndicate is the lower you'll rank in the case of a tie. We think this is a good idea because the underdog never gets a chance. Here's 100 gold or a refund of health packs for your trouble." like they basically did for the whole Epic Boss health glitch not too long ago, which by the way they did what they wanted and never changed it back. You'd most likely be jumping or making new syndicates to rank higher in a tie for every Raid Boss. You got your crappy reward, then what? huh? what would you all do? you all would be complaining about something else like too many IP mods and how people spent so much money on those...oh wait...that already happened, was that fraud too? Those are my views like them or not I won't get offended but it's dirty pool when stuff like that is being said when the main purpose is to hurt a company or developer. I'm sorry but that is something you don't ever want to be on the receiving end of.

Hmmmm may i ask what games u made so i can try them please?? I still think u work at GREE ;p... lol
He is correct on his point that we should not have a Predetermind rank system based on a syndicate id.. no matter who u r, gamer or developer, thats is not fair gameplay... and thats all that matters

The whole points of highest level boss killed leaderboard is just what it says.. you kill the same level boss as another team, gold or no gold... you SHOULD be awarded same... not something less because preset ID

Cant argue with that.. nobody can

MISTERFTW
07-22-2016, 01:09 AM
No it's not, Gree can do whatever they please and change what they said or did at anytime for any reason without telling players, It says so in the ToS that you agreed to and you don't have a say other wise. It's not fraud when you signed all your rights away. Again you are the one responsible for your money, you spend it, you buy gold, you use it when you want to, so when you spend that gold on a health refill you know for 100% that it's going to refill your health "fraud" would be like, having that not do what it says it does. So more to my point, spending "real money" on this game is no way connected to the ranking system. The gold used is for health refills not ranking and yes, in the end using health refills would help you kill higher bosses but isn't fraud.

I would like you to read this (http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/195806/chasing_the_whale_examining_the_.php?print=1) it's a good article on freemium games it basically shows and tells how people lost money and things developers did to take it. What I'm saying is you (The Player) have nothing to say or complain about because everything Gree is doing is legal and fine you gave them that right so no matter what goes down, Gree is 100% free from any and everything considered wrong doing. There is no fraud, no breaking of the Google or Apple ToS, nothing, nada, YOU ARE DEAD TO RIGHTS. Companies have been doing it for years and get away with it and there isn't one thing you can do either.


Its simple, don't tie. Gree left you that option therefore; it's not "fraud" and definitely not falsely leading players into believing that they can achieve the deciding factor of a tie breaker by spending more money because there is a way to always rank higher than other syndicates so even if this was to get "official" it is considered "fair" by all parties. (And that doesn't mean the players of Crime City) I know all this because I was once there and thought people couldn't do that either but you have to read the fine print it's all there.

On a side note the only reason for posting is when you said "MAJOR ToS violation with Google and iOS" as a fellow developer (Not working for Gree) I dislike comments like that, they only cause panic and stir the pot when that isn't or shouldn't even be the case. It's a low blow, like people with the whole PEWDIEPIE "SCANDAL"!! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JqJDRkKlt8) To quote him "it's right there, right there" the rules and evidence were always available on Gree's rights and they never stepped out of them. I don't care that the rankings are unfair or unjust to some people, life is unfair but you learn to deal with it and or move on. If you want to accuse Gree of something don't use words like "fraud" or "violation" that just isn't the case. If I remember correctly raid boss has been "unfair" for months now (since the change in January) and what if Gree said "Hey! the older your syndicate is the lower you'll rank in the case of a tie. We think this is a good idea because the underdog never gets a chance. Here's 100 gold or a refund of health packs for your trouble." like they basically did for the whole Epic Boss health glitch not too long ago, which by the way they did what they wanted and never changed it back. You'd most likely be jumping or making new syndicates to rank higher in a tie for every Raid Boss. You got your crappy reward, then what? huh? what would you all do? you all would be complaining about something else like too many IP mods and how people spent so much money on those...oh wait...that already happened, was that fraud too? Those are my views like them or not I won't get offended but it's dirty pool when stuff like that is being said when the main purpose is to hurt a company or developer. I'm sorry but that is something you don't ever want to be on the receiving end of.

Hmmm, maybe you should do your homework, cuz according to Amex and Google, both are investigating Gree as of now

Timala
07-22-2016, 03:15 AM
Hmmm, maybe you should do your homework, cuz according to Amex and Google, both are investigating Gree as of now

I heard they been under investigation for years now lol. Bottom line, it is what it is. Spend don't spend Gree has made sure they don't have to do anything, either compensate or change it. The event works as intended and it's up to the players to decide if they want to play or not.

crime cow
07-22-2016, 08:50 AM
There are still people confused on the gold issue? First, if you spend gold with Gree you should know by now that you are taking a risk and should expect to be disappointed. That being said, Gree's TOS doesn't mean anything if you feel like you've been defrauded. If they promise something or state that an event works a certain way and it doesn't perform as advertised, then you have every right to feel like you've been scammed and should expect a refund. If Gree won't give you your money back or refund your gold, then I think everyone knows there is a second step you can take and they will decide if you are warranted a refund. I would think however, that once you've gone this route you would learn you're lesson and stop buying gold as there is such a thing as 'caveat emptor.' IMO they need to clarify in the rules the way ties are handled for RB or they need to give everyone that kills the same number of bosses the same rank.

DjSyla
07-22-2016, 02:02 PM
There are still people confused on the gold issue? First, if you spend gold with Gree you should know by now that you are taking a risk and should expect to be disappointed. That being said, Gree's TOS doesn't mean anything if you feel like you've been defrauded. If they promise something or state that an event works a certain way and it doesn't perform as advertised, then you have every right to feel like you've been scammed and should expect a refund. If Gree won't give you your money back or refund your gold, then I think everyone knows there is a second step you can take and they will decide if you are warranted a refund. I would think however, that once you've gone this route you would learn you're lesson and stop buying gold as there is such a thing as 'caveat emptor.' IMO they need to clarify in the rules the way ties are handled for RB or they need to give everyone that kills the same number of bosses the same rank.

Well said.. especially the bottom part since that was the thread lol

Gr3g
07-22-2016, 02:11 PM
Hmmm, maybe you should do your homework, cuz according to Amex and Google, both are investigating Gree as of now

Where are you getting this? Amex? The only one I know of is American Express. You should do you homework, if your app is under investigation by Google Play they disable you from uploading new app versions and or remove the old version until the issue is fixed. If it's an overall investigation to all of Gree's apps they'd disabled the whole account until the issue is resolved. The last thing on Gree was in March of 2016 and that was a CPSC Civil Penalty Settlement but that wasn't the same Gree. 'Gree Electric' and 'GREE, INC.' are two different things so yeah. The last thing on Gree, INC was them shutting down in Vancouver and in the UK somewhere.

Ostomachion
07-22-2016, 02:33 PM
Hey All,

Thank you for the lively discussion. You can find the Dev Teams response to how Raid Boss leaderboard ties are handled here: http://forums.gree.net/showthread.php?121743-Raid-Boss-Ranking-Determination-Clarification. I will be closing this thread.