How is it possible?

[andy2]

... To have more deploy points in FL than another team... yet have that other team win every single node?

Gree this has happened to us many times, it seems as if our deploys are not counting on the node we are deploying them to and we are getting cheated out of hundreds of millions of points... that we spent money on. Am I missing anything here? This is not mathematically possible based upon how Gree has told us the game works. My entire team has sent in tickets to gree and we receive either no response or something completely unrelated. Where is the support? How is this possible?


To be perfectly clear I am talking about an example like this

Scores


Team
Deploy Points
Control Points


1
300,000,000
0


2
270,000,000
200,000,000


3
0
0



How can the team who deployed 300m not win a single node? Gree staff... I have plenty of pics if you want to actually explain how any of this is mathmatically possible.

[Delicious]

Multiplier. Ancient discussion point.

[Tony81]

Multiplier. Ancient discussion point.

If all teams score over 12m, your multiplier comment is nonsense. And multiplier only affects the deploy points so it's a moot point.

I've asked people this for months and people give me answers that make absolutely no sense. It's like winning a basketball game 110-100 yet you got outscored all 4 quarters. I'd love to see for once a logical answer to this.

[sstuutss]

I would expect the same answer you got last time.
Though if I were spending money I damn sure keep asking. Good luck

[Cannot Connect To Server]

read the instructions.

its perfectly clearly written in ChinEnglituaniAmericArabIaliaNoOneAtGreeKnows.

[Stellaman]

Andy I know how it is possible, i will look for you on GM and pm you.

[andy2]

Multiplier is not a valid reason, deploy points are multiplied. It doesn't matter what units are used to get to that total when comparing deploy points it is apples to apples. I am still waiting to hear any valid explanation for this.

[Chaos0882]

Although the multiplier does factor into the points system as a whole the system is flawed. I noticed that especially when you are in the first battle as you drop units into a node you have to do it slowly. At least on droid. If you dump your units it will not give you the correct amount of rewards. Last front line I dropped 9 mill right at the beginning and only got like 4 rewards of the 25. Needless to say I was pissed. This time around I would drop just enough to get each reward one at a time. Very time consuming but at least my units were not wasted. Same issue in dropping a ton of units at once just for points.

[winners_win]

I may be wrong but I'll give it a go... if you spread deploys out over all 5 nodes and not own those nodes when the battle expires you don't get the control points. In theory you could most certainly have more deploy points spread thin on all 5 nodes means the other 2 teams take all your deploys points into their control points.
Long and short of it.... get a better strategy for FL.
Hope that cleared it up and if I'm wrong please someone correct it to help this player.

[Loiner]

If your point is more than the other two teams combine (as your example shows the this is a fair question, if on the other hand you are comparing it to just one of the team's then it is possible to deploy most but still end up with no nodes

[andy2]

I may be wrong but I'll give it a go... if you spread deploys out over all 5 nodes and not own those nodes when the battle expires you don't get the control points. In theory you could most certainly have more deploy points spread thin on all 5 nodes means the other 2 teams take all your deploys points into their control points.
Long and short of it.... get a better strategy for FL.
Hope that cleared it up and if I'm wrong please someone correct it to help this player.

Yes that would be very possible and true IF Both Team2 AND Team3 won nodes. Which would look something like this:


Sample Battle 1


Node
Team 1 Points on node
Team 2 Points on node
Team 3 Points on node


1
10,000,000
0
12,000,000


2
10,000,000
0
12,000,000

3
75,000,000
85,000,000
0

4
10,000,000
0
12,000,000

5
10,000,000
0
12,000,000



Grand Totals:
Team 1: 115,000,000 (0 nodes won)
Team 2: 85,000,000 (1 node won)
Team 3: 48,000,000 (4 nodes won)

Those scores would be the control points. And I fully get that in order to make those into deploy points you would apply the multiplier.


HOWEVER, the situation I am talking about is where Team 1 has the MOST deploy points in a battle (Higher than Team 2 AND Higher than Team 3). Yet Team 2 wins EVERY SINGLE node. This situation is not explainable by math, and only a gree glitch. I have many screenshots of this happening.

[sstuutss]

I have many screenshots of this happening.
Yet you keep tapping. You know what they say about people that repeat the same actions expecting a difference result? :)

Then crickets will get you every time.

[andy2]

Yet you keep tapping. You know what they say about people that repeat the same actions expecting a difference result? :)

Then crickets will get you every time.

Yes we are all stupid for continuing on playing, however, that has nothing to do with this thread, which is actually trying to elicit a serious answer from the company about a potentially major game issue.

[Loser]

I may be wrong but I'll give it a go... if you spread deploys out over all 5 nodes and not own those nodes when the battle expires you don't get the control points. In theory you could most certainly have more deploy points spread thin on all 5 nodes means the other 2 teams take all your deploys points into their control points.
Long and short of it.... get a better strategy for FL.
Hope that cleared it up and if I'm wrong please someone correct it to help this player.

This is the correct answer.

[andy2]

This is the correct answer.

If you would pay attention to my description you would see this is not the case I am describing at all. One team wins all 5 of the nodes and that team has less deploy points than us. Simply mathematically not possible.

I am still waiting for any sort of Gree response on this either to a ticket or on forum. I see you have time to respond to other issues, but not this one?

[DEWIN NUTTIN]

If you would pay attention to my description you would see this is not the case I am describing at all. One team wins all 5 of the nodes and that team has less deploy points than us. Simply mathematically not possible.

I am still waiting for any sort of Gree response on this either to a ticket or on forum. I see you have time to respond to other issues, but not this one?

The answer is one of two:
1 - They don't know
2 - They can't say

From what I've been told, 2 is the answer, because if all were known, a ruckus would soon become an insurrection.

DADT - don't ask, don't tell (Bill Clinton created it, used in across the DoD for years.)

[Edbl79]

Andy if you have screen shots showing it please do so. Show a node and the final score. I don't think you've said anything at this point that reveals a problem. And as no one has really replied in support of what you have described I would venture a guess that there really isn't a problem. A lot is screwed up but if there's one thing that is true when it is screwed up there is no shortage of people to support it. Right now you are only one. I'm not knocking you, I think you and/or your team misunderstand how this event works.

[andy2]

Andy if you have screen shots showing it please do so. Show a node and the final score. I don't think you've said anything at this point that reveals a problem. And as no one has really replied in support of what you have described I would venture a guess that there really isn't a problem. A lot is screwed up but if there's one thing that is true when it is screwed up there is no shortage of people to support it. Right now you are only one. I'm not knocking you, I think you and/or your team misunderstand how this event works.

My team always gets t15 or better FL and has a great understanding of the event, and have talked to many people on the other t15 teams and none of them understand it. I assure you is not our understand of the game that is the issue. It is simple math.

If Team 1 wins every node that means they had more points on each node than Team 2. Therefor it is impossible for Team 2 to have more overall points. Yet that is what the scores are showing.

[ibeweary]

Maybe your team had pending deploys when the battle ended and you did not control any nodes. But your pending deploys counted toward your overall points. Most events like WD and Leader Board get locked early before the event actually ends but you still get the points. Frontline might be the same. Droid deploys stay in pending for while before being deployed.

[sbs2716g]

This is gree's maths. Nothing is wrong even when a 2bil attack guy can won against 50 bil defense.

[andy2]

Maybe your team had pending deploys when the battle ended and you did not control any nodes. But your pending deploys counted toward your overall points. Most events like WD and Leader Board get locked early before the event actually ends but you still get the points. Frontline might be the same. Droid deploys stay in pending for while before being deployed.

It is likely something like this, but it occurs for more than just the end score screenshot. I have watched our team deploy on a single node while another team deploys on that node and the third team does nothing. our deploy points go up at a rate higher than the opposing team, yet their points on the node grow faster than ours. That would mean all of our deploys are just stuck in pending while none of theirs are.

[sstuutss]

Standard gree responce so far 'ignore it and it will go away'

[SGT Rud]

It is likely something like this, but it occurs for more than just the end score screenshot. I have watched our team deploy on a single node while another team deploys on that node and the third team does nothing. our deploy points go up at a rate higher than the opposing team, yet their points on the node grow faster than ours. That would mean all of our deploys are just stuck in pending while none of theirs are.

I fully agree with this. I've seen some kinda rules from Gree on their website or something about a special "hidden" bonus during deploys on the nodes. While this wont effect the teams overall points on the bottom left, it will effect the points going onto a node. But I don't think it has to do with deploys pending. I have seen deploys get stuck in pending, but nothing that effects end scores.

For Instance -
If only 2 teams are deploying on the node, then you have Team 1 in the lead, and Team 2 thats not. Then Team 2 only needs to do 1/2 +1 point more to have more points than the total points on the board. But, the special "hidden" modiifier going into deploys on that node. It isnt adding to either teams points, it just adding to the node itself. Meaning you still have to do 1/2 of whats on the node. You could even do more than the other team, but if its not 1/2, you wont take it.

Just my theory though. Have been looking at this for a while now. And yes, I've seen the issue in the OP's post bunches of times. Maybe Gree will shed some light on it, maybe not. Either or, I'm confident enough in my theory.
https://games.gree-support.net/hc/en-us/articles/204161930-Frontline-FAQs

My theory might not be what they are talking about on here, but I think it is, and there is calculations in the background running that we cant see. I dont think the math is as cut and dry as we think it is.

[fatbodychris]

I fully agree with this. I've seen some kinda rules from Gree on their website or something about a special "hidden" bonus during deploys on the nodes. While this wont effect the teams overall points on the bottom left, it will effect the points going onto a node. But I don't think it has to do with deploys pending. I have seen deploys get stuck in pending, but nothing that effects end scores.

For Instance -
If only 2 teams are deploying on the node, then you have Team 1 in the lead, and Team 2 thats not. Then Team 2 only needs to do 1/2 +1 point more to have more points than the total points on the board. But, the special "hidden" modiifier going into deploys on that node. It isnt adding to either teams points, it just adding to the node itself. Meaning you still have to do 1/2 of whats on the node. You could even do more than the other team, but if its not 1/2, you wont take it.

Just my theory though. Have been looking at this for a while now. And yes, I've seen the issue in the OP's post bunches of times. Maybe Gree will shed some light on it, maybe not. Either or, I'm confident enough in my theory.
https://games.gree-support.net/hc/en-us/articles/204161930-Frontline-FAQs

My theory might not be what they are talking about on here, but I think it is, and there is calculations in the background running that we cant see. I dont think the math is as cut and dry as we think it is.

Just read the link you posted and this was in there---- " The deploys of rivals at the same node will increase the modifier, but ultimately, the faction that has the most deploys to a node wins the node and gains all of the control points."

So this is basically saying you can have Team 1 with 10,000 gunners on a node and Team 2 has 11,000 tanks, team 2 will win the node? Did I read that right?

[Ozymandias]

Just read the link you posted and this was in there---- " The deploys of rivals at the same node will increase the modifier, but ultimately, the faction that has the most deploys to a node wins the node and gains all of the control points."

So this is basically saying you can have Team 1 with 10,000 gunners on a node and Team 2 has 11,000 tanks, team 2 will win the node? Did I read that right?

I'm sure they mean deploy points.. The node-level modifier is a weird one though, that I hadn't spotted before.

[Ozymandias]

I fully agree with this. I've seen some kinda rules from Gree on their website or something about a special "hidden" bonus during deploys on the nodes. While this wont effect the teams overall points on the bottom left, it will effect the points going onto a node. But I don't think it has to do with deploys pending. I have seen deploys get stuck in pending, but nothing that effects end scores.

For Instance -
If only 2 teams are deploying on the node, then you have Team 1 in the lead, and Team 2 thats not. Then Team 2 only needs to do 1/2 +1 point more to have more points than the total points on the board. But, the special "hidden" modiifier going into deploys on that node. It isnt adding to either teams points, it just adding to the node itself. Meaning you still have to do 1/2 of whats on the node. You could even do more than the other team, but if its not 1/2, you wont take it.

Just my theory though. Have been looking at this for a while now. And yes, I've seen the issue in the OP's post bunches of times. Maybe Gree will shed some light on it, maybe not. Either or, I'm confident enough in my theory.
https://games.gree-support.net/hc/en-us/articles/204161930-Frontline-FAQs

My theory might not be what they are talking about on here, but I think it is, and there is calculations in the background running that we cant see. I dont think the math is as cut and dry as we think it is.

I think it's a load-driven processing error. If I look at total deploy points and total control points scored in each of my faction's battles over the last two FLs, it's a pretty tight linear relationship, with the total deploy points = close to 2.75 x control points. However there are 2 clear outliers in very busy battles, where the relationship breaks down.

If I add in data from an additional few FLs prior to that there is more of a scatter and more outliers -- perhaps in the interim the server capacity has been beefed up.? Or alternatively they've removed any "invisible" node-level multiplier.

[andy2]

I think it's a load-driven processing error. If I look at total deploy points and total control points scored in each of my faction's battles over the last two FLs, it's a pretty tight linear relationship, with the total deploy points = close to 2.75 x control points. However there are 2 clear outliers in very busy battles, where the relationship breaks down.

If I add in data from an additional few FLs prior to that there is more of a scatter and more outliers -- perhaps in the interim the server capacity has been beefed up.? Or alternatively they've removed any "invisible" node-level multiplier.

This is exactly my thoughts, and why I feel it is a glitch and gree owes us points. My assumption is that too many deploys were being sent to the server at once and the points were counted on are score but never 'made it' to the node. Ultimately in these battles I am saying an error was made there are way less than the normal ratio of deploy points to control points - AKA our deploy points counted, but not as control points. So if the points were accrued correctly we would have won the node if Gree did not screw up. This is a huge error and needs to be fixed.

[Ozymandias]

This is exactly my thoughts, and why I feel it is a glitch and gree owes us points. My assumption is that too many deploys were being sent to the server at once and the points were counted on are score but never 'made it' to the node. Ultimately in these battles I am saying an error was made there are way less than the normal ratio of deploy points to control points - AKA our deploy points counted, but not as control points. So if the points were accrued correctly we would have won the node if Gree did not screw up. This is a huge error and needs to be fixed.

The 2 outliers i have work both ways... one with too many total control points, and one with too few control points. I'll bung a couple of charts up tomorrow if I have time.

[andy2]

The 2 outliers i have work both ways... one with too many total control points, and one with too few control points. I'll bung a couple of charts up tomorrow if I have time.

All of the examples I have there have been too many deploy points for the amount of control points rewarded... just further pointing me towards my thought that we are deploying troops and the server can not keep up with them and is not counting all of our deploys on the node.

[Ozymandias]

All of the examples I have there have been too many deploy points for the amount of control points rewarded... just further pointing me towards my thought that we are deploying troops and the server can not keep up with them and is not counting all of our deploys on the node.

It's possible that overawarding of points may not leap out as mucH!

[Bravo Zulu]

The only way you are making sense is if each of the teams has deploy points on ONLY ONE node. If team 1 scores 300k deploy points on one node and team 2 scores 270k on a separate node then highest deploy points are highest control points. However, that is not usually the case. Generally team 1 deploys over several nodes as does team 2.

If you lose a node your team still gets your own deploy points. If you win a node, you get your teams deploy points PLUS the points deployed by the other team (s). Thus your teams points plus that deployed by other team = control points.

What you are missing is that BOTH TEAMS get the deploy points that are calculated into control points. The deploy points don't get subtracted from the team who lost the node.

Team 1 deploys 300k. Team 2 deploys 270k. Say over two nodes. But team 1 tried to steal (or had players who couldn't follow directions) a node and deployed 20k on the node team 2 eventually won. Team 1 still gets 300k deploy points but only 280 count for control points. Team 2 gets 270k deploy points but 290 count for control points. Thus team 2 is winning the war with fewer deploys.

See?

[Ozymandias]

The only way you are making sense is if each of the teams has deploy points on ONLY ONE node. If team 1 scores 300k deploy points on one node and team 2 scores 270k on a separate node then highest deploy points are highest control points. However, that is not usually the case. Generally team 1 deploys over several nodes as does team 2.

If you lose a node your team still gets your own deploy points. If you win a node, you get your teams deploy points PLUS the points deployed by the other team (s). Thus your teams points plus that deployed by other team = control points.

What you are missing is that BOTH TEAMS get the deploy points that are calculated into control points. The deploy points don't get subtracted from the team who lost the node.

Team 1 deploys 300k. Team 2 deploys 270k. Say over two nodes. But team 1 tried to steal (or had players who couldn't follow directions) a node and deployed 20k on the node team 2 eventually won. Team 1 still gets 300k deploy points but only 280 count for control points. Team 2 gets 270k deploy points but 290 count for control points. Thus team 2 is winning the war with fewer deploys.

See?

Well that misses out the deploy multiplier, but nonetheless, the original scenario had 1 team deploying more, but not winning a single node. Your scenario has two teams each winning a node each, but the team deploying less winning overall... completely different scenario, and obviously feasible.

[andy2]

Well that misses out the deploy multiplier, but nonetheless, the original scenario had 1 team deploying more, but not winning a single node. Your scenario has two teams each winning a node each, but the team deploying less winning overall... completely different scenario, and obviously feasible.

Yes that is not the scenario I described at all.

[Loser]

7336

Does this look like what you're talking about?

[andy2]

7336

Does this look like what you're talking about?

Exactly, if Team in 2nd place had more deploy points, how is it physically possible for team in 1st to have won every single node? I have many like that as well.

[Tony81]

Exactly, if Team in 2nd place had more deploy points, how is it physically possible for team in 1st to have won every single node? I have many like that as well.

The fact is it's not possible. Many argue the fact and it just makes me think less of their intelligence. Lol. Math doesn't lie.

[andy2]

The fact is it's not possible. Many argue the fact and it just makes me think less of their intelligence. Lol. Math doesn't lie.

Thats why I created the thread my friend. I see it all too often, and it usually hurts my team a couple times per event. I want to stop wasting gold, and think we deserve to be refunded for these fights where we lost but should have won according to the math.

[Ozymandias]

Exactly, if Team in 2nd place had more deploy points, how is it physically possible for team in 1st to have won every single node? I have many like that as well.

Theres 200m of control points missing from that pic

[Bravo Zulu]

Yes that is not the scenario I described at all.

Yeah- it could be. In the pic did you guys notice team 3? How many points they scored? Those points obviously went to the winning team. Remember in my post how I said whoever controls the node in the end wins those deploy points as controls points? And the splash screen still shows team 3 with their own deploy points because both them and the winner of the node get them. They don't show as deploy points under the winner- just as control. If you add team 3s points to the winners, they won with control points.

Control points are how you win in frontline. Not deploys. If it were just deploys there would be no such thing as control points.

But go ahead and keep fighting it. You will keep losing not because Gree rigged it- but because you fail to understand and strategize.

[andy2]

Yeah- it could be. In the pic did you guys notice team 3? How many points they scored? Those points obviously went to the winning team. Remember in my post how I said whoever controls the node in the end wins those deploy points as controls points? And the splash screen still shows team 3 with their own deploy points because both them and the winner of the node get them. They don't show as deploy points under the winner- just as control. If you add team 3s points to the winners, they won with control points. Ozy is correct, if you add up all of the deploy points and calculate how many control points should have been generated on all of the nodes combined that picture is roughly 150m+ short.

Control points are how you win in frontline. Not deploys. If it were just deploys there would be no such thing as control points.

But go ahead and keep fighting it. You will keep losing not because Gree rigged it- but because you fail to understand and strategize.

Oh lord, I get how deploy points and control points work. The point is that you get the control points by having more deploy points on a node than any other team. And if team2 has more total deploy points in total, how can team1 have had more deploy points on every single node - needed in order to win all of the control points? It isn't possible. Also Ozy is correct, if you calculate how many control points should be awarded, based on the number of deploy points there is at least 150m points missing.

Lastly, just so you are clear... I am not arguing that based on the points awarded in that screenshot that the team that won should not have. I am arguing that they should not have won all of the control points, because based on the deploy point totals they could not have won every single node.

[Ozymandias]

Ok, so as promised, here’s some data from 48 battles over the last 2 frontlines… our faction has kept track of FL battle results for most of this year.

http://i61.tinypic.com/nb6nuh.jpg

The data shows the total deploy and control points earned by all 3 teams combined in each battle. The majority of the battles are on the straight line, which has a gradient (ignoring the outliers) of pretty close to 36% or 1/2.75, where 2.75 is the max deploy multiplier. In any one decent sized battle the total number of control points available should be equal to 36% the total deploy points. 36% of deploy points incidentally is the control points you can earn if you deploy on one node, completely unopposed.

However, there a clear outlier (plus a few others just off the line, particularly in bigger battles). This is the battle result of the outlier… the last battle of the war, where the main node was continually changing hands up to the last moment.

http://i62.tinypic.com/34eb6ok.jpg


1.3b deploy points are scored, but only 400m control points are earned (30%), so we seem to be missing roughly 80m points.

As I say, the battle was very close one until the end, as well as being the last battle of the event, … so it might be the case that deploy points don’t necessarily calculate correctly when servers are under-strain, perhaps particularly if nodes are changing hands in the last few seconds.

Now one alternative explanation would be that the relationship isn’t meant to be a linear one, and that there is an extra hidden deploy multiplier that kicks in at higher deploy levels (as suggested in the FAQ), increasing the deploy points scored for a given number of deploys and control points. However if we look at points per deploy scored across all the battles….

http://i62.tinypic.com/ajw4cx.jpg

… we see that control points per deploy are lower in bigger battles… falling below 10k, whereas deploy points remain pretty constant at 27,500 per deploy…. So again this would seem to suggest that control points are getting lost in bigger battles.

Finally, if I expand the dataset to include a few more wars, we see more of a scatter, with more battles below the line… which at least does at least seem to suggest it used to be more of an issue than it is today.

http://i59.tinypic.com/fcuy5x.jpg


However, it would seem that there still is a problem with under-recording of control points in the very biggest battles, with obviously big impacts on the points scored by the factions affected. Unless anyone has an alternative interpretation?

Ps, yesterday I thought that I had some battles where too many deploy points were awarded, however after double checking the data, this doesn’t seem to be the case

[andy2]

Ozy, thank you very much, it is great to actually have some data to support my hypothesis. I have long thought that these deploys are getting lost in the servers and not counting as control points on the node, your analysis pretty much helps to prove this.

This really does need Gree attention ASAP. I don't get how other issues get answered and this one keeps getting passed over. This affected our team multiple times last war and cost us multiple big wars. We were out deploying the opposing team, yet all of their deploys were counting on the node, and ours werent. In the end they took control of all nodes, while we had a higher deploy point total... not possible. Gree, we have plenty of evidence to support this... please do something about it.

[SGT Rud]

Well that misses out the deploy multiplier, but nonetheless, the original scenario had 1 team deploying more, but not winning a single node. Your scenario has two teams each winning a node each, but the team deploying less winning overall... completely different scenario, and obviously feasible.
The deploy multiplier on a node is something not seen. Something behind the scenes. The 2.75 deploy multiplier in the bottom left of your screen has nothing to do with what is happening on a node.

Control points are nothing more than a total of points added together for the points on the nodes you control. On the final flash screen, you cannot see what was deployed on a node, only the points you deployed out, and the control points. What goes on a node is different from what you deploy in the bottom left of the screen.

A gunner is 10000. A gunner in bottom left at 2.75 bonus is 27500. A gunner on a node with 2.75 is 10000. the 2.75 doesnt go on a node. The modifier of up to 5x depending on what the other team deploys as well, is not shown on any persons screen in FL. It is hidden. And my guess would be that it is designed to benefit the team that already holds the node. I am also going to assume that the nodes initial points also goes into the hidden modifier. The Command Center is worth 1000, so your first deploy of a gunner isnt 10000, its 11000, but only on that node, and the 1000 points isnt added to your deploy points on bottom left either. Possibly later in the node battle that 1000 points comes into play with the 5x modifier in some way.

[Ozymandias]

The deploy multiplier on a node is something not seen. Something behind the scenes. The 2.75 deploy multiplier in the bottom left of your screen has nothing to do with what is happening on a node.

Control points are nothing more than a total of points added together for the points on the nodes you control. On the final flash screen, you cannot see what was deployed on a node, only the points you deployed out, and the control points. What goes on a node is different from what you deploy in the bottom left of the screen.

A gunner is 10000. A gunner in bottom left at 2.75 bonus is 27500. A gunner on a node with 2.75 is 10000. the 2.75 doesnt go on a node. The modifier of up to 5x depending on what the other team deploys as well, is not shown on any persons screen in FL. It is hidden. And my guess would be that it is designed to benefit the team that already holds the node. I am also going to assume that the nodes initial points also goes into the hidden modifier. The Command Center is worth 1000, so your first deploy of a gunner isnt 10000, its 11000, but only on that node, and the 1000 points isnt added to your deploy points on bottom left either. Possibly later in the node battle that 1000 points comes into play with the 5x modifier in some way.

There's no evidence of any hidden node level multiplier... Max deploy points per deploy is 27.5k, max control points per deploy is 10k.

[SGT Rud]

http://i62.tinypic.com/34eb6ok.jpg


20691 + 18102 + 10628 = 49421 total deploys You take your total deploys and and add up the unit strengths of all the deploys, and you will equal the total control points at the end. Problem is you cant tell if the deploy was a gunner or a tank or a boat.

[SGT Rud]

There's no evidence of any hidden node level multiplier... Max deploy points per deploy is 27.5k, max control points per deploy is 10k.
Your deploy points do not do onto the node, so once max 2.75 is reached, its still only 10000 going onto the node. So, Gree says there is up to a 5x bonus on the node which is adjusted by the other teams deploys, but there isnt a hidden multiplier? That 5x you cant see. 2.75 for deploy bonus (which isnt on the node itself) isnt 5x anything.

[Ozymandias]

20691 + 18102 + 10628 = 49421 total deploys You take your total deploys and and add up the unit strengths of all the deploys, and you will equal the total control points at the end. Problem is you cant tell if the deploy was a gunner or a tank or a boat.

Yep and in a large battle the control points should equal 1/2.75 of deploy = 36%. As I've shown, they are sometimes less. I don't need to know what units are used, just the ratio between them.

[Ozymandias]

Your deploy points do not do onto the node, so once max 2.75 is reached, its still only 10000 going onto the node. So, Gree says there is up to a 5x bonus on the node which is adjusted by the other teams deploys, but there isnt a hidden multiplier? That 5x you cant see. 2.75 for deploy bonus (which isnt on the node itself) isnt 5x anything.

Yes I understand that. If for every 10k that goes into the node, a max of 27.5k goes into the overall deploy points, where does this hidden bonus show up in the score?

The FAQs are riddled with errors, so i wouldn't take what gree say as gospel

[andy2]

The 5x hidden bonus you speak of us non existent. Most of the wars come out where (assuming all 10k ships are deployed) Deploy Points = Deploys * 10,000 * 2.75 (less a little bit for the lower multipliers at the bottom) and Control Points = Deploys * 10,000. The math adds up 95% of the time.

It is these 'glitched' battles where there are hundreds or thousands of deploys being sent to the server at once that there begin to be missing control points. As evidenced by 1) The screenshots posted here and I have more, of teams winning all nodes with fewer deploy points than other teams 2) Ozy posting his graphs of the control point ratio going down the more deploy points in a war (more strain on the servers). And tons more of other proof.

[Annihilator2]

Max deploy points are from gold ship: 12k. So max control points per deploy is 12k.

[Ozymandias]

Max deploy points are from gold ship: 12k. So max control points per deploy is 12k.

Max average observed is 10k.

[Annihilator2]

Max average observed is 10k.

What idiot buy these ships with gold in such case?

[Ozymandias]

What idiot buy these ships with gold in such case?

I doubt if anyone buys ships, unless by accident.

[andy2]

anyone from gree care to respond here? my factions tickets sent in during FL still remain completely unanswered as well.... Has all support vanished?

[andy2]

a week after my original ticket i finally got a response saying they are sorry for the delay and that the points got screwed up, and they will pass it over to the developers to fix... no try to fix the problem or provide any compensation even though they pretty much agree they that cheated us out of hundreds of millions of points??? Are you kidding me? And nobody from gree even cares enough to respond here.

[sstuutss]

And nobody from gree even cares enough to respond here.
You got it. Get used to it. They seem to be using the 'lalallalalala I can't hear you' defence a lot lately. Seems to work well enough,

[Loser]

Doesn't make sense on paper, but when you see it happen in real-time it makes perfect sense


At least to me.


And my vision is 20/16

[andy2]

so how many other issues will get 'looked into' before this one?

[andy2]

a week after my original ticket i finally got a response saying they are sorry for the delay and that the points got screwed up, and they will pass it over to the developers to fix... no try to fix the problem or provide any compensation even though they pretty much agree they that cheated us out of hundreds of millions of points??? Are you kidding me? And nobody from gree even cares enough to respond here.

And now I get a survey... bad idea gree.

[andy2]

keeping this on the front page, i know there are a lot of other issues now, but it is ridiculous you wont answer this.

[Ozymandias]

Particularly as other issues are at least getting acknowledged

[andy2]

Particularly as other issues are at least getting acknowledged

Right? I guess a major flaw in one of their top 2 money making events isnt worth responding to a ticket or forum post...

[andy2]

any word here gree?

[sstuutss]

Do I get a prize for guessing the answer you would get?

[andy2]

Yes you get the prize of being ignored by Gree. Don't feel too special though, many people win.

[Relic]

... To have more deploy points in FL than another team... yet have that other team win every single node?

Gree this has happened to us many times, it seems as if our deploys are not counting on the node we are deploying them to and we are getting cheated out of hundreds of millions of points... that we spent money on. Am I missing anything here? This is not mathematically possible based upon how Gree has told us the game works. My entire team has sent in tickets to gree and we receive either no response or something completely unrelated. Where is the support? How is this possible?


To be perfectly clear I am talking about an example like this

Scores


Team
Deploy Points
Control Points


1
300,000,000
0


2
270,000,000
200,000,000


3
0
0



How can the team who deployed 300m not win a single node? Gree staff... I have plenty of pics if you want to actually explain how any of this is mathmatically possible.

I'm inquiring about this for you. When I get an answer I'll let you know.

[andy2]

Any update yet?

[major willy]

All I can say is that it's a game and the goal of gree is money. You all act like this is a living. I love reading all the complaints and lmao.

[andy2]

Anything yet?

[andy2]

anything yet?

[t12pm]

All I can say is that it's a game and the goal of gree is money. You all act like this is a living. I love reading all the complaints and lmao.

This is the best and most logical post here. The answer would be for you to buy more gold lmao

[andy2]

I know the answer.... but how about now?

[Mikelord]

I'm still waiting for them to fix the IOS issue of the base decorations, to view on rivals lists and an easier way to build walls with concrete lol

[Tony81]

I'm inquiring about this for you. When I get an answer I'll let you know.

I had this happen to my faction a few months ago too and my tickets get (pardon my language) stupid responses. Gree CS ends up looking like a bunch of monkeys when they ignore legitimate questions and assume the senders are idiots. This is a real problem. And let me spell it out for most guys on the forum and Gree engineers that don't understand the problem, it actually IS mathematically impossible. Last I checked, your game is supposed to be based on numbers so if you can't explain it, you are saying the game is broken with your silence.

We await your rebuttal...

[pelle plutt]

its easy, its not possible in reality, but in gree land anything goes

we chased GREE for ever during the fall when this happened during a multi bn match between PEPA and Birds, the final answer we got was that deploys during final seconds (not clear how many) may at times not get recorded because they are still being processed when the final win/lose decision is made

[Tony81]

its easy, its not possible in reality, but in gree land anything goes

we chased GREE for ever during the fall when this happened during a multi bn match between PEPA and Birds, the final answer we got was that deploys during final seconds (not clear how many) may at times not get recorded because they are still being processed when the final win/lose decision is made

Yes I can believe that, and kind of figured so... so how about we fix that? Maybe a 60:00:05 battle and last 5 seconds it updates the nodes with pending deploys and doesn't allow more deploys? I don't know. Do something!

[andy2]

This glitch is bigger than deploys not counting during the last seconds of a battle. Although I can see how that is easily an issue. I have been a part of many big wars where with 5 minutes left in the war we would show as having more faction deploy points than each of the other teams, yet one of the other teams would have 'control' of ALL nodes. Not mathematically possible and not because of last second 'pending' deploys. The deploys counted, just not towards the node. For the entire last 5 minutes our lead in deploy points could increase - and our deficit on the node would actually also increase. Again, not possible.

I have been contacted by the lead developer who says that they are 'working' on a fix, yet gives no actual updates and it has been weeks if not months since I have initially sent in my first tickets. Customer service has not done one thing to make this right for my team, or any of the others who may have faced the issue. I know this is not surprising, and I dont need anybody telling me that, but I refuse to let them get away with this as much as I can help it.

[andy2]

how about now?

[Stellaman]

Yes I still have the awnser��

[andy2]

how many more events go by before we get an answer?

[andy2]

For any of you who still care about this sinking ship...

This thread is over a month old. Instead of discussing it here, in open forums for all to see, I have had PMs with the 'lead FL developer' Waffleking. I sent him screenshots, and offered more of how this issue has cost my team a large amount of wasted gold and a direct loss of points in FL battles.

He has 1) Admitted that it is an issue. 2) Admitted that FL deploys did not count in certain scenarios. 3)Taken over a month, more than 2 if you count from the time we first submitted tickets to 'research' the issue, before just today when I threaten further action miraculously saying his team has found the issue and fixed it... except wait, they will not deploy it for this FL and will instead CONTINUE TO RUN ANOTHER KNOWINGLY BUGGED EVENT - WITHOUT A WORD ABOUT IT TO THE PUBLIC IN GAME OR OTHERWISE. 4) Refuses to offer any simple token of compensation for the direct proof my faction has of getting screwed in multiple FL battles due to their faulty programming.

This is flat out unacceptable. I know there are larger current issues with the game. The fact of the matter is paying members are retiring at an alarming rate, and these awful business practices are a large reason why. You admit to a problem, admit that it has caused us money, and then give us the digital middle finger.

FYI here is the most recent response I have talking about a fix, and that they are running the bugged event regardless:

Hello Andy

I am happy to report that we have figured out the issue! It is in test as we speak and will be addressed in all upcoming FL and SA events. We really appreciate your help in solving this problem and you should now not see lost deploys at the end of a war. We were unable to get it into Daiko Mountains event because we have not had enough time to fully test and work out all the bugs the fix created but it will be fixed in events moving forward.

[Danger Mouse]

Why anyone spends a dime on this game is beyond me. Players need to screen shot this post for use in claiming their refund and complaint to Apple/Google about Gree fraudulently selling gold for use in a known bugged event.

[J-manKometh96]

Why anyone spends a dime on this game is beyond me. Players need to screen shot this post for use in claiming their refund and complaint to Apple/Google about Gree fraudulently selling gold for use in a known bugged event.
Which means it will shortly vanish from existence.

[andy2]

Which means it will shortly vanish from existence.

I have screenshots of their dev admitting to issues, admitting to running bugged events knowingly, and refusing to offer compensation for the direct proof we handed them about getting screwed. Won't let it go away.

[fatbodychris]

Glad you kept up the good fight for everyone. I know I sent you a message when this thread started with the same problem you had. It sucks to now know that they continued with front line knowing it has been faulty from the get go.

[Ozymandias]

At least it's acknowledged and a fix is in progress... Great job on keeping pushing it Andy. Looks like alliance def is also finally fixed.

[J-manKometh96]

Now, about those new boost buildings.....

[groovy shags]

I have screenshots of their dev admitting to issues, admitting to running bugged events knowingly, and refusing to offer compensation for the direct proof we handed them about getting screwed. Won't let it go away.


Nice work Andy! You are certainly on them for answers! I wonder why WaffleKing will not comment in here on this. He said he is in charge of FrontLine correct? These gree guys are about as transparent as Obama or Hillary Clinton!


Keep up the fight Andy! We will follow you into battle!

[NO_BS]

Got to admit have also encounter those what I consider as Deployment lag issues. Frequency of occurrence have gone up especially last 3 events including current. Can no longer use any 30s strategies effectively.

[WBS]

Keep the fight going andy2! We all need to keep pushing the issues. I hate to say it but this game is all but sunk, but if there is any hope it will only be because us players keep hounding. Gree will not do anything about it otherwise and the devs will continue to sink the ship.

[Brown Out]

Don't really see a problem here. When you watch it happen in real time it makes sense...at least to me it does.

Please don't hate on me for disagreeing.

[CC1]

Unfortunately, I don't think Gree gives a rat's ***nose*** about nurturing or legitimately growing the game. Their business model is to squeeze every last penny out of players until it's time to shut down the game. Then they'll start another and repeat the cycle. They've alread said publicly in these forums they're surprised the game lasted this long. Now they're just going to test how much they can ravage the player base before they move on like a hoard of locusts.


http://youtu.be/FwI0u9L4R8U

[Brown Out]

If a team deployed beaucoup Carries, they basically could have less deploys than you, but still win in deploy points.

Maybe I'm missing something here.

[J-manKometh96]

I think you are. It wasn't about one team having more deploys than another and losing, but controlling all nodes and somehow having less points.

[Brown Out]

Sorry, but I still don't see the problem here.

Hopefully this gets worked out, because I'm tired of seeing this non-issue continuously being bumped.

[Ozymandias]

Sorry, but I still don't see the problem here.

Hopefully this gets worked out, because I'm tired of seeing this non-issue continuously being bumped.

One team deploys more points, but doesn't win a node. Not possible. And battles where control points go missing given the deploys made

[Flexter]

We have the same problem here we deploy 227mill deploys on cc only the other team deployed 218 millon all 5 nods and they win all 5 nods the total score we have is bigger than there total and we only deploy on one nod so pleas explane that relic

[andy2]

Sorry, but I still don't see the problem here.

Hopefully this gets worked out, because I'm tired of seeing this non-issue continuously being bumped.

Just because you can't comprehend this issue, which is clearly stated and understand by most of the people posting here does not mean it is a non-issue. In fact if you would have read my most recent post you would understand, that the FL developer at gree has actually admitted to this being an issue, that they continue to run events without a fix and have done nothing about it.